Suns Pick Up Options on Goodwin, Len, and Warren

Phrazbit

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Teletovic was waived because he wouldn't accept their low offer. The story I heard was his camp felt he was being lowballled because they weren't sure about how he'd return health-wise, not because he hadn't previously had value on the court. I don't really have any perspective on this but Weems was an all Euro-League player and I believe he was considered to be the best shooting guard in Europe. And IMO Leuer has shown he needs to be in the rotation.

We might find it laughable in a year or two that 12 or 13 players on this team thought they deserved regular minutes but right now I think that's uncontestable. I'm used to a roster that has 9 or 10 regular players and the rest are mostly cheerleaders.

I'm not contesting that this team has a TON of guys who are competing for playing time, what I'm saying is that it is not because we're so very deep, but rather because we're so short on guys who have proven anything.

It might be semantics, but IMO depth, like the depth of those 90s Suns is a team that has multiple guys coming off the bench who could easily be starers elsewhere, opposed to our current depth where multiple guys off the bench think they deserve to play because the other guys at their position are just as unproven as they are. I doubt anyone around the league is looking at guys on our bench and saying "they could start for us".
 

Catlover

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I'm not contesting that this team has a TON of guys who are competing for playing time, what I'm saying is that it is not because we're so very deep, but rather because we're so short on guys who have proven anything.

It might be semantics, but IMO depth, like the depth of those 90s Suns is a team that has multiple guys coming off the bench who could easily be starers elsewhere, opposed to our current depth where multiple guys off the bench think they deserve to play because the other guys at their position are just as unproven as they are. I doubt anyone around the league is looking at guys on our bench and saying "they could start for us".

I think it is semantics. Other than Archie and Price, I think every other player we've talked about would be in the rotation for most teams. Okay, not Teletovic as is but Teletovic as he was prior to the blood clots. Maybe they'd be the last person to get regular minutes off the bench but I do think they'd get them.

I don't say "we are extremely deep" and mean "we have a great bench". I just think we have an awful long list of players that expect and probably warrant court time. But I don't think you can consistently go more than 9 or 10 deep in this league unless you have a handful of geriatric stars that can rest and still turn it on at will.
 

Catlover

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Really?

Who here has said they "hate" him? You look at this thread and the things people are saying about Archie (fact based critiques based on his statistical results) and what people had to say about Morris this summer (essentially "screw that guy, I despise him"). To somehow say that Goodwin is getting ripped worse than Morris is not only off base, its down right idiotic.

I have seen no Goodwin hate here. I've seen some Goodwin love that seems difficult to justify but no hate. We'd all love the little light bulb to go on for the guy but not every great athlete becomes a great basketball player. Weems has talked his time in Europe and having to learn how to "think the game" instead of just play the game. Even if he never played a minute for us, Sonny would be a great investment if he could share that ability with Archie.
 

elindholm

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To me, "depth" would mean that you have players on the Suns who are getting less playing time than they would on an average NBA team, because there are too many other good players at their position or on the roster in general.

By that standard, the Suns do not have "depth." None of Teletovic, Weems, Goodwin, or Price would be getting more time on any other decent team. Goodwin is a late first-round pick who, like most late first-round picks, has shown enough talent to have been drafted in the first round, but doesn't have the complete package. The others are career 11th men who wouldn't have an important role anywhere.
 

Catlover

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To me, "depth" would mean that you have players on the Suns who are getting less playing time than they would on an average NBA team, because there are too many other good players at their position or on the roster in general.

By that standard, the Suns do not have "depth." None of Teletovic, Weems, Goodwin, or Price would be getting more time on any other decent team. Goodwin is a late first-round pick who, like most late first-round picks, has shown enough talent to have been drafted in the first round, but doesn't have the complete package. The others are career 11th men who wouldn't have an important role anywhere.

I disagree on Teletovic, he averaged 20 minutes a game the two seasons prior. I've been impressed by what I've read and what I've seen with Weems but I might change my mind as we see more of him. Regardless of your definition though, I think we have too many players that anticipate being a part of the rotation. Bledsoe, Knight, Warren, Morris, Chandler, Len, Weems, Booker, Tucker, Leuer and Teletovic makes 11 of them.
 

elindholm

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I disagree on Teletovic, he averaged 20 minutes a game the two seasons prior.

On bad teams that were ravaged by injuries. Someone has to take the floor. The guy's 30 years old, is supposed to be a shooter, and can't crack 40% from the field for his career.

I think we have too many players that anticipate being a part of the rotation.

That's true for nearly any NBA team until roles get sorted out. Very few players are content being a bench-warmer. The fact that NBA teams carry 13 players and regularly use only 9 isn't a "depth" issue.
 

BC867

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Very few players are content being a bench-warmer. The fact that NBA teams carry 13 players and regularly use only 9 isn't a "depth" issue.
It is a management issue. I wonder if Jeff has the fortitude to make strong decisions, give it a chance and keep the players on board while doing so.

Some coaches have the knack. Some don't.
 
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