Should it be CB Newsome or CB Farley at #16?

[Chopper0080]

Based on what?

His level of production combined with his athletic measurables. Farley has better tape than Newsome, equal if not better athleticism and similar injury concerns.

 

[Chopper0080]

Farley explained the injury in great detail, saying it originally occurred during a deadlift exercise. He injured his lumbosacral joint -- which connects the L5 and S1 discs -- but previously elected for a procedure to repair only the L5 disc. For a year, Farley wasn’t limited physically, although he did experience some sciatica symptoms. A little over a month ago, Farley’s S1 disc flared up. With the constant training Farley needed to do, his options were to take considerable time off to let the S1 heal on its own or undergo a microdiscectomy procedure.

He elected for the procedure, which put him out of his pro day. Although has raised medical concerns, Farley said this isn’t something that will limit him at the next level.

“I did a great job managing over a year but that bulge is still in my S1 and unfortunately I irritated it a month ago, which caused me to pull back on my training,” Farley said. “I was trying to cut back and manage the inflammation to come out here on pro day and put up some crazy numbers. But after talking to Dr. (Robert) Watkins, getting the MRI and getting things looked at, we were advised it would be best to go ahead and fix this problem so I will be ready for training camp and ready for the season. It was not a recurring disc or anything like that. What I had previously worked on is still intact. It was great news. I’m actually excited about this.”

 

[Gandhi]

His level of production combined with his athletic measurables. Farley has better tape than Newsome, equal if not better athleticism and similar injury concerns.

This. I think Farley is extremely talented. And if people don't want Farley because of his injury history, then they don't want Newsome either.

 

[juza76]

His level of production combined with his athletic measurables. Farley has better tape than Newsome, equal if not better athleticism and similar injury concerns.

Newsome

"he ranks first in the draft class with 1.4 passes broken up per game, second with 0.9 yards allowed per man-coverage snap and first with 11.9 receiving yards allowed per game

 

[Cheesebeef]

This. I think Farley is extremely talented. And if people don't want Farley because of his injury history, then they don't want Newsome either.

there’s a GULF of difference between nagging injuries and major structural damage to both the back and knees.

I don’t know enough about Newsome but if those are our choices at 16, I go another direction and sign Nelson after the draft. Wasting a first rounder on a need pick that’s ALSO got massive injury red flags is a recipe for disaster, IMO.

 

[Chopper0080]

there’s a GULF of difference between nagging injuries and major structural damage to both the back and knees.

I don’t know enough about Newsome but if those are our choices at 16, I go another direction and sign Nelson after the draft. Wasting a first rounder on a need pick that’s ALSO got massive injury red flags is a recipe for disaster, IMO.

Agreed.

IMO, that is why Keim wants to either trade up or back.

 

[Rohinaz]

Neither, Terrace Marshall, hes a big WR target with speed and hands.
Asante Samuel Jr in the 2nd.

 

[Chopper0080]

Neither, Terrace Marshall, hes a big WR target with speed and hands.
Asante Samuel Jr in the 2nd.

Marshall also has some medical concerns

 

[Gandhi]

there’s a GULF of difference between nagging injuries and major structural damage to both the back and knees.

Oh, obviously. It just doesn’t really matter (in the end) why a player is not available on game day.

I don’t know enough about Newsome but if those are our choices at 16, I go another direction and sign Nelson after the draft. Wasting a first rounder on a need pick that’s ALSO got massive injury red flags is a recipe for disaster, IMO.

Well, I would sign Nelson no matter what. And everyone drafts for need, by the way. You cannot judge the pick on that.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Oh, obviously. It just doesn’t really matter (in the end) why a player is not available on game day.



Well, I would sign Nelson no matter what. And everyone drafts for need, by the way. You cannot judge the pick on that.

completely unfounded statement.

 

[Gandhi]

completely unfounded statement.

Not at all. It is based on history and common sense.

 

[Rohinaz]

Marshall also has some medical concerns

Im not sure what they are, ive watched every game he has payed in and dont remember him missing one due to injury.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Not at all. It is based on history and common sense.

THE CARDINALS are proof against this need v. BPA "common sense". With a first round QB on the team and only one year under his belt, the Cardinals went BPA with Kyler Murray. And before you try to throw any "Rosen had no value" garbage, we still got a 2nd round pick for him after drafting his replacement, so save that crap. That was a BPA pick all the way. We saw a possibility for an upgrade at a position we had just thought we filled the previous season and said screw it. Yes, we NEEDED a DE desperately, but we took the player with a ton more upside.

 

[football karma]

Gambo just emphatically said that at #16 -- its Farley over Newsome

Newsome only in a trade down situation

 

[overseascardfan]

there’s a GULF of difference between nagging injuries and major structural damage to both the back and knees.

I don’t know enough about Newsome but if those are our choices at 16, I go another direction and sign Nelson after the draft. Wasting a first rounder on a need pick that’s ALSO got massive injury red flags is a recipe for disaster, IMO.

I get the concern for his injury history but he's young so he should be able to recover. Richard Sherman had a serious knee injury and got switched to CB afterwards and was okay. Not saying Farley will be the next Sherman but their histories are similar.

I think ARZ should be proactive and sign Nelson no matter if they draft a CB even in Round 1. I think they can work Farley into defense slowly and not throw him out there Day 1. He could come in in sub packages until he is ready for a bigger role. In NFL, you need as many CB's are you can find. Picking at #16, there isn't the same pressure as having a Top 5 - 10 pick so Farley would be worth the wait. Newsome has one career INT in 3 years and prior to a month ago I had no idea who he was because he's a late riser in terms of stock. Farley has long been considered the second best CB in this draft but because he opted out his stock has taken a hit not for having a bad year but getting hurt.

Unless ARZ is trading up for Surtain, I would go with Farley, there really isn't anyone else at #16 that I think I would want more. ARZ could go OL I guess to either fill the RT / RG spot or pass rusher but not really impressed with who is projected to be available at that spot.

If ARZ isn't taking a CB, I would trade down.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

Shouldn’t even be a debate. Farley.

 

[JeffGollin]

Newsome - because the Cards have bad luck when it comes to rehabbing injured players.

 

[Cardsfan77]

Farley if medicals check out, neither if they don’t

 

[Cheesebeef]

I get the concern for his injury history but he's young so he should be able to recover. Richard Sherman had a serious knee injury and got switched to CB afterwards and was okay. Not saying Farley will be the next Sherman but their histories are similar.

I think ARZ should be proactive and sign Nelson no matter if they draft a CB even in Round 1. I think they can work Farley into defense slowly and not throw him out there Day 1. He could come in in sub packages until he is ready for a bigger role. In NFL, you need as many CB's are you can find. Picking at #16, there isn't the same pressure as having a Top 5 - 10 pick so Farley would be worth the wait. Newsome has one career INT in 3 years and prior to a month ago I had no idea who he was because he's a late riser in terms of stock. Farley has long been considered the second best CB in this draft but because he opted out his stock has taken a hit not for having a bad year but getting hurt.

Unless ARZ is trading up for Surtain, I would go with Farley, there really isn't anyone else at #16 that I think I would want more. ARZ could go OL I guess to either fill the RT / RG spot or pass rusher but not really impressed with who is projected to be available at that spot.

If ARZ isn't taking a CB, I would trade down.

being young and having two back surgeries makes it more likely he DOESNT recover, or alternatively means he’s much more likely to have the injury become recurrent. Knee surgeries and multiple back surgeries are completely different beasts, which is why I don’t think the Sherman injury come back really comes into play.

I mean, I’m not sure how you can “he’s young, he’ll recover” when he already didn’t recover from the first back surgery which is what necessitates a second. Guys... back surgery, whether it’s a microdiscectomy, lamenectomy or full fusion are LAST resorts when rest and rehab won’t cut it. They’re last resorts because they never truly heal. You don’t generate new disc material after its taken out. The structure of the back, the core of the entire body that can effects everything from head to toe, is irrevocably changed. Having done that twice and one as recent as March is just too much risk, IMO. We can’t keep blowing first round picks. This is just asking for it.

 

[Dr. Jones]

Way too early for Newsome. I'd go WR, Pass Rush, ILB in round one and then attack Samuel in round 2.

But if I trust the medical..... I go Farley.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Way too early for Newsome. I'd go WR, Pass Rush, ILB in round one and then attack Samuel in round 2.

But if I trust the medical..... I go Farley.

how can you trust the medical if he can’t workout... especially after the first surgery didn’t give the “medical” needed for success.

 

[Shane]

how can you trust the medical if he can’t workout... especially after the first surgery didn’t give the “medical” needed for success.

Did you read the detailed story? Sounds like he didn’t opt for a procedure that was a full fix the first time?

 

[DVontel]

Way too early for Newsome. I'd go WR, Pass Rush, ILB in round one and then attack Samuel in round 2.

But if I trust the medical..... I go Farley.

Newsome has risen up boards since January & has been projected between 16-25 for a while now.

How is that “way too early”?

 

[DVontel]

Also, the fact of going off-ball LB before CB in the 1st scares the hell out of me.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Did you read the detailed story? Sounds like he didn’t opt for a procedure that was a full fix the first time?

I read it. It’s horsecrap. And I say that not only as someone who has extensive first hand knowledge of the L5-S1 disc, but also knows and had talked to orthopedic surgeons who are Cards fans and amongst the most respected in the state, one retired and one who’s currently a surgeon at the Mayo Clinic.

You don’t go in for back surgery to do half fixes. You go in to do the work that hopefully takes care of the entire problem the first time because every successive surgery only leads you on a road to ruin.

maybe he ends up the exception to the rule. But man, that guy breaks easier than peanut brittle after an ACL tear and two back surgeries. And all of this without much wear and tear on his body, as he blew the disc just lifting... and then needed a follow up surgery after not even playing for a year. Think about that. It’s not like he’s re-injuring his back to the point of surgery because of on field collisions. He’s needing that after sitting out the entire year.

and even guys that DO eventually make a solid full recovery from back surgery don’t do that within a calendar year. Hell, just look at our very own JJ Watt for what happens when you have back surgery in the off-season and then come back to play full bore that season. You get another back surgery.

The next season Watt was still nowhere near what he was with zero sacks and 3 TFL in 5 games before he blew out his knee. It was two full years before Watt got back to being Watt, but he’s still had nagging injuries after that.