Say Goodbye to Both Boldin and Dockett

[Crazy Canuck]

Norwood has on 202 carries 1,243 yards which averages out to 6.2 yards per carry & 3 touchdowns. Show me a back in the league that averages 6.2 ypc.

Dockett was good the first half the season & then disappeared in the second. Mind you he made the pro-bowl due to other DL not able to make the trip. If you are satisified with Dockett & his eight sacks as being the best thing since sliced bread, then you have grown to love average. Plus on top of everything else, Mr. eight sacks is going to hold out unless he gets a new contract. That is after signing a new deal last season. So as far as I am concerned Mr. Eight Sacks and his agent can go to atlanta. We can get a 6.2 ypc on our team. If Norwood was on team & he works out then I say signed the guy to a better deal. It is about Production to Salary my friend. Dockett production doesn't justify a new contract. You must have forgotten that the Cardinals drafted Mr. Eight Sacks in the 3rd. Here is another history lesson for you. Micheal Straham was taken in the second round. So you can get a great player in the 2nd round.

Well, seeing that you're into history lessons.

Dockett was considered first round talent who dropped to the third round because of an on-field incident in College.

The Cards are the only team last season who scored over 400 points, and didn't make the playoffs. Given that the Seahawks gave up 100 less on "D", I think that I'll stick with Mr. *8* sacks... and you can keep your speed back.

 

[Russ Smith]

Norwood has on 202 carries 1,243 yards which averages out to 6.2 yards per carry & 3 touchdowns. Show me a back in the league that averages 6.2 ypc.

Dockett was good the first half the season & then disappeared in the second. Mind you he made the pro-bowl due to other DL not able to make the trip. If you are satisified with Dockett & his eight sacks as being the best thing since sliced bread, then you have grown to love average. Plus on top of everything else, Mr. eight sacks is going to hold out unless he gets a new contract. That is after signing a new deal last season. So as far as I am concerned Mr. Eight Sacks and his agent can go to atlanta. We can get a 6.2 ypc on our team. If Norwood was on team & he works out then I say signed the guy to a better deal. It is about Production to Salary my friend. Dockett production doesn't justify a new contract. You must have forgotten that the Cardinals drafted Mr. Eight Sacks in the 3rd. Here is another history lesson for you. Micheal Straham was taken in the second round. So you can get a great player in the 2nd round.

Norwood is a homerun threat for sure.

 

[DaisyCutter]

Norwood has on 202 carries 1,243 yards which averages out to 6.2 yards per carry & 3 touchdowns. Show me a back in the league that averages 6.2 ypc.

All right, but that's his career average. He's never had more than 100 carries in a season, and those were mostly against defenses that were worn down by Warrick Dunn (and his rookie year, Michael Vick as well). Michael Turner had similar stats 2 years ago (80 att, 502 yds, 6.3 ypc, 2 TDs) playing behind Ladanion Tomlinson, but he hasn't shown to be the man as a starter, either.

My argument, again, isn't that Norwood isn't good, but I don't think he's a unique talent, and I don't think the Cards want/need a "speed back"/"home run threat" as much as many here seem to think. How many "home run" backs did the Cards not like enough to draft? 3? 4? More?

The other question, which you continue to ignore, is how much of an impact you really believe that a 100-carry back is really going to make? The Cards already had one of the top offenses in the NFL last season. Is the addition or Norwood going to make that much of a difference? Enough to offset a much larger decline on the defensive side of the ball?

 

[lobo]

Norwood has on 202 carries 1,243 yards which averages out to 6.2 yards per carry & 3 touchdowns. Show me a back in the league that averages 6.2 ypc.

So you can get a great player in the 2nd round.

Nice lines. O V E R R A T E D

I say the team should pack him up if he is going to be a pain. He is free black and 21 and did not have to sign the deal he did. Better luck next time. Even Chad Johnson figured out there is not place like home and he is far more the player at his position that DD is on our line.

 

[Ed Burmila]

I am unsure why the board community rewarded this guy for posting baseless nonsense that he made up (Sorry, I mean he heard it from "His Sources") by taking it seriously and giving it 11 pages of discussion.

This is totally ridiculous. You're sitting here arguing about Jerrious Norwood based on something he probably posted drunk. Here's a new rumor: Cardinals are going to trade Edgerrin James for the sasquatch. Discuss the relative merits of the sasquatch for 11 pages, it couldn't be any more of a waste of time.

 

[jefftheshark]

Here's a new rumor: Cardinals are going to trade Edgerrin James for the sasquatch.

JTS

 

[vinnymac]

All right, but that's his career average. He's never had more than 100 carries in a season, and those were mostly against defenses that were worn down by Warrick Dunn (and his rookie year, Michael Vick as well). Michael Turner had similar stats 2 years ago (80 att, 502 yds, 6.3 ypc, 2 TDs) playing behind Ladanion Tomlinson, but he hasn't shown to be the man as a starter, either.

My argument, again, isn't that Norwood isn't good, but I don't think he's a unique talent, and I don't think the Cards want/need a "speed back"/"home run threat" as much as many here seem to think. How many "home run" backs did the Cards not like enough to draft? 3? 4? More?

The other question, which you continue to ignore, is how much of an impact you really believe that a 100-carry back is really going to make? The Cards already had one of the top offenses in the NFL last season. Is the addition or Norwood going to make that much of a difference? Enough to offset a much larger decline on the defensive side of the ball?

The Cardinals were ranked 27th in scoring defense with Dockett. How much of a difference will it make without him? The point that some of you are missing is Dockett is planning to hold out after signing a new deal last season. He is not going to be in training camp. That means the Cardinals are going to have to replace him anyway. You might as well get something out of him.

Norwood would make the Cardinals Offense #1 or #2 in the league. A running game is what Whisenhunt wants. Ask yourself how much of a difference has Willie Parker made with the Steelers when they went to the Super-Bowl. He made a lot of difference. James & Norwood would make a great RB tandom. A real offense would make this team click.

 

[vinnymac]

Well, seeing that you're into history lessons.

Dockett was considered first round talent who dropped to the third round because of an on-field incident in College.

The Cards are the only team last season who scored over 400 points, and didn't make the playoffs. Given that the Seahawks gave up 100 less on "D", I think that I'll stick with Mr. *8* sacks... and you can keep your speed back.

I knew someone would bring this up. First round talent that went in the 3rd. You hear that in the draft every draft. This player is considered a top notch player, but shucks he was drafted in the 3rd or 4th round. He was drafted in the 3rd round. End of story. He was considered a player who took plays off. let see 1 sack in the last eight games. That qualifies as taking a half of a season off. Dockett wants to be paid like the big boys. The Big Boys bring it all season long. Not just half a season.

 

[Stout]

I am unsure why the board community rewarded this guy for posting baseless nonsense that he made up (Sorry, I mean he heard it from "His Sources") by taking it seriously and giving it 11 pages of discussion.

This is totally ridiculous. You're sitting here arguing about Jerrious Norwood based on something he probably posted drunk. Here's a new rumor: Cardinals are going to trade Edgerrin James for the sasquatch. Discuss the relative merits of the sasquatch for 11 pages, it couldn't be any more of a waste of time.

Wait a second...MY nickname is Sasquatch! Wooo Hooo!!! I'm getting traded to the Cards, baby!!!

 

[RedRob]

I've seen you; that nickname is dead on.

 

[CardLogic]

Here's a new rumor: Cardinals are going to trade Edgerrin James for the sasquatch.

I hear that he has got a lot of raw potential but his technique is going to need some serious coaching up!

So, are the Cards expecting "Sas" be James replacement at RB or do they see him as more of a line clogging/space eating DT?

 

[Crazy Canuck]

The Cardinals were ranked 27th in scoring defense with Dockett. How much of a difference will it make without him? The point that some of you are missing is Dockett is planning to hold out after signing a new deal last season. He is not going to be in training camp. That means the Cardinals are going to have to replace him anyway. You might as well get something out of him.

Norwood would make the Cardinals Offense #1 or #2 in the league. A running game is what Whisenhunt wants. Ask yourself how much of a difference has Willie Parker made with the Steelers when they went to the Super-Bowl. He made a lot of difference. James & Norwood would make a great RB tandom. A real offense would make this team click.

SOURCE????

 

[CardinalChris]

I knew someone would bring this up. First round talent that went in the 3rd. You hear that in the draft every draft. This player is considered a top notch player, but shucks he was drafted in the 3rd or 4th round. He was drafted in the 3rd round. End of story. He was considered a player who took plays off. let see 1 sack in the last eight games. That qualifies as taking a half of a season off. Dockett wants to be paid like the big boys. The Big Boys bring it all season long. Not just half a season.

You are absolutley correct on his draft position. But, you still haven't addressed the issues of WHY production dropped. I never saw him taking plays off, he just got too much attention when Berry went down. Your inferrence is that since he had 1 sack he must have stopped trying. By that logic players who just try hard get sacks, so Joe Tafoya is an All-pro who should get 20 sacks because he really really tries. Who is better on that D-line than him, how he made the pro bowl when Fitz was the only other one on the team to, how he led the NFL DTs in sacks, etc. Those are the issues I'd like discuss.

 

[vinnymac]

You are absolutley correct on his draft position. But, you still haven't addressed the issues of WHY production dropped. I never saw him taking plays off, he just got too much attention when Berry went down. Your inferrence is that since he had 1 sack he must have stopped trying. By that logic players who just try hard get sacks, so Joe Tafoya is an All-pro who should get 20 sacks because he really really tries. Who is better on that D-line than him, how he made the pro bowl when Fitz was the only other one on the team to, how he led the NFL DTs in sacks, etc. Those are the issues I'd like discuss.

First of all I need to make a correction. Dockett is Mr. 9 sacks. My thing with Dockett is he wants to be paid like a great DT. He is not Great. A great players find ways to produce the whole season. Not just one half of the season. To me Dockett is a Jake Plummer. He can make you cheer & cry at the same time. He shows flashes of greatness then turns average. Last season Dockett started to have a great season. He just fell short.

He was a probowl alternative. Which means the players a head of him couldn't make the trip. You are right he is a pro-bowl player.


Since Tafoya tries hard he should get 20 sacks is your assumption. Not mine. Put words in your own mouth not mine.

All I stated in my oringinal post is that I would trade Dockett for Norwood & a 3rd round pick. You can get good players in the 3rd round as well. That is a no brainer to me. Who would take his place is the question. Since Dockett is considered to be a DT by most of you. I would say Watson or Branch would replace him.

 

[RugbyMuffin]

I am unsure why the board community rewarded this guy for posting baseless nonsense that he made up (Sorry, I mean he heard it from "His Sources") by taking it seriously and giving it 11 pages of discussion.

This is totally ridiculous. You're sitting here arguing about Jerrious Norwood based on something he probably posted drunk. Here's a new rumor: Cardinals are going to trade Edgerrin James for the sasquatch. Discuss the relative merits of the sasquatch for 11 pages, it couldn't be any more of a waste of time.

If it is such a waste of time then don't waste your time with a post about it.

We are enjoying talking about this nonsense, even if it is just that.

It is not like there is much to talk about.

 

[joeshmo]

he just got too much attention when Berry went down.

That is exactly why I think Dockett is slightly overrated. Good to great players are still productive when they become the focus. Dockett is only productive when someone else is getting the attention. That does not equal Tommie Harris money or a new contract in year 2 of a 5 year deal.

 

[CardinalChris]

That is exactly why I think Dockett is slightly overrated. Good to great players are still productive when they become the focus. Dockett is only productive when someone else is getting the attention. That does not equal Tommie Harris money or a new contract in year 2 of a 5 year deal.

I think great players do that. Above average player (which is right where Dockett falls IMO) and average players disappear. Name a D-Lineman who do it consistanlty with NOBODY else as a threat near the line of scrimmage. There are too many blockers who can be rolled to one talented defender in the front 7. And no, he isn't Tommie Harris and doesn't desevre his coin.

 

[RugbyMuffin]

That is exactly why I think Dockett is slightly overrated. Good to great players are still productive when they become the focus. Dockett is only productive when someone else is getting the attention. That does not equal Tommie Harris money or a new contract in year 2 of a 5 year deal.

Let's not give Tommie Harris TOO much credit. He DEFINATELY has some help on his defensive line between Alex Brown, Anderson, and Ogualelelsyewayse

 

[lobo]

The Cardinals were ranked 27th in scoring defense with Dockett. How much of a difference will it make without him?


well stated...non emotional good supporting facts. since when has dd become big daddy lipscome. get over it kids if he walks (which he won't by the way, nor can he unless he retires) not the end of the world. there is a lot of depth including the rooks coming in...and the difference between a good rook and dd ain't all that much. as stated, we were 27th last year...a whole lot closer to the bottom than the top.

 

[Crazy Canuck]

Let's not give Tommie Harris TOO much credit. He DEFINATELY has some help on his defensive line between Alex Brown, Anderson, and Ogualelelsyewayse

DEFINITELY, agree!

 

[CardinalChris]

The Cardinals were ranked 27th in scoring defense with Dockett. How much of a difference will it make without him?


well stated...non emotional good supporting facts. since when has dd become big daddy lipscome. get over it kids if he walks (which he won't by the way, nor can he unless he retires) not the end of the world. there is a lot of depth including the rooks coming in...and the difference between a good rook and dd ain't all that much. as stated, we were 27th last year...a whole lot closer to the bottom than the top.

No he isn't Lipscome, but again, you don't improve that 27th ranking by getting rid of your best D-Lineman. As for the rookies, it is WAY to early to think any of them can replace him. No, he isn't a world beater, but getting rid of him because his opinion of himself is inflates is a poor management decision and would hurt the team greatly. He is an above average DT . You just don't toss those guys away. He isn't as much of a distraction as everyone wants to make him out to be and will play this year under his current contract. So we get rid of him out of spite? That is irresponsible.

We are so used to crappy players that we forget that even very good players aren't perfect and have holes in their game.

 

[POISON]

Mitch's trade scenario's are HORRIBLE!!!!!! This has to be a gag.........

 

[vinnymac]

No he isn't Lipscome, but again, you don't improve that 27th ranking by getting rid of your best D-Lineman. As for the rookies, it is WAY to early to think any of them can replace him. No, he isn't a world beater, but getting rid of him because his opinion of himself is inflates is a poor management decision and would hurt the team greatly. He is an above average DT . You just don't toss those guys away. He isn't as much of a distraction as everyone wants to make him out to be and will play this year under his current contract. So we get rid of him out of spite? That is irresponsible.

We are so used to crappy players that we forget that even very good players aren't perfect and have holes in their game.

This is not getting rid out of spite. This is getting rid of a player that is ungreatful. The Cardinals gave this man a contract that pays more than what he was producing. Then this offseason, he demands more money. That in my book is being ungreatful. The Cardinals management is finally getting it right. They extend contracts to players that they think can help this team & this is what Dockett does. Shamefull imo.

 

[Crazy Canuck]

This is not getting rid out of spite. This is getting rid of a player that is ungreatful. The Cardinals gave this man a contract that pays more than what he was producing. Then this offseason, he demands more money. That in my book is being ungreatful. The Cardinals management is finally getting it right. They extend contracts to players that they think can help this team & this is what Dockett does. Shamefull imo.

Interesting new word. Guess it means "lacks greatness"...

Ungrateful
Shameful

 

[black]

Interesting new word. Guess it means "lacks greatness"...

Ungrateful
Shameful