Suns-Kings

[newfan101]

Originally posted by George O'Brien


Right now, his skills are similar to those of early James Worthy, but Worthy played with a veteran team that used his strengths rather than weaknesses.

Boy I really have to disagree with you on that one. I don't see any similarities. For one, Worthy was 6'9" and had a great post up game. He could also take players off the dribble as well as anyone his size. He was SO much smoother in his moves and shooting stroke as well. Antwain Jamison is probably the closest thing to Worthy as far as playing style. Marion is more like Cedric Ceballos with a better vertical and less of a scoring instinct.

 

[George O'Brien]

Originally posted by newfan101
Boy I really have to disagree with you on that one. I don't see any similarities. For one, Worthy was 6'9" and had a great post up game. He could also take players off the dribble as well as anyone his size. He was SO much smoother in his moves and shooting stroke as well. Antwain Jamison is probably the closest thing to Worthy as far as playing style. Marion is more like Cedric Ceballos with a better vertical and less of a scoring instinct.

Ceballos couldn't stop his grandmother from scoring.

Worthy was not an especially good shooter early on. He may have been smoother, but the key was that the Lakers offense was better organized. The Suns are still trying to figure out what their offense is supposed to be doing.

We may be using different terms: I talk about Marion not having a quick first step. Once moving, he seems to be able to cause damage in the paint and can shoot on the run.

 

[cly2tw]

Originally posted by newfan101
Boy I really have to disagree with you on that one. I don't see any similarities. For one, Worthy was 6'9" and had a great post up game. He could also take players off the dribble as well as anyone his size. He was SO much smoother in his moves and shooting stroke as well. Antwain Jamison is probably the closest thing to Worthy as far as playing style. Marion is more like Cedric Ceballos with a better vertical and less of a scoring instinct.

Thanks for the clarification, newfan101.

I never understood how people could compare Marion to Pippen or Worthy as players. The only thing comparable was probably that they all played the complementary players roles on their respective teams. But the difference is that Marion is unable to be anything else why the other two happened to share floor with two of all time best players.

 

[cly2tw]

George,

Marion is an average defender at best. He can get a lot of steals, and weakside blocks, because he is quick. But he gets easily faked out of his socks, because he is not SMOOTH, meaning he doesn't control his body motion well enough to react to the fakes of a good player. This is just a techinical deficiency of his body, which you can't do anything about. He can't STICK to his man on defense the way Kobe, Russell, JJ, or even Bowen can.

And Ceballos was actually smooth as an offensive player. He just never liked playing defense, and then became unable to, back then.

 

[hcsilla]

Originally posted by cly2tw
Did he? You wonder why the Suns are always overpaying their FAs!

I'm not sure what you meant but Redd as a restricted FA got a 11mil./3year offer sheet from DAL and MIL matched.

 

[Joe Mama]

IMO we can all forget about trading Shawn Marion unless he starts playing a lot better. First of all his BYC status makes him virtually untradable for awhile (is it during the summer or sometime next season). Secondly, there isn't a team in the NBA and would be willing to take on Marion's contract the way he has been playing. If so, the Suns would have to take on some pretty ugly contracts in return.

Many of us have disagreed with Elindholm's views on the trade this week. He was the guy on this message board most opposed to Shawn Marion's maximum contract. Hindsight is 20/20, but right now it sure looks like the Suns would have been better off losing him and getting nothing in return. That said, can you imagine what the fan reaction would have been over this last summer if the Phoenix Suns had let somebody outbid them for Shawn Marion? If Lamar Odom got a contract starting at $9 million one of those teams would have offered the same or more to Shawn Marion.

IMO Shawn Marion will never be as valuable as his contract, but I don't think for a second he is as bad as he's been playing this season. I mean he's missing the same shots he's been making for the last three seasons. I've been saying that he is an overrated defender for a long time. There's really nothing they can do about his size except switch him on to a smaller player or give him help. However my biggest complaint about his perimeter defense is fixable. I don't think it's some problem with his body and makes him jump out of issues whenever somebody shows him the ball. I just think he needs to play more disciplined.

Mike Bibby and Bobby Jackson are sure a potent combination. Last night they were really the players that killed the Phoenix Suns. Last night they were 22-41 for a combined 53 points. Mike Bibby consistently split double teams and got easy baskets for his teammates.

Joe Mama

 

[SirStefan32]

Originally posted by Joe Mama

Many of us have disagreed with Elindholm's views on the trade this week. He was the guy on this message board most opposed to Shawn Marion's maximum contract. Hindsight is 20/20, but right now it sure looks like the Suns would have been better off losing him and getting nothing in return. That said, can you imagine what the fan reaction would have been over this last summer if the Phoenix Suns had let somebody outbid them for Shawn Marion? If Lamar Odom got a contract starting at $9 million one of those teams would have offered the same or more to Shawn Marion.

IMO Shawn Marion will never be as valuable as his contractJoe Mama

I've been saying since he got his extension. I say leave him unprotected and hope he is taken in the expantion draft.

 

[Krangodnzr]

Originally posted by SirStefan32
I've been saying since he got his extension. I say leave him unprotected and hope he is taken in the expantion draft.

Even though we never agree on politics, I have to say that this might be the most brilliant idea I've ever heard.

 

[Joe Mama]

Originally posted by SirStefan32
I've been saying since he got his extension. I say leave him unprotected and hope he is taken in the expantion draft.

The Charlotte Bobcats will not take Shawn Marion in the expansion draft. They most likely would not have taken at the end of LAST season with the maximum extension.

Joe Mama

 

[fordronken]

And imagine dealing with him next season after he wasn't taken. Ouch.

 

[scudney]

Originally posted by fordronken
And imagine dealing with him next season after he wasn't taken. Ouch.

Exactly. There is no way marion would ever not be protected. He would be absolutely pissed playing for the suns knowing they wanted to get rid of him.

The C's have a little more common sense then that.

 

[George O'Brien]

Originally posted by scudney
Exactly. There is no way marion would ever not be protected. He would be absolutely pissed playing for the suns knowing they wanted to get rid of him.

The C's have a little more common sense then that.

Teams that trade players when they are doing badly ALWAYS get burned. They never get value and if the player gets out of his slump, the other team has a bargain.

When Robert Horry had a physical altercation with Danny Aigne, the Suns effectively dumped him for cap space. Horry went on to play a key role in three Laker championships and this year received a $4.9 million contract from the Spurs.

 

[SirStefan32]

Originally posted by Krangthebrain
Even though we never agree on politics, I have to say that this might be the most brilliant idea I've ever heard.

Thank you, but I doubt C's would have the balls to leave him unprotected.