Suns @ Bucks 11-23-18

[1Sun]

The time-out he called mid-possession late in the third, while the Suns were rolling and in the process of executing one of their rare coherent offensive sets, was maybe the worst I have ever seen in all of my years of watching the league. The team is finally playing well and trusting each other, they have the Bucks on their heels, and Kokoskov destroys all of their confidence and momentum. Then, as if to reinforce his point, he went to the Suck Lineup one possession later, to make sure that the team felt adequately punished for their good play.

It's the kind of passive-aggressive cruelty you expect from a sadist with an addiction problem, not a professional coach allegedly interested in nurturing the growth of a young team. Once the competent Suns players got back on the floor, they let Crawford coach and ignored the desperate moron in the suit. Maybe they learned something, but we can sure as hell bet the coach didn't.

This × 1,000. The sooner Kokoskov is shown the door, the better.

 

[1Sun]

first, this post is savagely funny.

second, don't even get me started on the third quarter timeout that he called because now I'll match yours with the timeout he DIDN'T call that he should have. He just let the Bucks go on a blistering 12-0 run to end the third standing there with his pud in his hands. Ouch and I were incredulous... a timeout shoulda been called after they went 4-0 and it was on two pathetically easy layups. That's when a Pop calls a timeout. Stop a run before it starts. I mean, even when they cut it to 5, I thought for sure after a 7-0 run he'd do something to stop the mo. Nope. Just sat there and did nothing.

Also, as smart as it was for Crawford to literally take himself out of the game for a defensive switch there at the end... why didn't Koko already think of that?

Look, we all know this team was awful last year... but this team has looked even worse and it just shouldn't. Booker is Booker, they added a 16/10 guy at C, Holmes is a nice big off the bench, Warren is a legit weapon anywhere on the court and Bridges brings some D and extended shooting last year's team didn't have. There's no way they should be as awful as last season with those added elements to the team and yet until now, Holmes and Bridges have had to fight scratch and claw their way into getting any time. And that's all the coaches decision, which until this point, has been highly questionable.

This also x 1,000. Don't let the result fool you. Kokoskov looked as incompetent as ever this game.

 

[SirStefan32]

So I decided to watch the game once it was over. I like what I am seeing. There were some mistakes, there was a lot of luck, but their effort was there the whole game. Really good win! Most satisfying moment was watching Bledsoe lose. God, I cannot stand that little prick!

 

[Hoop Head]

I really think you are not realizing these players are actually humans with feelings that have to be managed.

Anderson has a history of success in the nba, and he had to be given a shot over a rookie till he proved a failure and a benching was justified.

Anderson's history basically came to end last year when he fell out of Houston's rotation. He hadn't been a starter for a while and since he was such a late acquisition by the Suns in what was mainly a move dumping 2 potential cancers, he should not have walked into the starting role here but he did. That's fine, he's a stretch 4 and that's the type of PF you want next to Ayton. He has sucked out loud from day 1 though. He had time to play and get his feet under him but he's done and anyone watching him can see that. He's also a terrible defender and rebounder so he was a big negative whose minutes weren't justified, let alone his starting role.

A rookie didn't take that Anderson's starting job and I wasn't one calling for that either. I wanted TJ to take that spot, like the majority of people. He was the best option to replace him as a starter. Warren's in his 5th year and has been a starter here for the last 2 years and our 2nd best player behind Booker last season. TJ losing his starting job for both Ariza and Anderson was a good way for Igor to piss off our returning players. TJ wasn't the Sixth Man to start either. JJ was typically the first player off the bench. Warren showed he had added a 3pt shot to his game and once it was clear that wasn't a fluke after a few games it was apparent he deserved to start in place of Ariza, Anderson, or Canaan if Booker was healthy and our PG.

Ariza has played much better this road trip. I think the personal problems was affecting his play.

But I think your real problem is you have unrealistic expectations for him. I don’t care how much he is being paid he is just a 3 and d role player, and you should only expect play similar to his history.

Ariza has played better, finally, and has finally started looking like who he was supposed to be. Igor may have hoped that the light would click on but it hadn't. Maybe his personal problem had him down and if that's the case then that's on Igor to recognize and make adjustment until he was ready to play hard. He wasn't a good defender or 3pt shooter for us those first dozen games but he was either leading in minutes played or was one of the top two in minutes played. I expected a 3 & D player who would play hard and lead by example but we got the wing version of Tyson, little to no effort on either end and uninterested.

His pay is an issue because I could see that being a reason he kept the starting job. I would not put it past this front office, mainly Sarver, saying that he should be starting or getting a lot of minutes since he is our 2nd highest paid player this year. If that's something they told Igor to handle then there isn't much he can do but he could have cut his minutes some. Starting him would suck but he didn't need to lead in minutes or play more than Ayton, when Booker was out, simply because he was told to start him and keep playing him. Since they gave him time off to handle his personal problems though I doubt they said his minutes couldn't be cut since he played so bad.

As far as Igor’s reluctance to use point book, booker does not want to play point guard. Why do you think he is liking Rozier’s tweets.

He is playing Canaan to give booker a break from constantly having to bring the ball up. I don’t care what anyone says he is our best pg right now, and if you actually want to win he should get time over Okobo.

I know he said he wouldn't use Booker at PG a lot heading into the year except in late game situations. That's fine, no issue there, but that hasn't happened. He knew what he had at PG when he said that and maybe he misunderstood what his PG's would give him but Booker saw more minutes there quick and it was clear that Booker at PG gave us the best chance of winning. Booker would rather not play PG but he'd also wants to win. If he can win at PG, he'll play there.

As for liking Rozier's tweet, that's not hard to figure out. Rozier is an real NBA guard. I don't think he's a point guard, probably more of an undersized combo guard like Bledsoe but that's better than what we have. He would be our starting PG and be a good defender at PG also. A good playmaker? I'm not sure. He would provide Booker backcourt help though, which is something Booker needs since he's still hobbled.

I don't think anyone minds Canaan being a backup who plays 15-20 minutes a night but he's starting at PG for us still. I know we started another lineup tonight but that was for size, so said Igor and was the same thing he said against Philly. That's not permanent and Canaan still played too much tonight. His shot wasn't falling and he was on the floor with Booker the majority of the time he played. When Booker is our starting PG, Canaan should not be sharing minutes with him. It's even worse when Canaan isn't shooting well, like the 0-5 performance tonight.

Our record gives ZERO indications that starting Canaan gives us a better chance of winning. We're 3-13 when Canaan starts. We're 1-2 when he doesn't. He missed one game and I took that into account but Booker also missed that game, which would make us 1-1 when Booker starts at PG for us instead of Canaan. Maybe Okobo should be given a chance, or Melton. When we've lost like we have we need to try some new things. I was a big supporter of Canaan before this season and wanted him to make the team more than Shaq Harrison or any of the fringe players. I pulled for him to return from injury but he's just not a good starting PG.

I am seeing consistent progress. Our turnover problem seems solved, the fast break d is much better, and the offense has been getting much better lately.

If nothing was changing for the better your gripes would be justified, but they are. And Rome wasn’t built in a day.

I am seeing some changes but I'm not sure how much is on Igor and how much is other things happening, like Ariza missing games and Bridges getting more minutes since Igor couldn't play Ariza 30+ minutes. TJ starting over Anderson is also an improvement. Chandler being waived so Holmes being our only backup big has helped also. Ayton will get better as the year goes on and Booker is getting more comfortable and his hand is getting better, all of which will help us improve. TJ starting over Anderson is the only thing Igor can be credited for directly. So I won't heap praise on him for us not being the worst in the league right now.

I want Igor to be a good coach and held out hope he would be when he was hired. I liked the hiring. After seeing him as our coach, and the head coach, I question his ability to make in game adjustments, gameplanning to maximize our talent, and his ability to inspire our players to play hard on both sides of the ball. As bad as we've been our offense is what has disappointed me the most since that was supposed to be his speciality but I've seen nothing to believe he helped build Utah's offense or any other stops in his coaching history. We're passing more and getting more assists but that doesn't matter if we're scoring the least amount of points per game and turning it over more than anyone else also. An offense with Devin Booker, TJ Warren, and Deandre Ayton should not be the worst scoring offense in the league, or in the bottom 3.

 

[NashDishesDimes]

Why is everyone bashing Kokoskov? Because a weird timeout? Chill, could have been a reason.

Saw today Suns have had second toughest schedule in the league, lots of new faces and new coach, Chillax...

 

[Errntknght]

Good post, PH. I see it much the same way.

I wish Igor didn't look so lost all the time, I doubt that he is but it doesn't instill confidence.

 

[Errntknght]

One thing that struck me in this game and in others: no one on the team seems to think they're responsible for stopping the ball at the FT line when the opponents are breaking. Just because it's an old maxim, doesn't mean it doesn't apply in this modern era. If you're in the vicinity, it's your job.

 

[Mainstreet]

Here is a replay of Crawford's game winning basket.

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He did well to get that shot over Brogdon.

 

[Mainstreet]

The big takeaway from this game is the Suns have reaffirmed their best starting lineup is Booker, Bridges, Warren, Ariza and Ayton.

Also the Suns have found their bench with the play of Crawford, Holmes and Jackson.

Suddenly the Suns have discovered an eight man rotation they can go with. Igor needs to stick with this rotation and work on his substitution pattern.

Booker was out of gas late in the game but for a series of timeouts and stoppages (which allowed him to rejuvenate) the Suns could have easily lost this game. Some of the assistant coaches like Joe Prunty need to talk to Igor about these concerns.

It could be Igor is still working through the issues of being a new head coach.

 

[1Sun]

The big takeaway from this game is the Suns have reaffirmed their best starting lineup is Booker, Bridges, Warren, Ariza and Ayton.

Also the Suns have found their bench with the play of Crawford, Holmes and Jackson.

Suddenly the Suns have discovered an eight man rotation they can go with. Igor needs to stick with this rotation and work on his substitution pattern.

Booker was out of gas late in the game but for a series of timeouts and stoppages (which allowed him to rejuvenate) the Suns could have easily lost this game. Some of the assistant coaches like Joe Prunty need to talk to Igor about these concerns.

It could be Igor is still working through the issues of being a new head coach.

How much do you want to bet Canaan is in the starting line-up the next game?...

 

[CardsSunsDbacks]

Why is everyone bashing Kokoskov? Because a weird timeout? Chill, could have been a reason.

Saw today Suns have had second toughest schedule in the league, lots of new faces and new coach, Chillax...

This. Also he is a rookie himself and thus is going to make some mistakes. He has been handed a pretty poopy first hand to work with and the team is starting to show some signs of life. Igor is about the least of our problems right now. Getting a quality NBA level point guard and adding 3-4 legit rotation level players are at the top of our list of issues right now. The team just lacks play makers and quality bench players and until they get those things this team won't be good regardless of what the coach does.

 

[devilalum]

What was that lineup he put in with a 12 point lead near the end of the third quarter? I think it was Canaan, JJ Ariza Holmes and Crawford?

Whatever it was that lineup sucked.

BAD!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[CardsSunsDbacks]

What was that lineup he put in with a 12 point lead near the end of the third quarter? I think it was Canaan, JJ Ariza Holmes and Crawford?

Whatever it was that lineup sucked.

BAD!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

He has to balance not overworking his best players with not giving too many minutes to the worthless bench players. While there would be some good to staggering Ayton, Booker and TJ there would also be the drawback that having them on the floor together is much more potent than having them staggered. Team just needs more depth and until that happens there will be times in games where we have a poopy lineup on the floor.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Good win! Suns definitely showing improvement. We have moved on from the string of 20 point losses.

Crawford is our best vet pickup in a long time.

Bridges impressed me every game.

JJ had a nice controlled game.

Canaan sucks.

I couldn’t believe Igor allowed the 12-0 run without a damn timeout to end the third quarter.

At the of the game booker jacked up a tough 3. Ayton let Bledsoe completely box him out. I mean didn’t exert even minimal effort. I was embarrassed for him watching it.

Saw a lot more effort from booker defensively when they got the Giannis mismatch on him constantly. We should expect a lot more of that from other teams, it takes a physical toll on him. But I also saw the more typical mental lapses where he allows his man to waltz to the rim unimpeded. Yuck.

Whoever said having Crawford and Canaan on court at same time is deadly for suns was spot on. I made same comment to cheese last night during game.

Despite improvement I’m losing faith in Igor because of what seem to be obvious coaching flaws. Team seems to be improving in spite of Igor.

 

[1Sun]

He has to balance not overworking his best players with not giving too many minutes to the worthless bench players. While there would be some good to staggering Ayton, Booker and TJ there would also be the drawback that having them on the floor together is much more potent than having them staggered. Team just needs more depth and until that happens there will be times in games where we have a ****** lineup on the floor.

Then at least give Okobo and Melton playing time there. Again, they can't possibly be worse than Canaan, and there is at least some hope for an NBA future for one or both of them, while Canaan clearly has no business getting NBA playing time, now or in the future. Meanwhile, let Josh Jackson play more than 10-15 minutes. These are the most basic of moves that Kokoskov still doesn't get. Instead, he continues to go back to starting Canaan and giving him 25 or so minutes of playing time while playing Ariza 40 minutes at the expense of Bridges and Jackson. Only one of several reasons Kokoskov is getting bashed (and rightfully so).

 

[JCSunsfan]

The big takeaway from this game is the Suns have reaffirmed their best starting lineup is Booker, Bridges, Warren, Ariza and Ayton.

Also the Suns have found their bench with the play of Crawford, Holmes and Jackson.

Suddenly the Suns have discovered an eight man rotation they can go with. Igor needs to stick with this rotation and work on his substitution pattern.

Booker was out of gas late in the game but for a series of timeouts and stoppages (which allowed him to rejuvenate) the Suns could have easily lost this game. Some of the assistant coaches like Joe Prunty need to talk to Igor about these concerns.

It could be Igor is still working through the issues of being a new head coach.

OK. I am willing to give Igor more slack because, well, he has too good of a reputation to be as bad as some here believe. I also believe making a change would be a horrible idea for this franchise that has no continuity. So, I am thinking that he is coaching right now more for the long view than the short view. Yeah, I am being a bit pollyanna-ish about this but that is how I am. He is working at building players and a team right now rather than just winning individual games. That's my story and I am sticking to it for now.

He is quite deliberate. He has methodically worked through players and rotations to come up with a group that seems best. I agree with you. We now have our starters. Booker, Bridges, Warren, Ariza, and Ayton. So our starting line up has TWO ROOKIES who do seem to be legit starters. That is a good draft.

That backup core of Crawford, Holmes, and Jackson seems ok. The weak link there is Jackson, but I just have to believe he will improve. Holmes has been a pleasant surprise. He is a much better option than Chriss in this role. Crawford has surprised me. His game is limited, but he knows what he can do and fills that role well (and does not try to do more than he can do).

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

That backup core of Crawford, Holmes, and Jackson seems ok. The weak link there is Jackson, but I just have to believe he will improve. Holmes has been a pleasant surprise. He is a much better option than Chriss in this role. Crawford has surprised me. His game is limited, but he knows what he can do and fills that role well (and does not try to do more than he can do).

JJ might be the weak link in that trio at present, but he also offers the most upside. If he develops he becomes the ultimate Swiss Army knife off the bench and can make our bench a real difference maker.

Holmes has been more than we could have expected. He’s tough, smart, athletic and plays with great energy. He also plays within himself. Between Ayton and Holmes we have the best center situation this franchise has ever seen.

 

[95pro]

I think JJ has been good off the bench the last three games. And maybe the last 5 games has settled things down.

 

[1Sun]

OK. I am willing to give Igor more slack because, well, he has too good of a reputation to be as bad as some here believe. I also believe making a change would be a horrible idea for this franchise that has no continuity. So, I am thinking that he is coaching right now more for the long view than the short view. Yeah, I am being a bit pollyanna-ish about this but that is how I am. He is working at building players and a team right now rather than just winning individual games. That's my story and I am sticking to it for now.

He is quite deliberate. He has methodically worked through players and rotations to come up with a group that seems best. I agree with you. We now have our starters. Booker, Bridges, Warren, Ariza, and Ayton. So our starting line up has TWO ROOKIES who do seem to be legit starters. That is a good draft.

That backup core of Crawford, Holmes, and Jackson seems ok. The weak link there is Jackson, but I just have to believe he will improve. Holmes has been a pleasant surprise. He is a much better option than Chriss in this role. Crawford has surprised me. His game is limited, but he knows what he can do and fills that role well (and does not try to do more than he can do).

The problem is that Igor is doing significant harm to Bridges, Booker, Ayton and Jackson, not "building" them, and Warren almost fell into the same category until Igor finally inserted him into the starting line-up way too late. Meanwhile, Okobo and Melton are rotting on the bench with zero playing time while Canaan, who has zero future in the NBA, let alone with this franchise, gets upwards of 25 minutes a game. And Ariza, who has zero future with this franchise, leads the team in minutes per game. Igor's moves have made absolutely no sense, for the short term OR for the long term.

 

[95pro]

I missed the game last night. Disappointing since they came away with the win.

We need to keep the starters the same. I like the 8 man rotation. We just need another wing or backup forward to fill out the rotation.

Canaan makes no difference. Okobo should at least see some minutes here and there.

King and Melton aren’t ready.

 

[1Sun]

I missed the game last night. Disappointing since they came away with the win.

We need to keep the starters the same. I like the 8 man rotation. We just need another wing or backup forward to fill out the rotation.

Canaan makes no difference. Okobo should at least see some minutes here and there.

King and Melton aren’t ready.

Agreed that King and Melton aren't ready, and yet Melton STILL would be a better option than Canaan, and if Igor refuses to play him, then at least keep him in the G-League where he can get real game playing time to have a prayer of developing.

 

[Mainstreet]

OK. I am willing to give Igor more slack because, well, he has too good of a reputation to be as bad as some here believe. I also believe making a change would be a horrible idea for this franchise that has no continuity. So, I am thinking that he is coaching right now more for the long view than the short view. Yeah, I am being a bit pollyanna-ish about this but that is how I am. He is working at building players and a team right now rather than just winning individual games. That's my story and I am sticking to it for now.

He is quite deliberate. He has methodically worked through players and rotations to come up with a group that seems best. I agree with you. We now have our starters. Booker, Bridges, Warren, Ariza, and Ayton. So our starting line up has TWO ROOKIES who do seem to be legit starters. That is a good draft.

That backup core of Crawford, Holmes, and Jackson seems ok. The weak link there is Jackson, but I just have to believe he will improve. Holmes has been a pleasant surprise. He is a much better option than Chriss in this role. Crawford has surprised me. His game is limited, but he knows what he can do and fills that role well (and does not try to do more than he can do).

We agree the Suns need to stick with Kokoskov at least for the time being. Hopefully he has been methodical as you mention.

The substitution pattern still bothers me a bit at times but hopefully it smooths out. The Suns could still use another point guard this season to back up Booker but a long term remedy is more likely this summer or at the trade deadline.

Bottom line, the Suns should not do anything rash.

 

[JCSunsfan]

JJ might be the weak link in that trio at present, but he also offers the most upside. If he develops he becomes the ultimate Swiss Army knife off the bench and can make our bench a real difference maker.

Holmes has been more than we could have expected. He’s tough, smart, athletic and plays with great energy. He also plays within himself. Between Ayton and Holmes we have the best center situation this franchise has ever seen.

The Philly complaint about Holmes was that he was tough and energetic but not smart, but he has been good for us. He is filling a PJ Tucker type of role.

 

[1Sun]

To those who somehow still believe Igor Kokoskov deserves more time here:

Will you change your tune if he goes right back to starting Canaan and benching Bridges (as he did in Chicago)?

 

[sunsfan88]

Good win on the road over a very good team.