Scouts take

[Cbus cardsfan]

I let it be known that my wife's friend is dating a scout for a certain AFC South team and i got his input on where McClain would get drafted. They finally came by the other night and i got to give him a hard time about RM going 8th instead of 18-22 like he had predicted. He said that pick surprised everyone,they had him much lower, and that he didn't fit the Raiders size/speed ratio they normally use. Then we got around to talking about the Cards draft. He really liked the Cards draft and said they got some very nice players. He specifically mentioned Williams, Roberts, Schofield(monster if he gets healthy), Skelton, and even Calvin. The interesting thing was that they were not high on Washington at all. He even said he'd be surprised if the Cards didn't have issues with him and that they lowered his grade because they thought he'd be "high maintenance". It's only one teams opinion and may not turn out to be the case but he was the only guy that he said anything negative about. Just thought i'd pass that on and it will be interesting to see if that turns out to be true. He didn't get into any specifics(i didn't ask) about why he thought that. Let's hope he's wrong on this as well.

 

[WarnerHOF]

When he says "high maintenance", is he talking about Washington's weight or attitude?

 

[Longcolts]

I think he was talking attitude? However the only high thing I've been able to find out about him suggests it to be his motor.

 

[Shane]

Well on that note:

http://blog.azcardinals.com/2010/05/09/washingtons-commencement/

It appears out new ILB is not only very athletic. It seems he has some brains as well. Actually graduating from college.

 

[joeshmo]

Well on that note:

http://blog.azcardinals.com/2010/05/09/washingtons-commencement/

It appears out new ILB is not only very athletic. It seems he has some brains as well. Actually graduating from college.

With a communications degree. Which in college athlete code means, "I took some bowling classes".

 

[CardLogic]

With a communications degree. Which in college athlete code means, "I took some bowling classes".

Or dance.

 

[john h]

I think he was talking attitude? However the only high thing I've been able to find out about him suggests it to be his motor.

Just listening to the guy he sure did not look or sound like a man with an attitude. He sounded like a guy who was really happy to be in the NFL and appreciated his opportunity. I would think attitude problems would have shown up in college and be known widely to all. There are some real bad a-- players in the NFL with attitudes that are all pros who I would not want living within a mile of me. Weight could be a problem with a man that large and as I recall Skelton may need to add some weight for his height. Matt has sort of the pro type build but lacks speed or good escape movement. He will make it or lose it on reading defenses, quick releases, and accuracy. I do not think he can sustain many hits on a regular basis. Will he stand in like Kurt and take the big hit just to get the ball off? I do not know and we will all know soon enough. You cannot simulate those big hits in practice and a QB in the NFL must be one tough guy.

 

[kerouac9]

I let it be known that my wife's friend is dating a scout for a certain AFC South team and i got his input on where McClain would get drafted. They finally came by the other night and i got to give him a hard time about RM going 8th instead of 18-22 like he had predicted. He said that pick surprised everyone,they had him much lower, and that he didn't fit the Raiders size/speed ratio they normally use. Then we got around to talking about the Cards draft. He really liked the Cards draft and said they got some very nice players. He specifically mentioned Williams, Roberts, Schofield(monster if he gets healthy), Skelton, and even Calvin. The interesting thing was that they were not high on Washington at all. He even said he'd be surprised if the Cards didn't have issues with him and that they lowered his grade because they thought he'd be "high maintenance". It's only one teams opinion and may not turn out to be the case but he was the only guy that he said anything negative about. Just thought i'd pass that on and it will be interesting to see if that turns out to be true. He didn't get into any specifics(i didn't ask) about why he thought that. Let's hope he's wrong on this as well.

The Cards are coming off a WILB who was high maintenance.

I'm a little surprised, though. Daryl Washington only started for one season at TCU, and I don't think he started in high school until his junior or senior season. I'm not sure where that sense of entitlement might come from.

I'm a little worried about Washington being an injury case. Those speed guys tend to feel like if they're not 100%, they can't play. We'll see.

 

[Monty]

The Cards are coming off a WILB who was high maintenance.

I'm a little surprised, though. Daryl Washington only started for one season at TCU, and I don't think he started in high school until his junior or senior season. I'm not sure where that sense of entitlement might come from.

I'm a little worried about Washington being an injury case. Those speed guys tend to feel like if they're not 100%, they can't play. We'll see.

Going by your avatar you've become a fan of him though unless im mistaken or have the wrong end of the stick. I still think Washington will turn out to be a very good WILB but i cant honestly say i know anything about Daryl's behaviour nor attitude. What i do know is that the Cardinals place a high emphasis on players having the right character, attitude and make-up as well as a good apetite for hard work. With this in mind i doubt Whisenhunt and Co would be so high on him and be willing to give up an extra third round pick to get him.

I do share a slight concern with you in terms of possibility of injury being higher with these speed athletic football players but at the same im optimistic that he can work on his strength and body build with Lott and CO so that he can deal with the rigours and largely savage nature of the NFL.

 

[kerouac9]

Going by your avatar you've become a fan of him though unless im mistaken or have the wrong end of the stick. I still think Washington will turn out to be a very good WILB but i cant honestly say i know anything about Daryl's behaviour nor attitude. What i do know is that the Cardinals place a high emphasis on players having the right character, attitude and make-up as well as a good apetite for hard work. With this in mind i doubt Whisenhunt and Co would be so high on him and be willing to give up an extra third round pick to get him.

I do share a slight concern with you in terms of possibility of injury being higher with these speed athletic football players but at the same im optimistic that he can work on his strength and body build with Lott and CO so that he can deal with the rigours and largely savage nature of the NFL.

And yet this group drafted Buster Davis and Alan Branch. Also, Jorrick Calvin was academically ineligible at Troy, which isn't exactly the Ivy League.

Let's not confuse what people say with what people do.

 

[SuperSpck]

Any inside knowledge is friggin amazing.
If this guy tells you anything about anything in the NFL, do us a favor and tell us about it!

 

[Monty]

And yet this group drafted Buster Davis and Alan Branch. Also, Jorrick Calvin was academically ineligible at Troy, which isn't exactly the Ivy League.

Let's not confuse what people say with what people do.

Come on dude, you know this group (Whisenhunt, Keim, Graves, Scouting dept) has drafted more success stories then the few failures you mention and you also know that their methodology has reaped enough rewards for us to give them at least the benefit of the doubt.


And yeah lets focus on what they have done which is to turn this team around from chokers to believers and achievers, largely with that methodology and philosophy i was referring to.

Furthermore just because Calvin wasnt academically the most gifted individual doesnt mean it will have any bearing on his football capabilities let alone have any real impact on whether he makes the grade at the NFL or not. It also has no reflection on the quality of the character the Cardinals may seek although he may not perhaps profess the football smarts they require but i doubt even that as they seem very high on this kid so in my picked he must've ticked these boxes and more that we dont know.

I feel that the pedigree this team has built up over the last few years since Whisenhunt has taken over, a pedigree that places high emphasis on good character, a strong work ethic and a healthy motivation to strive for success, should lead to us in trusting them to at least draft players with these characteristics. This leads me to believe the Cardinals faith in Washington's character then what a scout from another team has to say. I will not put blind faith into the Cardinals draft team but at the same time i'm not gonna question them because of a possible inkling this scout may have.

 

[Arizona's Finest]

What it comes down to me is that Washington wouldn't be a fit for most teams. But for what we want out of a 3-4 WILB, he is perfect. He is a faster Karlos Dansby. I keep reiterating this but in watching Hughes on tape, Washington kept bursting off the screen and for his size, he shows a proclivity to throw his body in the way and mix it up.

So the way other teams would value him is of little consequence to me.

On the other hand the fact that the Cardinals had him as their #12 prospect speaks volumes to me.

 

[Monty]

What it comes down to me is that Washington wouldn't be a fit for most teams. But for what we want out of a 3-4 WILB, he is perfect. He is a faster Karlos Dansby. I keep reiterating this but in watching Hughes on tape, Washington kept bursting off the screen and for his size, he shows a proclivity to throw his body in the way and mix it up.

So the way other teams would value him is of little consequence to me.

On the other hand the fact that the Cardinals had him as their #12 prospect speaks volumes to me.

I dont think anyone is questioning his ability really. The only question marks around him are his weight and now apparently a slight possibility of questionable attitude. For me the part of your statement that i've quoted addresses this to a certain extent for me as the Cardinals do place a high importance on good character guys with the right attitudes towards the team and their improvement and i dont think that the Cardinals would have Washington as the #12 on their draft board if there was even a question mark about his attitude.

 

[kerouac9]

Come on dude, you know this group (Whisenhunt, Keim, Graves, Scouting dept) has drafted more success stories then the few failures you mention and you also know that their methodology has reaped enough rewards for us to give them at least the benefit of the doubt.


And yeah lets focus on what they have done which is to turn this team around from chokers to believers and achievers, largely with that methodology and philosophy i was referring to.

Furthermore just because Calvin wasnt academically the most gifted individual doesnt mean it will have any bearing on his football capabilities let alone have any real impact on whether he makes the grade at the NFL or not. It also has no reflection on the quality of the character the Cardinals may seek although he may not perhaps profess the football smarts they require but i doubt even that as they seem very high on this kid so in my picked he must've ticked these boxes and more that we dont know.

I feel that the pedigree this team has built up over the last few years since Whisenhunt has taken over, a pedigree that places high emphasis on good character, a strong work ethic and a healthy motivation to strive for success, should lead to us in trusting them to at least draft players with these characteristics. This leads me to believe the Cardinals faith in Washington's character then what a scout from another team has to say. I will not put blind faith into the Cardinals draft team but at the same time i'm not gonna question them because of a possible inkling this scout may have.

I don't want to be the skeptic, but here are the facts: in the last three drafts the Cards picked up 20 players. Of those 20 players, 5 have become starters for the team. Three more may become starters this season. Nearly as many Denny draft picks will start for the Cards next season as Whis draft picks.

I don't mind taking bad guys and seeing if they're football players. Darnell Dockett was viewed as a huge character risk coming out of Florida State. But let's no pretend that Brandon Keith got run out of Norman for taking a swing at a strength coach at Oklahoma. Or that Rashard Johnson was benched and deactivated last season because he reportedly didn't show a committment to the game.

There's a lot of noise about building the team through the draft, but we're going to have at least 5 starters on our defense who were free agent or trade acquisitions, and another one or two who didn't have to beat anyone out for their starting job.

 

[CardLogic]

Also, Jorrick Calvin was academically ineligible at Troy, which isn't exactly the Ivy League.

Furthermore just because Calvin wasnt academically the most gifted individual doesnt mean it will have any bearing on his football capabilities let alone have any real impact on whether he makes the grade at the NFL or not. It also has no reflection on the quality of the character the Cardinals may seek although he may not perhaps profess the football smarts they require but i doubt even that as they seem very high on this kid so in my picked he must've ticked these boxes and more that we dont know.

Yes, Calvin was academically ineligible his senior year. The reason: a couple of deaths in the family, so he left school abruptly to be with his family, and didn't notify the teachers. Further, he accepts that it was his responsibility.

Cornerback Jorrick Calvin of Troy missed his senior season because he was academically ineligible. "I had a couple deaths in my family and I had to go home and deal with that. Instead of leaving a note or something for my teachers, I missed an assignment and couldn't make that assignment up. It was all my fault."

I wouldn't judge this incident as a character flaw, nor an indictment against Calvin's intelligence quotient.

 

[Monty]

Yes, Calvin was academically ineligible his senior year. The reason: a couple of deaths in the family, so he left school abruptly to be with his family, and didn't notify the teachers. Further, he accepts that it was his responsibility. I wouldn't judge this incident as a character flaw, nor an indictment against Calvin's intelligence quotient.

To be honest i didnt actually the reason why he was ruled academically ineligible but at the same time i did think there must be more to it than what appeared to be the case on the surface. He still should've done the right thing and returned for his education and at least notified his teachers.

 

[kerouac9]

Yes, Calvin was academically ineligible his senior year. The reason: a couple of deaths in the family, so he left school abruptly to be with his family, and didn't notify the teachers. Further, he accepts that it was his responsibility. I wouldn't judge this incident as a character flaw, nor an indictment against Calvin's intelligence quotient.

So... What you're saying is that a lack of follow-through that leaves you without an education and abandons your teammates who were depending on you isn't anything to be concerned about?

Just making that clear.

As a teacher, I can say that a student who can't find two seconds to send an e-mail explaining their extended absence is a character flaw. As I said in this very thread, words are free; let's see what the actions dictate.

 

[JeffGollin]

As I've always been led to believe, "High Maintenance" refers to the need of the coaching staff and front office to devote more time than ordinary to a player.

You'd think it would pertain to police blotter and other off-the-field issues, but it could merely mean that the guy might tend to have diva-like behavior when it comes to salary, special treatment etc. (If the kid is that smart & self-assertive, it might just be that he's simply unwilling to take any cr*p from anybody).

While it sounds as though the info is credible (because Washington was the only Cardinal draft pick not receiving praise), some words of caution:

1. The source remains "unnamed."

2. The reference to "high maintenance" is a bit vague and non-specific. (i.e. what did he do or say to warrant that label - maybe (for legitimate reasons or maybe otherwise) he missed an interview and p*ssed off the scout). Point is - we don't know.

Not to say that the info isn't interesting and juicy, but we'd be wrong to jump to conclusions before we've seen the dude in action as a Cardinal.

 

[joeshmo]

As I've always been led to believe, "High Maintenance" refers to the need of the coaching staff and front office to devote more time than ordinary to a player.

You'd think it would pertain to police blotter and other off-the-field issues, but it could merely mean that the guy might tend to have diva-like behavior when it comes to salary, special treatment etc.

I think you bring up a good point. High Maintenance doesn't have to mean police blotter or diva attitude. Take a guy like Mount Cody, he wouldn't have been high maintenance because of diva attitude he would have been high maintenance because you have to be on his tail to keep his weight down all the time. Couldn't the opposite apply as well. Meaning you have to be on this guys butt to keep his weight UP, which could be high maintenance. Which I would easily see, because Washington has never kept his weight up, just like Cody has never kept his weight down.

Having to spend a lot of time extra time and energy with a guy for any reason would be what is meant by high maintenance, couldn't it?

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

I'll try and follow up with him. From the gist of the conversation, i took the high maintenance comment as being a diva. I'm specualting because i didn't get further into it. The good thing is,if that's the case, the Cards have some strong leaders on defense that would likely straighten out a rookie rather quickly if they had any attitude problems.

 

[CardLogic]

To be honest i didnt actually the reason why he was ruled academically ineligible but at the same time i did think there must be more to it than what appeared to be the case on the surface. He still should've done the right thing and returned for his education and at least notified his teachers.

He didn't quit school; he just left for a short term and missed some assignments for which there was no allowance for make-up.

 

[Monty]

He didn't quit school; he just left for a short term and missed some assignments for which there was no allowance for make-up.

I meant he should've done the right thing in both notifying his teachers and ensuring he returned to school in time for himn to not loose his eligibility.

 

[CardLogic]

I meant he should've done the right thing in both notifying his teachers and ensuring he returned to school in time for himn to not loose his eligibility.

Calvin has acknowledged this being the case.