So What’s Wrong With Kyler Murray?

[Chopper0080]

You don't have to like they guy but you can't ignore his accomplishments so far. FACTS
He is doing it with subpar offensive talent - my opinion (name another 10 win team with less offensive talent than us).

Among his many accomplishments and multiple franchise records he’s already set, Cardinals quarterback Kyler Murray has done something in just 41 career games that it took Hall of Famer Kurt Warner to do in 61 and something Jim Hart (199 career games), Neil Lomax (108) and Carson Palmer (60) never did.

It happened Sunday at Soldier Field when Murray, back after missing three games with a high left ankle sprain, played his 15th game with a completion percentage of 70 percent or higher. His 11 of 15 (73.3) performance for 123 yards and two touchdowns against the Bears ties him with Warner for the most 70-percent completion game in Cardinals’ history.

Murray has six such games already this season, leaving him two games shy of tying Warner’s single-season record set in 2008. Murray leads the NFL in completion percentage (72.7), passer rating (112.2) and yards per pass attempt.

Only eight quarterbacks have led the league in all three of those three categories since 1980 and six of them went on to be named the NFL’s Most Valuable Player.

*He reached 60-plus touchdown passes and 20-plus rushing touchdowns faster than any player in NFL history (41 games).

*On Sunday against the Bears, he became the fourth-youngest quarterback in NFL history to reach 10,000 passing yards.

*He joined Cam Newton as the only players with 10,000-plus passing yards and 1,500-plus rushing yards in his first three seasons.

*With 20 career rushing touchdowns, he joined Newton (28) and Josh Allen (25) as the only quarterbacks in league history with 20 or more rushing TDs in their first three seasons.

*He’s set a franchise record for the most career games (13) with at least one passing touchdown and one rushing touchdown.

*He became the fourth player in franchise history — at any position — with 20-plus rushing in their first three seasons.

*And he’s tied Warner’s franchise record for most games (five) with a passer rating of 120 or higher in a single season.

Murray’s 72.7 completion percentage this season leads the NFL and it’s presently the third-highest, single-season mark in league history behind Drew Brees (74.4 in 2018, 74.3 in 2019).

https://www.azcentral.com/story/spo...urray-keeps-racking-up-milestones/6452800001/

In not even three full seasons Kliff Kingsbury is 9th all time in Cardinals wins as a HC.

 

[Cheesebeef]

In not even three full seasons Kliff Kingsbury is 9th all time in Cardinals wins as a HC.

Bingo. Setting franchise records for the most inept franchise in the league over the course of history is meaningless. I measure players against other great players. Measuring Kyler against decades upon decades of drek and then handing him a gold star for being better than Warner who really only had two good seasons and Palmer, who really only had one great season doesnt impress all that much.

 

[Krangodnzr]

You are talking about a kid that has was 42-0 in high school, 3 state titles (in TEXAS), and Gatorade Player of the Year.
He went 24-5 in college, including 12-1 in only year as full time starter. Heisman trophy winner.
Only player in history (IIRC) to be drafted in 1st round of NFL and MLB Drafts.
Has already set several franchise records and one of the fastest to accomplish many many others.
Took the worst team in the NFL to 10 wins in the hardest division and the playoffs in year 3 with mediocre talent (based on other 10+ win teams).

You don't think he is taking his job seriously enough? Give up on the fancy psychology words you know and get with reality my friend.

Murray SAID HE WASN'T watching much film. I don't have to think he isn't serious about it, he said as much.

 

[cardncubfan]

Murray SAID HE WASN'T watching much film. I don't have to think he isn't serious about it, he said as much.

You heard that coming out of his mouth with your own ears?

 

[Krangodnzr]

You heard that coming out of his mouth with your own ears?

LOL OK....

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Ah...you just waffled back to college again.

When someone disagrees, it doesn't mean they don't understand. People on this board understand a lot more than you give them credit for...maybe take a different line of rebuttal.

What waffling? You can’t combine two peoples arguments and call it waffling. I haven’t said not to use kyler’s past experience in making a point. Try to keep up.

That said, you’re comparing apples and oranges trying to compare coaching at different levels - which is all about leadership and playing where physical differences can make an enormous difference in success at different levels. That’s not waffling - it’s recognizing they are two very different discussions.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Facts!!! But the ones that try to defend get up and leave and the majority of this forum stay because they think alike. Lol. It’s like a cult. This post is 100% truth!! And I’ll get rebuttles and wise cracks from the peanut gallery that seem to know how to run an NFL organization! That’s the funny part. People on here making fun of KK and KM and have as much ammunition on their resume as a dude calling himself a chef and he cooks at waffle
House.
The Cardinals are worlds ahead of what we were just 4 years ago and We wouldnt be 10-5 if DHop and JJ Watt and Edmonds and Hudson were all healthy. Everyone here forgets we were 10-1 and Palmer went down and it was toast. You are so right on the Warner and Lienart debates. People were 100% Lienart and that dude never started another game for another team ever!!! Warner took us to the Super Bowl and people still said let’s start Lienart lol. We have people posting and people liking let’s start Colt McCoy against Dallas. Most in this forum are more like SNL.

Lol. There’s so much inaccuracy in this rant I can’t even decide where I’d start . . .

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

In not even three full seasons Kliff Kingsbury is 9th all time in Cardinals wins as a HC.

Again, using the cardinals as a benchmark for anything measuring success is an exercise in failure maintenance.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Murray SAID HE WASN'T watching much film. I don't have to think he isn't serious about it, he said as much.

Krang it isn’t nice of you to rely on actual facts in an argument on ASFN.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

You heard that coming out of his mouth with your own ears?

Lol. Omg. I’m actually laughing out loud.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Again, using the cardinals as a benchmark for anything measuring success is an exercise in failure maintenance.

I think that was his point.

 

[Cheesebeef]

You heard that coming out of his mouth with your own ears?

Are you serious? Come on man. It was literally quoted in a big spread on Kyler by The NY Times.

 

[Vacard]

I think most people are trying to tear him down actually. This post title alone but there are many more. This board has 10x...maybe 20x the negative posts when we lose vs when we win. People were still criticizing Kliff and Kyler when we were 7-0. It gets old man.

I agree with you on going both ways. I just posted the same thing about KK. KK has a suspect record at TT but he has proven he can win in the NFL.

Kyler has a stellar past and has proven to be an elite level talent in the NFL. Nobody thinks he is Aaron Rodgers at this point and he has a lot to learn/needs to get better but you would think he is Ryan Lindley or Drew Stanton with the level of vitriol he gets on this board. Matt Leinart, Josh Rosen, and Kevin Kolb probably got more love from this board. Remember when ASFN melted down over Warner vs Leinart? Why do people turn on their own like that? Jeez.

This especially. Never saw the goal-post moving and the criticisms that KM is receiving compared to Rosen.

 

[Red on White]

Previous losses or fadeouts during Kliff's college or NFL coaching career aren't an issue of themselves.

If they're part of his development - mistakes made, lessons learned, improve for next time. Honing his coaching craft along his journey.

The issue becomes if the event becomes a trend and mistakes are repeated.

Looking at things optimistically - Kliff (and Kyler) have a massive opportunity over the next month to forge their reputation.

Kliff can exorcise some demons. Who will care about his past record if we finish the season strong and win a couple of play-off games? Who'll doubt Kyler moving forward if he shows he can lead us to big wins when it counts?

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[nashman]

This especially. Never saw the goal-post moving and the criticisms that KM is receiving compared to Rosen.

Lol because 10% Kyler is more talented than Rosen! Kylers worst game is still better than Rosen ever was lol. Is he even in the league anymore? Kylers had a few bad games it happens he has the talent to turn it around just needs to settle down, he’s starting off too amped up. Part of the coach’s job is to call plays to get him in rhythm like most coach’s do. Playcalling has been whacked the last 3-4 games heavily lopsided when we were winning early it was very balanced. Kliff seems to have forgotten Conner and putting tons of pressure on Kyler to sling it around all day with a shotty Oline seems a little counter productive?

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

This especially. Never saw the goal-post moving and the criticisms that KM is receiving compared to Rosen.

To be fair . . .

A) Rosen never had the expectations of kyler (rightly so);
B) we only had a year (less as he didn’t begin the year as starter) to really dive into much with Rosen;
C) Rosen didn’t give a sound byte like the one kyler just did that understandably and reasonably raises eyebrows

 

[DVontel]

To be fair . . .

A) Rosen never had the expectations of kyler (rightly so);
B) we only had a year (less as he didn’t begin the year as starter) to really dive into much with Rosen;
C) Rosen didn’t give a sound byte like the one kyler just did that understandably and reasonably raises eyebrows

I think that first point is arguable. Going back in time, Rosen was looked at as a superior & polished prospect compared to Kyler, despite one going #10 & the other #1. From this board & the media.

 

[Krangodnzr]

Are you serious? Come on man. It was literally quoted in a big spread on Kyler by The NY Times.

We are in the era where half of the country believes actual news is fake news, but they believe in news from websites that have ***** pill ads all over it.

 

[juza76]

I think that first point is arguable. Going back in time, Rosen was looked at as a superior & polished prospect compared to Kyler, despite one going #10 & the other #1. From this board & the media.

Rosen wasn't accurate even in college
The only thing that made him look (for someone..) like a better prospect was the height
Every other parameters Murray was far superior

 

[Krangodnzr]

Previous losses or fadeouts during Kliff's college or NFL coaching career aren't an issue of themselves.

If they're part of his development - mistakes made, lessons learned, improve for next time. Honing his coaching craft along his journey.

The issue becomes if the event becomes a trend and mistakes are repeated.

Looking at things optimistically - Kliff (and Kyler) have a massive opportunity over the next month to forge their reputation.

Kliff can exorcise some demons. Who will care about his past record if we finish the season strong and win a couple of play-off games? Who'll doubt Kyler moving forward if he shows he can lead us to big wins when it counts?

You must be registered for see images attach

Where I take umbrage with the mention of Kliffs college record is that the structure of college football is so different compared to the NFL.

Kliff wasn't a good recruiter. Every damn recruiting service will tell you that and he even admitted it himself. So a poor recruiter at a 2nd rate school in a 2nd rate conference will never win consistently.

That right there explains Kliffs losing record at Texas Tech.

He was hired because:

1) his offenses consistently ranked amongst the top 10 or top 20 in all of college football.

2) he contributed to a high level of success for QBs whereever he coached.

My issues right now is that it appears that Kyler isn't doing the extra work to get better. And Keims past mistakes in the draft leads to depth issues when injuries strike.

Even the "dumb" timeouts that people bemoan have been been shown to be a product of how the young innovative coaches call timeouts now. The 2 minute offense looks like it might be a Kyler issue as well, since his general disinterest in his job means he isn't as mentally prepared to excel

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

I think that first point is arguable. Going back in time, Rosen was looked at as a superior & polished prospect compared to Kyler, despite one going #10 & the other #1. From this board & the media.

I don’t mean when drafted. I mean he never got to build to the expectations kyler has today.

 

[Vacard]

To be fair . . .

A) Rosen never had the expectations of kyler (rightly so);
B) we only had a year (less as he didn’t begin the year as starter) to really dive into much with Rosen;
C) Rosen didn’t give a sound byte like the one kyler just did that understandably and reasonably raises eyebrows

Bs, Rosen was crowned QBOTF the moment he was drafted and was going to be qb for the next 10 years max. No one was moving goal-posts for his mistakes and 126 passing yards per game. It was all Wilks/McCoy’s fault for Rosen’s downfall and after he was traded many STILL THOUGHT he would be a serviceable qb, so my point STANDS.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Bs, Rosen was crowned QBOTF the moment he was drafted and was going to be qb for the next 10 years max. No one was moving goal-posts for his mistakes and 126 passing yards per game. It was all Wilks/McCoy’s fault for Rosen’s downfall and after he was traded many STILL THOUGHT he would be a serviceable qb, so my point STANDS.

He was absolutely crowned QBOTF. Where did I say anything to the contrary?

As for “not moving goalposts” (whatever you mean by that), I think many of us had big misgivings about Rosen by seasons end or we wouldn’t have supported taking a QB with the first pick in the very next draft. Can’t get more out on a guy than that. And in defense of those defending Rosen back then (of which I don’t believe I was one), he did have the absolute worst coaching in the history of our cardinals as evidenced by the one-and-done tenure that we’ve never seen before. It was reasonable for the Rosen supporters yo believe his poor play could be the product of the worst coaching ever.

Also, if the goalposts have been moved in kyler it’s because he’s closing year three and his play has raised expectations. Surely you don’t think the benchmark for a third year, multiple pro bowler, should be the same as a first year QB, right?

 

[Stout]

I think that first point is arguable. Going back in time, Rosen was looked at as a superior & polished prospect compared to Kyler, despite one going #10 & the other #1. From this board & the media.

I certainly anointed him and was initially all out on drafting KM.

 

[kerouac9]

Where I take umbrage with the mention of Kliffs college record is that the structure of college football is so different compared to the NFL.

Kliff wasn't a good recruiter. Every damn recruiting service will tell you that and he even admitted it himself. So a poor recruiter at a 2nd rate school in a 2nd rate conference will never win consistently.

That right there explains Kliffs losing record at Texas Tech.

He was hired because:

1) his offenses consistently ranked amongst the top 10 or top 20 in all of college football.

2) he contributed to a high level of success for QBs whereever he coached.

My issues right now is that it appears that Kyler isn't doing the extra work to get better. And Keims past mistakes in the draft leads to depth issues when injuries strike.

Even the "dumb" timeouts that people bemoan have been been shown to be a product of how the young innovative coaches call timeouts now. The 2 minute offense looks like it might be a Kyler issue as well, since his general disinterest in his job means he isn't as mentally prepared to excel

This certainly doesn’t sound fair to Kyler. He doesn’t seem that interested in doing the mental work that (it seems) literally every other great QB does to be great, but he’s interested in doing the gym work.