Steelers West? I am waiting!!!!!!!!!!

[BigRedMO]

Whiz has this dream of making the Cards Steeler West. He gets their former players even when they are over the hill or ineffective and we are now even wearing black jerseys. They draft a NT to stuff the run instead of a QB. Whiz has had some time to build a Steeler like defense. Admittedly the season is young but look at the comparisons of the Cards and Pitts defense. Can Whiz build a defense with the Cards?

Total Yards Allowed
Cards 377.7 26th
Pitt 278.7 6th

Passing Yards Allowed
Cards 231.3 19th
Pitt 219 17th

Rushing Yards Allowed
Cards 146.3 31st
Pitt 59.7 3rd

Points Allowed
Cards 25.7 25th
Pitt 11.1 1st

Pittsburgh is playing without its number one QB too which should stress their defense. Apparently they are good at having alternative plans when their QB situation is put into disarray.

 

[BigRedMO]

2009 Stats

YPG Allowed
Cards 346.4 20th
Pitt 305.3 5th

Pass YPG
Cards 233.7 23rd
Pitt 215.4 16th

Rush YPG
Cards 112.8 17th
Pitt 89.9 3rd

Points Allowed
Cards 20.3 14th
Pitt 20.2 12th

Points allowed looks good but Steelers without Polamalu last season.

 

[Cardiac]

Pittsburgh has been doing what they do for decades now. Whiz is in his 4th year. Rome was not built in a day.

It takes time to convert a team from 4-3 personel to the 3-4 scheme.

Drafting LBers is the issue with the current regime. Missing on Buster and Cody has slowed the transition to a 3-4.

Troy P. is the difference maker on that D. When ever he goes down to injury the Steelers D becomes decent instead of dominating.

K9 and Joeshmo will soon come in to clean up any misinformation in my post.

 

[kerouac9]

Pittsburgh's defensive success begins with Dick LeBeau. Neither Clancy Pendergast or Bill Davis are Dick LeBeau. Ken Whisenhunt probably should've attended more defensive personnel meetings before becoming a head coach.

The good news is that Greg Manusky may be available from San Francisco next season. I would throw Russ Grimm money at him to bring him in here. Make him Assistant Head Coach/Defensive Coordinator and pay him $3 million a year.

Personnel problems on the defensive side of the ball were self-inflicted. Rod Graves and Ken Whisenhunt don't get off the hook because they've been unable to identify draft picks and free agents who could fit into the system in five years.

 

[Renz]

The good news is that Greg Manusky may be available from San Francisco next season. I would throw Russ Grimm money at him to bring him in here. Make him Assistant Head Coach/Defensive Coordinator and pay him $3 million a year.

Yeah, let's bring in a guy who has some of the best defensive personnel in the league, yet his defense is last in the worst division in football. Good idea.

 

[Crazy Canuck]

Pittsburgh's defensive success begins with Dick LeBeau. Neither Clancy Pendergast or Bill Davis are Dick LeBeau. Ken Whisenhunt probably should've attended more defensive personnel meetings before becoming a head coach.

The good news is that Greg Manusky may be available from San Francisco next season. I would throw Russ Grimm money at him to bring him in here. Make him Assistant Head Coach/Defensive Coordinator and pay him $3 million a year.

Personnel problems on the defensive side of the ball were self-inflicted. Rod Graves and Ken Whisenhunt don't get off the hook because they've been unable to identify draft picks and free agents who could fit into the system in five years.

Somewhat overstated, don't you think?

 

[Cardiac]

Pittsburgh's defensive success begins with Dick LeBeau. Neither Clancy Pendergast or Bill Davis are Dick LeBeau. Ken Whisenhunt probably should've attended more defensive personnel meetings before becoming a head coach.

LeBeau is as good as it gets. Thing is the D's peformance suffers when Troy is injured and LeBeau is still the coach.

The good news is that Greg Manusky may be available from San Francisco next season. I would throw Russ Grimm money at him to bring him in here. Make him Assistant Head Coach/Defensive Coordinator and pay him $3 million a year.

I'm hoping the 49ers implode fully this year and we snag Manusky right away.

Personnel problems on the defensive side of the ball were self-inflicted. Rod Graves and Ken Whisenhunt don't get off the hook because they've been unable to identify draft picks and free agents who could fit into the system in five years.

Definitly self inflicted with the poor LBer drafting. D-line has bee very good (Branch keeps it from an A+ grade). DB drafting has been better then average and the grade improves to a B if Toler and Johnson continue to improve.

I do believe even the Steelers have missed on a LBer or two. It takes more then 4 years of drafting to get the pipeline fully flowing.

 

[dogpoo32]

Add to it the fact that Whis got rid of the QB most likely to be accused of sexual assault.

 

[kerouac9]

Yeah, let's bring in a guy who has some of the best defensive personnel in the league, yet his defense is last in the worst division in football. Good idea.

The guy can coach. It's not necessarily the defense's fault that the opposing offense is given the ball in great field position over and over. IMO, Manusky is a proven commodity the last four or five years. Whom would you prefer to see?

Somewhat overstated, don't you think?

Not really. Porter's been bad. Haggans has been good. Robinson's been below-average. Calais Campbell has been good. Should we go through the list of busted draft picks and free agent signings on defense again? They've found guys here and there, but the proof is in the on-field product. Especially in the veteran free agents.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

3M for a defensive coordinator? No freaking way!

 

[BigRedRage]

The guy can coach. It's not necessarily the defense's fault that the opposing offense is given the ball in great field position over and over. IMO, Manusky is a proven commodity the last four or five years. Whom would you prefer to see?



Not really. Porter's been bad. Haggans has been good. Robinson's been below-average. Calais Campbell has been good. Should we go through the list of busted draft picks and free agent signings on defense again? They've found guys here and there, but the proof is in the on-field product. Especially in the veteran free agents.

Campbell is more than good

 

[MadCardDisease]

Pittsburgh's defensive success begins with Dick LeBeau. Neither Clancy Pendergast or Bill Davis are Dick LeBeau.

Can't argue with that. LeBeau is probably the greatest DC of all time.

The good news is that Greg Manusky may be available from San Francisco next season. I would throw Russ Grimm money at him to bring him in here. Make him Assistant Head Coach/Defensive Coordinator and pay him $3 million a year.

How has Manusky's defense done so far this year? Weren't they supposed to be a top 10 defense by now?

 

[JC_AZ]

The guy can coach. It's not necessarily the defense's fault that the opposing offense is given the ball in great field position over and over. IMO, Manusky is a proven commodity the last four or five years. Whom would you prefer to see?

I am thinking that Sing Sing might be available in the near future... what a better choice than Singletary to help us smack the 49ers consistently



quote]

 

[az1965]

Campbell is more than good

How so?

 

[DoTheDew]

Not really. Porter's been bad. Haggans has been good. Robinson's been below-average. Calais Campbell has been good. Should we go through the list of busted draft picks and free agent signings on defense again? They've found guys here and there, but the proof is in the on-field product. Especially in the veteran free agents.

I'm pretty sure you could go through most teams and find all their successes and failures and you'll see similar results. The hit rate on draft picks and FAs just plain isn't that high. FAs I think actually are worse than draft picks. If the players were at the top of their game, most of the time they are getting extended. You sign a vet FA, you're getting someone that the other team didn't want and that no one else in the league wanted more than you. That generally tells you that you're overvaluing the guy from the get go.

 

[Monty]

We need a defensive Co-ordinator of that there is no doubt but i dont think a risky and potential hire in Manusky is the answer. Their defense has been poor considering the talent availablem. If we are gonna try and entice somebdoy Id rather go for somebody like Jim Bates down in Tampa Bay. I like the system he uses that relies on quick defensive ends pressuring the quarterback and elite speed at the linebacker position considering that is the direction our defense is going. He did an excellent job at Miami when he was there and has the Bucs defense has again excelled under his command.

 

[TheHopToad]

I think we should take a flyer on Wade Phillips after he gets fired in Dallas. He's another example of a guy who is a great coordinator, but a poor head coach (ala Norv, Romeo, Charlie). He's had some pretty good D's over the years.

 

[WarnerHOF]

Can't argue with that. LeBeau is probably the greatest DC of all time.



How has Manusky's defense done so far this year? Weren't they supposed to be a top 10 defense by now?

The 49ers defense was top 5 in points given up last year, against the run and sacks. I don't think the talent on the 49ers is as great as people make it out to be. Their secondary is extremely poor and they don't have any consistent pass rushers.

The only thing you need to know is that Manusky got into the heads of HOF QBs like Peyton Manning and Kurt Warner to know he is the real deal.

 

[MadCardDisease]

The only thing you need to know is that Manusky got into the heads of HOF QBs like Peyton Manning and Kurt Warner to know he is the real deal.

You could probably say the same thing about Clancy Pendergast.

 

[Chopper0080]

Can't argue with that. LeBeau is probably the greatest DC of all time.



How has Manusky's defense done so far this year? Weren't they supposed to be a top 10 defense by now?

I understand this statement, but at what point do you look at the players that the 49ers have on defense and wonder if they aren't playing at the exact level that they should be? They have a pro bowl NT, and an solid DE in Justin Smith on the line. The best linebacker in football and ??? at linebacker. No great pass rushers here, and Takeo Spikes just got benched I think. The secondary consists of a declining Nate Clements and a bunch of avg mid round draft picks. Frankly, we have more talent on the defensive side of the ball than the 49ers.

I would love to see what Manusky could do with our personnel. Add Wade Phillips, John Fox, and Jack Del Rio to that list as well. Maybe even Ron Meeks.

 

[kerouac9]

I'm pretty sure you could go through most teams and find all their successes and failures and you'll see similar results. The hit rate on draft picks and FAs just plain isn't that high. FAs I think actually are worse than draft picks. If the players were at the top of their game, most of the time they are getting extended. You sign a vet FA, you're getting someone that the other team didn't want and that no one else in the league wanted more than you. That generally tells you that you're overvaluing the guy from the get go.

Teams just don't jettison their high draft picks and marquee FA signings within a year the way the Whis Cards have. Look around the league and find well-run teams who jettison second- and third-round picks before they can play a meaningful down. Find teams that release March free agent signings the following April. It doesn't happen except here.

I understand this statement, but at what point do you look at the players that the 49ers have on defense and wonder if they aren't playing at the exact level that they should be? They have a pro bowl NT, and an solid DE in Justin Smith on the line. The best linebacker in football and ??? at linebacker. No great pass rushers here, and Takeo Spikes just got benched I think. The secondary consists of a declining Nate Clements and a bunch of avg mid round draft picks. Frankly, we have more talent on the defensive side of the ball than the 49ers.

I would love to see what Manusky could do with our personnel. Add Wade Phillips, John Fox, and Jack Del Rio to that list as well. Maybe even Ron Meeks.

I think the talent on SF's D is being overstated, as well. Manusky can develop players, as well. Are you going to believe 3 bad games or 5 good years?

We're going to have to live with the 3-4 for the near future. Phillips is an interesting idea, but I don't think he'll be available. I'm not sure who else we'd want after him and Manusky. Not pursuing Nolan may have been a mistake.

On the other hand, Davis stymied Favre here last year... maybe the talent just isn't there.

 

[MadCardDisease]

On the other hand, Davis stymied Favre here last year... maybe the talent just isn't there.

Do you think LeBeau would be able to do much with the LB crew we have right now?

 

[Chopper0080]

Do you think LeBeau would be able to do much with the LB crew we have right now?

Not really an issue because LeBeau has been able to hide it's defenses deficiencies over the years, which is what makes him great. The only player that he hasn't been able to really work without is Troy, and having actually played football against Troy, I know why that is. Other than that, Lebeau has been able to just work with his strengths and move on.

What I am sure that LeBeau would do is just employ more exotic blitz schemes and force DRC, Toler and Rhodes to lock up man to man. It isn't ideal, but we can't stop anyone without a legit pass rush, and we don't have the personnel to generate it with 4 guys.

 

[kerouac9]

Do you think LeBeau would be able to do much with the LB crew we have right now?

Well, he won a Super Bowl with two of the four...

I think that if Lebeau were here we'd be more aggressive and unpredictable than we are now, but I don't think we'd have been stuck with THIS lb crew to begin with.

 

[MadCardDisease]

Well, he won a Super Bowl with two of the four...

I think that if Lebeau were here we'd be more aggressive and unpredictable than we are now, but I don't think we'd have been stuck with THIS lb crew to begin with.

Yeah but those are two guys they were more than willing to let go. Guys who are in the twilight of their careers.

I do agree that LeBeau would be more agressive here. I just doubt he would be as successful here compared to what he has in Pitt right now and has had. We just don't have the fire power or depth at LB IMO.