Should it be CB Newsome or CB Farley at #16?

[az jam]

If Surtain and Horn are gone and the best choice left is a CB at #16, who really would be a better choice: CB Newsome or CB Farley??? I'm mixed on this.

 

[Garthshort]

az jam, most experts say Farley is not only better than Newsome but on a par with Surtain and Horn. But, he does have medical concerns. Seems like if the medical concerns are unfounded, then Farley will be a great pick. In the words of Dirty Harry, "Do you feel lucky. Well do you?"

 

[juza76]

If horn is gone
Newsome
1.5 year younger then Fairley, more experience, and he is the best in coverage of the entire class
"he ranks first in the draft class with 1.4 passes broken up per game, second with 0.9 yards allowed per man-coverage snap and first with 11.9 receiving yards allowed per game

Both have missed several games

 

[DVontel]

Newsome.

I also expect him to be at least better than 1 of Surtain/Horn.

 

[BritCard]

I really don't want Farley and I think #16 is way too high for a guy with his lack of experience and injury history.

So Newsome.

I have a little feeling that Surtain or Horn (or both) are going to be there in the early teens and that Keim may do a little trade up.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

If horn is gone
Newsome
1.5 year younger then Fairley, more experience, and he is the best in coverage of the entire class
"he ranks first in the draft class with 1.4 passes broken up per game, second with 0.9 yards allowed per man-coverage snap and first with 11.9 receiving yards allowed per game

Both have missed several games

The irony is that Farley has actually played at least the same, if not more, games at the college level than has newsome.

 

[Solar7]

I'm at the point where I don't really want either but think we'll get stuck.

 

[juza76]

The irony is that Farley has actually played at least the same, if not more, games at the college level than has newsome.

Fairley was qb in high school then committed to to Virginia tech to play WR, was converted to cb during 2018 season, Newsome played cb since high school

 

[Chris_Sanders]

Peter King has them back to back

16. Arizona Cardinals—Greg Newsome II, cornerback, Northwestern
Lots of different opinions about Newsome. One GM with a cornerback need is wary because of his nagging injury history at Northwestern; he missed eight, three and four games due to injury in his three starting seasons. So a team will have to be comfortable with his long-term fitness, obviously, and this is a particularly concern this year because so many shortcuts have been taken medically with no combine and few chances for team medics to put their hands on prospects. Per Dane Brugler, Newsome had 25 passes defensed in 21 college games, and he runs a 4.38 40, and he’s exceedingly fluid.

Also, a note about Arizona options. Peter Schrager, whose mock I sincerely respect, had the Cards trading up from 16 to 7 to take Jaylen Waddle. Kliff Kingsbury, it seems, is smitten with getting more firepower for Kyler Murray. Okay. In the last three years, Arizona’s used two second-round picks on receivers, made a mega-trade-and-signing for DeAndre Hopkins, and bought A.J. Green in free agency. Time to address other needs.

17. Las Vegas Raiders—Caleb Farley, CB, Virginia Tech
Farley, despite not playing a football game for 508 days and despite coming off disk surgery that will affect him through July, has been a very popular man this offseason with many teams. That happens because Farley’s 6-2, has been strong in man coverage, loves football, and apparently will be okay for the long term once his current back malady heals. Arizona (16), Washington (19), Chicago (20) and Pittsburgh (24) have spent lots of Zoom time with Farley this spring.

The Raiders, 26th in passing yards allowed and 30th in third-down conversions allowed, haven’t drafted well recently at corner. (Join the club.) Their projected 2021 starters at corner, Trayvon Mullen and Damon Arnette, were 82nd and 116th, respectively, in PFF’s 2020 cornerback ratings. Not good, considering 121 cornerbacks were rated. Farley, in a division with a quarter of the games annually coming against Patrick Mahomes and Justin Herbert, would be a welcome/essential add.

 

[Chopper0080]

Greg Newsome missed 8 games in 2018, 3 games in 2019 and 3 games in 2020. If you are ok with a CB who has an injury history, why not just take Farley who has a higher ceiling?

 

[TJ]

Greg Newsome missed 8 games in 2018, 3 games in 2019 and 3 games in 2020. If you are ok with a CB who has an injury history, why not just take Farley who has a higher ceiling?

This. One of the luxuries of having PP21 was that he never missed a game due to injury the entire time he was here. That's unheard of with a good amount of DBs suffering non-contact leg injuries. Newsome, although good, has shown a pattern of missing a considerable amount of games each year, almost 40% of them, which would equate to missing 7 games/season.

Farley should be the choice.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Fairley was qb in high school then committed to to Virginia tech to play WR, was converted to cb during 2018 season, Newsome played cb since high school

I’m not sure I put much value in playing any position before college.

 

[juza76]

I’m not sure I put much value in playing any position before college.

Newsome was a high recruited college cb

 

[juza76]

Greg Newsome missed 8 games in 2018, 3 games in 2019 and 3 games in 2020. If you are ok with a CB who has an injury history, why not just take Farley who has a higher ceiling?

Based on what?

 

[BritCard]

Greg Newsome missed 8 games in 2018, 3 games in 2019 and 3 games in 2020. If you are ok with a CB who has an injury history, why not just take Farley who has a higher ceiling?

Because Farley's injuries have been more serious. ACL and back are as serious as they get, and his floor is super low. The guy could be anything from bum to superstar.

But as Juza said, based on what? Farley hasn't even tested. Newsome has elite stats and elite testing. Only thing Farley has going is hype.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Because Farley's injuries have been more serious. ACL and back are as serious as they get, and his floor is super low. The guy could be anything from bum to superstar.

But as Juza said, based on what? Farley hasn't even tested. Newsome has elite stats and elite testing. Only thing Farley has going is hype.

what kind of ACL injury did Fairley have?

 

[Cheesebeef]

Wait a second... Fairley has already had TWO back surgeries and an ACL tear? That guy doesn’t have a body built for football.

and he initially hurt his back lifting weights... at L5-S1? Yeah... this scenario is all too familiar for me. The fact that a lifting necessitated the first surgery... and that he needed a second surgery there within 18 months means he didn’t recover from the first surgery the way they hoped. That’s really not good for back injuries.

That makes him a HARD pass, especially because we are so desperate at CB. I was under the impression that his surgery in March was his first. Didn’t even know about the prior ACL tear. That is a TON of damage at such a young age. Major structural damage, especially at the back if you are already a multi-surgery patient by 21.

Having gotten a better understanding of the myriad of injury concerns and especially the whole picture on his back, I don’t touch him with a ten foot pole.

 

[BritCard]

what kind of ACL injury did Fairley have?

Can't see. Only that it was non contact and that it was on the first day of camp in his first year of college. Missed the whole season.

And not his first back surgery either. He had back surgery after the 2018 season.

There are other things that concern me. He turned up for camp last year but then decided to opt out. The first high profile player to do so. He cited his mothers passing away in 2018 as the reason, saying he didn't want to risk losing his father. But considering he's away at college in a crucial year and with his history that just seems odd to me. Being away at college means you see your father LESS and thus expose him less. Being out and about training at home is higher risk, or certainly equal.

And then there's the timing of his back surgery. He hasn't played ball in 16 months and he decides he needs back surgery 3 days before his pro day?

 

[BritCard]

Wait a second... Fairley has already had TWO back surgeries and an ACL tear? That guy doesn’t have a body built for football.

and he initially hurt his back simply lifting weights... at L5-S1? And that necessitated the first surgery... which he didn’t recover from right which forced a second surgery with a little more than a year?

uh... HARD pass. I was under the impression that his last surgery in March was his first. Didn’t even know about the prior ACL tear. That is a TON of damage at such a young age. Major structural damage, especially at the back if you are already a multi-surgery patient by 21.

Having gotten a better understanding of the myriad of injury concerns and especially the whole picture on his back, I don’t touch him with a ten foot pole.

Yup, this summed it up well I thought

"First was the ACL reconstruction as a true freshman. Then he had a microdiscectomy of his spine two years later. Fast forward roughly another year to the present, and now he is having a second back surgery. We’ve seen it at different times in legendary careers, such as JJ Watt and Tiger Woods. However, to start a career like this is tough pickings. Once the spine is compromised, it can become a slippery slope. Effects on the nerves that run to specific lower leg muscles, as well as obvious effects on the spine’s structure, can be destructive to one’s athletic career. Looking at the big picture, Caleb’s human kinetic chain is and probably will continue to be compromised.

Go back to the thighs, could there have been a slight impairment after the ACL reconstruction that led to a kinetic chain breakdown? Did this subsequently lead to the demise of his back? What kind of risks does this mean? Well, he can continue to have more back injuries for starters. This could range from pain/spasms to more surgeries, or possibly even a career-ending spinal fusion. He also will carry the baggage from a previous ACL reconstruction. The ACL combined with the potential nerve issues from the spinal surgeries could carry additional risks of another ACL and/or Achilles’ tears."

 

[ProdigalSun]

Former QB and WR ??... Farley giving me Brandon Williams flashbacks...

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Can't see. Only that it was non contact and that it was on the first day of camp in his first year of college. Missed the whole season.

And not his first back surgery either. He had back surgery after the 2018 season.

There are other things that concern me. He turned up for camp last year but then decided to opt out. The first high profile player to do so. He cited his mothers passing away in 2018 as the reason, saying he didn't want to risk losing his father. But considering he's away at college in a crucial year and with his history that just seems odd to me. Being away at college means you see your father LESS and thus expose him less. Being out and about training at home is higher risk, or certainly equal.

And then there's the timing of his back surgery. He hasn't played ball in 16 months and he decides he needs back surgery 3 days before his pro day?

You must’ve missed all the Covid stupidity at colleges this past year to make that statement.

 

[BritCard]

You must’ve missed all the Covid stupidity at colleges this past year to make that statement.

No. I saw it.

My point was he can't give Covid to his dad away at college. You know, with not being at home.

He can if he opts out and is living with him while training every day.

 

[Proximo]

If Surtain and Horn are gone and the best choice left is a CB at #16, who really would be a better choice: CB Newsome or CB Farley??? I'm mixed on this.

Farley.

 

[Proximo]

Because Farley's injuries have been more serious. ACL and back are as serious as they get, and his floor is super low. The guy could be anything from bum to superstar.

But as Juza said, based on what? Farley hasn't even tested. Newsome has elite stats and elite testing. Only thing Farley has going is hype.

No, what Farley has going for him is film of him playing at a very high level - higher than Newsome by just about everybody's evaluation.

Production is a hell of a lot better way to judge a prospect than their combine stats.

 

[Lomax to Green 84]

My issue with Farley is not that he opted out, but that he waited until March to have the surgery when it obviously was an issue for months. You choose not to play, go ahead and have the surgery in November instead of March. Am I missing something here or does that seem a little fishy?