Suns @ Lakers Friday game thread, October 25th, 2024

[Cheesebeef]

You don't think Book is Elite? Prior to Durant and with Paul he was

Dude’s never cracked the top 5 of scorers in the league. He’s just at the edge, but I think his SOMEWHAT lack of athleticism separates him from the other elite guys who can get to the hole with abandon. That little burst of athleticism is the separator there, IMO.

It’s not a huge separation, but it’s there.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I'm sympathetic to the idea, but no one is giving up much value for Durant, so it's really only Booker, and I don't think he brings back multiple lottery picks, which is what the Suns need.

Agree to disagree on KD. I think the Olympics and general stat line. A still excite those not really paying attention. Not with blockbuster return, mind you, but at least a couple first rounders where if we try to have foresight and push those to the future, maybe we get lucky down the road.

But this team is on total rebuild more. Those Book picks won’t be lotto picks most likely either, but gotta start throwing darts at the board, regardless.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I'm sympathetic to the idea, but no one is giving up much value for Durant, so it's really only Booker, and I don't think he brings back multiple lottery picks, which is what the Suns need.

Hey… can’t send you a PM because I think I’m on your ignore list. Take it off for a day. Want to ask you a question (not for anything but a real convo about something else. No troll or any kind of BS otherwise.)

 

[Covert Rain]

That's up to Bud to demand this from the team or fix the cause.

I seriously doubt his job will be in jeopardy after the Suns moved on from Frank Vogel so quickly.

At what point do you stop blaming coaches and systems?! When the common denominator are the players on this team there is no denying it.

 

[Phrazbit]

Agree to disagree on KD. I think the Olympics and general stat line. A still excite those not really paying attention. Not with blockbuster return, mind you, but at least a couple first rounders where if we try to have foresight and push those to the future, maybe we get lucky down the road.

But this team is on total rebuild more. Those Book picks won’t be lotto picks most likely either, but gotta start throwing darts at the board, regardless.

The problem with trading Durant is... where... where do we send him that would want him and has cap space to take him and has assets to send back AND isn't over the apron? Oh, and that Durant would actually want to go there, no one is trading for him unless he expressly wants to play for them.

The contract math is especially difficult.

Booker, being much younger and not being toxic, we could probably land a hefty haul for him, but unless we trade him for our picks back, all we're doing is guaranteeing that Houston, Washington and whoever else owns our picks/swaps gets a brand new top 5 pick for the next 5 seasons straight.

 

[Hoop Head]

At what point do you stop blaming coaches and systems?! When the common denominator are the players on this team there is no denying it.

He's not blaming Bud though. Clearly we need a leader and it seems he hopes Bud can be that since no one has stepped up to lead in a positive way on the court. What's the issue, since according to you, someone hoping a coach gets the players to fall in is akin to blaming the coach for something. That's not me putting words in your mouth either, it's clear as day.


I won't be surprised when your panties get twisted and you tried to take this in another direction. You've lost the benefit of doubt with me. You force views on others, like you did here saying Mainstreet is blaming Budenholzer.

 

[Phrazbit]

It's only 2 games, the sky hasn't come crashing down yet but I see two major problems.

1. Nurkic is terrible. Skinny Nurk is even worse than kinda tubby Nurk. I don't know how we fix out center problem. Plumlee sucks too.

2. A ball movement, cutting, 3 point, fast paced offense is nice and all, but it's not going to work when the guy who is supposed to shoot the most plays totally separate from the rest of the offense.

 

[Hoop Head]

The problem with trading Durant is... where... where do we send him that would want him and has cap space to take him and has assets to send back AND isn't over the apron? Oh, and that Durant would actually want to go there, no one is trading for him unless he expressly wants to play for them.

The contract math is especially difficult.

Booker, being much younger and not being toxic, we could probably land a hefty haul for him, but unless we trade him for our picks back, all we're doing is guaranteeing that Houston, Washington and whoever else owns our picks/swaps gets a brand new top 5 pick for the next 5 seasons straight.

Houston. Get our picks and filler. They've got contracts to make it work. KD went to college in Texas. There's a good coach there in Udoka and they'd have a cast to accommodate him to a certain degree.

 

[Cheesebeef]

It's only 2 games, the sky hasn't come crashing down yet but I see two major problems.

1. Nurkic is terrible. Skinny Nurk is even worse than kinda tubby Nurk. I don't know how we fix out center problem. Plumlee sucks too.

2. A ball movement, cutting, 3 point, fast paced offense is nice and all, but it's not going to work when the guy who is supposed to shoot the most plays totally separate from the rest of the offense.

It’s just a rudderless ship again. Even with a new offense and PG. there just ain’t that guy to be THE guy who stirs the entire team’s drink and makes all the ingredients come together.

 

[Phrazbit]

Houston. Get our picks and filler. They've got contracts to make it work. KD went to college in Texas. There's a good coach there in Udoka and they'd have a cast to accommodate him to a certain degree.

I don't see any shot that Houston convinces themselves that KD fits their timeline, Booker maybe, but no shot it would be KD.

 

[Phrazbit]

It’s just a rudderless ship again. Even with a new offense and PG. there just ain’t that guy to be THE guy who stirs the entire team’s drink and makes all the ingredients come together.

I honestly think this offense should be deadly... they just need KD to be willing to move off the ball, work to get open and take open shots.

He doesn't have an interest in doing any of that. He is a statue, when he doesn't have the ball, he plays slow as molasses and he takes awful shots... he's a great shooter, so a lot of them go in, but there just isn't a lot of value there.

If this team is a drink, then it's something like a Manhattan... only with the bourbon set aside in a shot glass.

 

[CardNots]

a mountain of free throws at home equals a win every time

 

[taz02]

Relying so heavily on three point shooting will end badly. I don't believe this team has the mental fortitude to make those shots in big high pressure games.

Plus, launching one three after another is boring to watch. The highlight in last nights game was the commercial where Giannis dunked on the Bulls.

Looks to me like the same team from last season with more 3pt shooting.

 

[Sparky16]

You don't think Book is Elite? Prior to Durant and with Paul he was

Paul had so much more of a positive impact than Durant - to bad he physically broke down. WTH am I watching the Big 3 handle the ball draining the shot clock leading to a bad shot or turnover again? We got 2 PG in the off season - how about they play off the ball and do some motion to get open instead of playing 1 on 3 while the other 2 just stand in corners? The most entertaining part of the game was the back end of the 1st qtr when the back-ups came in playing team ball instead of big 3 we are superstars ball

 

[Sparky16]

It's only 2 games, the sky hasn't come crashing down yet but I see two major problems.

1. Nurkic is terrible. Skinny Nurk is even worse than kinda tubby Nurk. I don't know how we fix out center problem. Plumlee sucks too.

2. A ball movement, cutting, 3 point, fast paced offense is nice and all, but it's not going to work when the guy who is supposed to shoot the most plays totally separate from the rest of the offense.

Nurkic is trash, he is not Ayton trash but still trash. How about he try playing D and getting boards instead of acting like the game is a globetrotter exhibition with his clown passes that lead to easy buckets on the other end? I am already OK with starting Oso

 

[Proximo]

Relying so heavily on three point shooting will end badly. I don't believe this team has the mental fortitude to make those shots in big high pressure games.

Plus, launching one three after another is boring to watch. The highlight in last nights game was the commercial where Giannis dunked on the Bulls.

Looks to me like the same team from last season with more 3pt shooting.

i don't agree with that. Boston just won a title by shooting a ton of 3's and they have already ramped it up even higher.

Statistically the Suns 3 point shooting percentage is just about as good as Boston's.

Basically I think the Sun's only hope of being relevant is shooting the crap out of the three.

 

[Proximo]

Nurkic is trash, he is not Ayton trash but still trash. How about he try playing D and getting boards instead of acting like the game is a globetrotter exhibition with his clown passes that lead to easy buckets on the other end? I am already OK with starting Oso

Nurk isn't very good, but he is capable of not being much of a negative. Basically you tell him to stay out of the offense as much as possible.

 

[elindholm]

Hey… can’t send you a PM because I think I’m on your ignore list. Take it off for a day. Want to ask you a question (not for anything but a real convo about something else. No troll or any kind of BS otherwise.)

Huh, that's weird, I haven't had you on Ignore for at least a few years. I just sent you a message.

 

[AzStevenCal]

The problem with trading Durant is... where... where do we send him that would want him and has cap space to take him and has assets to send back AND isn't over the apron? Oh, and that Durant would actually want to go there, no one is trading for him unless he expressly wants to play for them.

The contract math is especially difficult.

Booker, being much younger and not being toxic, we could probably land a hefty haul for him, but unless we trade him for our picks back, all we're doing is guaranteeing that Houston, Washington and whoever else owns our picks/swaps gets a brand new top 5 pick for the next 5 seasons straight.

At this point I no longer care if other teams benefit from our losing record, this team simply doesn't have a chance to compete at the highest level. We should be an above average team this season and I like watching young players develop. So I'm okay if we stay the course realizing that a first or second round exit is our peak but I'd rather we recognize the awful truth. That being, we, on our best day and with everything swinging our way, can not match up with Boston, OKC and probably several others.

And the gap is just going to widen each year even if our two rookies develop well. I would say, no panic moves, but settle for whatever appears to be market value for KD, Booker, Nurkic and if he's agreeable, Beal. Even if all we accomplish is to rid ourselves of a lot of salary, we'd at least have a path to take. If nothing else, we'd be able to put our cap space to work in order to rebuild our draft assets.

It won't be pretty and it won't be easy but either we're actually shooting for the top spot or we're not. And right now, we're locked into the "not" category. JMO

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

The Suns were 15-17 from the free throw line, while the Lakers were 29-39.

That's 22 more free throw attempts for the Lakers.

Makes sense. The suns almost never drive the paint or created contact. Lakers play almost exclusively in the paint.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

I'm sympathetic to the idea, but no one is giving up much value for Durant, so it's really only Booker, and I don't think he brings back multiple lottery picks, which is what the Suns need.

The pistons would 100% give up multiple lottery picks for Booker.

 

[Mainstreet]

At what point do you stop blaming coaches and systems?! When the common denominator are the players on this team there is no denying it.

I'm actually pointing the opposite direction. It's not the coach or the system that is the problem.

If there is a problem with the Suns, Mike Budenholzer has the credibility to find and fix the cause, especially after their decline under Monty Williams and Frank Vogel.

It's not the losing that bothers me, it's the quit or lack of fire in the team.

This is where the Suns miss players like Jae Crowder and Chris Paul. Players that despise losing and have some fire in their gut.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Dude’s never cracked the top 5 of scorers in the league. He’s just at the edge, but I think his SOMEWHAT lack of athleticism separates him from the other elite guys who can get to the hole with abandon. That little burst of athleticism is the separator there, IMO.

It’s not a huge separation, but it’s there.

The fact that book got shook by Reaves last night but couldn’t do the same to him just screamed how pedestrian his footspeed is.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Paul had so much more of a positive impact than Durant - to bad he physically broke down. WTH am I watching the Big 3 handle the ball draining the shot clock leading to a bad shot or turnover again? We got 2 PG in the off season - how about they play off the ball and do some motion to get open instead of playing 1 on 3 while the other 2 just stand in corners? The most entertaining part of the game was the back end of the 1st qtr when the back-ups came in playing team ball instead of big 3 we are superstars ball

Beal seems to have fit into the new offense the best.

 

[Chaplin]

Makes sense. The suns almost never drive the paint or created contact. Lakers play almost exclusively in the paint.

And... they're the Lakers.