Since our season has gone "up in smoke...."

[Arizona's Finest]

Considering he's been playing most of the year with a WR at QB and a brand new OL I think it's unfair to accuse him of protecting his stats by not playing UT. Plus his backup had 17 carries for 77 yards so it's not like UT just clamped them down.

He was playing with an ankle injury and even the following game with all the time out he was apparently visibly limping but had over 100 yards and 36 carries.

Admittedly his timing was bad they apparently made the decision Friday of the game.

he's a great player, but I am a bit concerned about his recent injury history.

Sorry Russ but im go with the coaches take over yours, as much as i respect your knowledge. Read the quotes after the game. He pretty much called him a p---y.....im thinking he knows something we dont....

 

[john h]

I don't like Ricky. I don't want him on my team. I wouldn't cry if he were here, but I wouldn't look at him as any sort of savior either. He's only slightly less crazy than TO, and not the best player at his position like TO is. All the crazy, half the talent.

I do want D'Brickashaw Fergueson though, a great deal. Perhaps he'll slide down to us.

Since Jerry Jones is looking at T.O. I guess anything is possible. Jones wants to win so bad he will do anything.

 

[john h]

Shipp is gone IMHO. He will make 1.425 million next year in the last year of his contract. I guess no compelling reason to cut him loose, you could extend him and cut that cap figure, but given how he's played the last 5-6 games I'd be surprised if he's back.

I guess given the injury he had last year we could bring him back hoping in year 2 of recovery he'll be closer to his old self but I think considering it appears he'll go another season without a rushing TD, it's going to be hard to justify paying him 1.425 million to be the thunder in our backfield.

Another guy I'm fine with keeping just at a lower salary.

Shipp is probably good backup situational runner at best. We need at least one "BIG" pile driving RB. O.J. Anderson where are you? JJ still has a few games left to show if he is what we thought he was or something much less.

 

[john h]

NO MORE RB'S!!!

JJ is the answer. Lets get a line and a rookie QB. A DT, MLB and FS.

Looking at JJ's numbers this year how can we conclude he is the answer? I hope he is but so far I have seen nothing to indicate it.

 

[john h]

DeAngelo Williams will be mighty hard to pass up if he's there. Mighty hard.

DeAngelo played highschool in my home state and I watched him all through high school. He is much like JJ. Not big as running backs go at around 205 lbs and around a short 6'. We are in need of a big RB not another JJ type particularly since we do not have a very good OL and I do not expect it to be much better than average next year. Playing for Memphis he has not faced the tough competition of a big conference much like JJ. He is no Reggie Bush or the guy who will get you 3 yds at the goal line. His numbers are great but so were JJ's. I still want a big dude who can move the pile.

 

[john h]

I don't remember that at all Russ! When did he say that??

I do not think Mr. B would accept Williams. That being said he is they type of RB I envision we need. Big, fast, tough. One has to wonder whether he would be here long as he lives in his own world.

 

[Russ Smith]

Sorry Russ but im go with the coaches take over yours, as much as i respect your knowledge. Read the quotes after the game. He pretty much called him a p---y.....im thinking he knows something we dont....

Give me some quotes to read.

Here's coach Tommy West after the last game of the season.


"West has all the respect in the world for DeAngelo. He considers him a close friend.

But the reason Memphis announced that Williams' jersey would be retired at a later date -- and not actually retired Saturday -- is that West didn't want the ceremony to detract from the whole.

The guy has always been about the whole.

"It was Senior Day, not DeAngelo Day," West said.

DeAngelo Day will come down the road. "

Seriously I did a search when I read your post yesterday and again today and I haven't found a quote by West or Fulmer accusing DeAngelo of anything.

I did find a letter to the editor of some Tennessee paper by some fan who said he drove hours to attend the game only to find out DeAngelo wasn't going to play and ripped him for dodging the Vols.

not saying what you said isn't true, just I can't find any quotes. West loves the kid he just yesterday said Williams is like a son to him and has been the key to the resurrection of the memphis program, so I seriously doubt He called him any names.

 

[Russ Smith]

Shipp is probably good backup situational runner at best. We need at least one "BIG" pile driving RB. O.J. Anderson where are you? JJ still has a few games left to show if he is what we thought he was or something much less.

If anybody thought JJ was a big pile driving RB, they should be fired immediately.

 

[Russ Smith]

OK I did find an article that says West expected DeAngelo would play and he says it was Williams decision to not play. DeAngelo said he wanted to play but the coaches told him not to. When pressed he said he was about 68%, couldn't push off on the ankle, and felt he'd hurt the team by playing. The reporter asked him what % he had to be at before he'd play and he said that's hard to say it depends on the circumstances and the opponent, which was construed to mean he was dodging Tennessee.

I found an article by a Memphis writer basically saying he made a mistake, let's not crucify the kid he's the best player in school history, the coaching staff still loves him. He suggested that Williams incorrectly assumed that playing hurt would hurt him because Scouts would come away unimpressed, when in reality NOT playing hurt him because scouts came away wondering why he didn't play.

I'd still take him, he's played hurt his whole career. The real questions on him were level of play and injuries, he broke his leg in the bowl game last year.

But you are right there was some controversy about him skipping the UT game.

 

[Arizona's Finest]

Give me some quotes to read.

Here's coach Tommy West after the last game of the season.


"West has all the respect in the world for DeAngelo. He considers him a close friend.

But the reason Memphis announced that Williams' jersey would be retired at a later date -- and not actually retired Saturday -- is that West didn't want the ceremony to detract from the whole.

The guy has always been about the whole.

"It was Senior Day, not DeAngelo Day," West said.

DeAngelo Day will come down the road. "

Seriously I did a search when I read your post yesterday and again today and I haven't found a quote by West or Fulmer accusing DeAngelo of anything.

I did find a letter to the editor of some Tennessee paper by some fan who said he drove hours to attend the game only to find out DeAngelo wasn't going to play and ripped him for dodging the Vols.

not saying what you said isn't true, just I can't find any quotes. West loves the kid he just yesterday said Williams is like a son to him and has been the key to the resurrection of the memphis program, so I seriously doubt He called him any names.

Cant find where i originally read it ( i think it was a Memphis newspaper ) but i do have this tid bit from Stewert Mandel of CNNSI.com...

• Finally, this may be reading between the lines, but it appears to me that Memphis coach Tommy West is calling the best player in his school's history a wuss. Star running back DeAngelo Williams was an unexpected scratch against Tennessee due to an ankle injury suffered the previous week against UAB. "He felt like after the warm-ups that he would be better coming off the bench," said West. "If that's the case, I felt like he shouldn't play, because I knew this was going to be a game where we would have to play like men. It wasn't the place for a guy that's gimped up a little bit. ... We're not coming off the bench. We're either playing or we're not."

Even without Williams, the Tigers nearly handed the Vols an unthinkable sixth loss, going up 13-0 before falling 20-16. Do you think maybe, just maybe, Williams, who's averaging 164 yards per game, might have been good for four points?

Maybe not enough reason to bypass him in the second round (where he wont be available) but im sure as hell not wanting to spend OUR first round pick from that paragraph. It could be I am wrong and he is a warrior, but its a chance i dont think the Cards need to take....

 

[Russ Smith]

Cant find where i originally read it ( i think it was a Memphis newspaper ) but i do have this tid bit from Stewert Mandel of CNNSI.com...

• Finally, this may be reading between the lines, but it appears to me that Memphis coach Tommy West is calling the best player in his school's history a wuss. Star running back DeAngelo Williams was an unexpected scratch against Tennessee due to an ankle injury suffered the previous week against UAB. "He felt like after the warm-ups that he would be better coming off the bench," said West. "If that's the case, I felt like he shouldn't play, because I knew this was going to be a game where we would have to play like men. It wasn't the place for a guy that's gimped up a little bit. ... We're not coming off the bench. We're either playing or we're not."

Even without Williams, the Tigers nearly handed the Vols an unthinkable sixth loss, going up 13-0 before falling 20-16. Do you think maybe, just maybe, Williams, who's averaging 164 yards per game, might have been good for four points?

Maybe not enough reason to bypass him in the second round (where he wont be available) but im sure as hell not wanting to spend OUR first round pick from that paragraph. It could be I am wrong and he is a warrior, but its a chance i dont think the Cards need to take....

No see my later post you are right there was some controversy.

Although your quote confirms that it was the coach who told him not to play.

West did say that Williams not once during the game asked to go in which clearly bugged him.

I don't know I've always had a problem with college teams abusing kids, I think Bob Stoops is deplorable for the way he's destroying Adrian Peterson just because his QB sucks.

but you are right that it appears West was disappointed.

 

[Arizona's Finest]

Speaking of which if we cant get Bush or Lienert and up getting a player like Ferguson or Hawk (who would both help) what do you do in this scenario in the 2007 draft:

Adrian Peterson
Brady Quinn
Brohm
Sam Keller
Josh Booty (believe...this guy is going to be such a stud. Norm Chow said he is Waaaay more talented than Lienert and he has been there for three years now)

 

[Russ Smith]

Speaking of which if we cant get Bush or Lienert and up getting a player like Ferguson or Hawk (who would both help) what do you do in this scenario in the 2007 draft:

Adrian Peterson
Brady Quinn
Brohm
Sam Keller
Josh Booty (believe...this guy is going to be such a stud. Norm Chow said he is Waaaay more talented than Lienert and he has been there for three years now)

Brohm just tore his ACL, not sure where he'll be next year in terms of health. Tough break great talent.

Peterson I love but another year of the Stoops sweat shop and I'm going to be really concerned about his longterm future. IN a sense he's lucky he got hurt this year so he didn't get even more than the 339 carries he had last year but he still had nearly 200 and with 7 wins they'll be in a bowl and no doubt he'll get 30 more carries. he's been getting 25+ a game on a bad ankle the last month after not being able to play one game and missing most of 3 others with the ankle. Stoops to be fair did let him rest in those games but he'd have been better served to sit completely, instead of play just enough to keep aggravating it.

I love the kid he's so powerful and he's faster than most RB's out there too. special kid if he's not totally destroyed by the time he leaves OU.

 

[clif]

Speaking of which if we cant get Bush or Lienert and up getting a player like Ferguson or Hawk (who would both help) what do you do in this scenario in the 2007 draft:

Adrian Peterson
Brady Quinn
Brohm
Sam Keller
Josh Booty (believe...this guy is going to be such a stud. Norm Chow said he is Waaaay more talented than Lienert and he has been there for three years now)

Its John not Josh. I remember Josh in high school. ( i thought the guy was going to rip it up in college.

Anyways.. I don't know where Williams was projected to go, but if he was there.. and these other players are gone and the Cards pass on him because of this incident I will slap somebody. I can see it now.. 3 years later.. Graves (or his successor) saying just what he said this past week... passing on a player like this because of an injury (Leftwich) is a decision they wished that hadn't made.

 

[Arizona's Finest]

Its John not Josh. I remember Josh in high school. ( i thought the guy was going to rip it up in college.

Anyways.. I don't know where Williams was projected to go, but if he was there.. and these other players are gone and the Cards pass on him because of this incident I will slap somebody. I can see it now.. 3 years later.. Graves (or his successor) saying just what he said this past week... passing on a player like this because of an injury (Leftwich) is a decision they wished that hadn't made.

You are correct...

In fact it is JOHN DAVID BOOTY

but thats just semantics

 

[dreamcastrocks]

Its John not Josh. I remember Josh in high school. ( i thought the guy was going to rip it up in college.

Anyways.. I don't know where Williams was projected to go, but if he was there.. and these other players are gone and the Cards pass on him because of this incident I will slap somebody. I can see it now.. 3 years later.. Graves (or his successor) saying just what he said this past week... passing on a player like this because of an injury (Leftwich) is a decision they wished that hadn't made.

Why do I see more and more Cards fans thinking that we regret not taking Leftwich. Listen, I knew that he was going to be special from the few games that I saw him at Marshall.

I don't thnk I have ever seen/heard anyone from the Cards organization claim that they should have drafted Leftwich. It is not like they passed on Peyton Manning or anything.

If we draft ANY RB not named Bush in the 1st round, I will be truly disappointed. There are other major holes that need to be filled, and we just spent a high 2nd round pick on a RB last year. AN OT, DT, LB, longterm QB, anyone but Bush at RB would be a terrible pick, IMO.

 

[clif]

Why do I see more and more Cards fans thinking that we regret not taking Leftwich. Listen, I knew that he was going to be special from the few games that I saw him at Marshall.

I don't thnk I have ever seen/heard anyone from the Cards organization claim that they should have drafted Leftwich. It is not like they passed on Peyton Manning or anything.

If we draft ANY RB not named Bush in the 1st round, I will be truly disappointed. There are other major holes that need to be filled, and we just spent a high 2nd round pick on a RB last year. AN OT, DT, LB, longterm QB, anyone but Bush at RB would be a terrible pick, IMO.

Ummmh yeah he did say that.

"That's one of those picks, in hindsight, you wish you would have made," Rod Graves, the Cardinals vice president for football operations, said of Leftwich.

Here is the link:

http://www.azcentral.com/sports/cardinals/articles/1124cards1124.html


You don't pass up players who showed they can be very productive just because they got hurt. Williams has been playing and putting up great numbers for long periods of time... same with Leftwich.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

Ummmh yeah he did say that.



Here is the link:

http://www.azcentral.com/sports/cardinals/articles/1124cards1124.html


You don't pass up players who showed they can be very productive just because they got hurt. Williams has been playing and putting up great numbers for long periods of time... same with Leftwich.

Hmm, I stand corrected.

Thanks,

 

[Russ Smith]

Yep Pasch apparently said Sunday on radio that the Cards said they never considered taking Leftwich because of the leg injuries, and they now regret that decison.

Ironically of course he breaks his ankle against us.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

we have shipp and arrington. we dont need ricky. like everything you had to say up to that point. we have our thunder and lightning combo in these guys

guys, as much as he works hard and i love his work ethic, it's time to admit that, post-injury shipp just sucks. he's no longer an nfl runningback.

 

[Pariah]

guys, as much as he works hard and i love his work ethic, it's time to admit that, post-injury shipp just sucks. he's no longer an nfl runningback.

Sad, but appearently true.