Suns @ Thunder Sunday game thread 5-2-2021

[JCSunsfan]

Even if Ayton is somewhere in between he should be fine.

All I know those Thunder players were whizzing by him last night completely indifferent to him. He seems to be a step slow the past several games.

He seems to play better on the road. I haven't looked at stats, so I might be wrong.

Maybe its that new baby keeping him up all night. Any of you remember what that was like?

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[Cheesebeef]

He seems to play better on the road. I haven't looked at stats, so I might be wrong.

Maybe its that new baby keeping him up all night. Any of you remember what that was like?

wait... first it was the new baby and fatherhood is making him better when he was on that roll and now it’s making him worse because it’s keeping him up a night?

For as long as I’ve been a Suns fan, I’ve never seen another high profile player have so many excuses made for his inconsistent play. It’s comical at this point.

he just doesn’t have a superstar’s motor.

 

[Chaplin]

wait... first it was the new baby and fatherhood is making him better when he was on that roll and now it’s making him worse because it’s keeping him up a night?

For as long as I’ve been a Suns fan, I’ve never seen another high profile player have so many excuses made for his inconsistent play. It’s comical at this point.

he just doesn’t have a superstar’s motor.

To be fair, it's the fans making the excuses, not the player. The player has been silent on why he can't be consistent.

 

[JCSunsfan]

wait... first it was the new baby and fatherhood is making him better when he was on that roll and now it’s making him worse because it’s keeping him up a night?

For as long as I’ve been a Suns fan, I’ve never seen another high profile player have so many excuses made for his inconsistent play. It’s comical at this point.

he just doesn’t have a superstar’s motor.

Cmon. You had/have kids right? Firstborn comes and you are all proud and you get serious about life and focus. Then comes the reality of living with 2 am screaming and bottles. I am not trying to make excuses, just trying to look at the guy and his life and speculate a little. And speculation is all it is. That's kinda the fun of a message board.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Cmon. You had/have kids right? Firstborn comes and you are all proud and you get serious about life and focus. Then comes the reality of living with 2 am screaming and bottles. I am not trying to make excuses, just trying to look at the guy and his life and speculate a little. And speculation is all it is. That's kinda the fun of a message board.

dude, most of these NBA players have kids. I’ve seen you both credit fatherhood for better play and now blame It for poor play... on a road game. At least pick a lane for the excuse du jour.

and his inconsistency pre-dates becoming a father.

I just think it’s silly the variety of excuses made for Ayton at this point.

 

[Cheesebeef]

To be fair, it's the fans making the excuses, not the player. The player has been silent on why he can't be consistent.

Okay... never implied Ayton was making excuses. My post was simply about the fans doing so.

 

[JCSunsfan]

dude, most of these NBA players have kids. I’ve seen you both credit fatherhood for better play and now blame It for poor play... on a road game. At least pick a lane for the excuse du jour.

and his inconsistency pre-dates becoming a father.

I just think it’s silly the variety of excuses made for Ayton at this point.

My goodness. Maybe chill a little?

I was making a lighthearted comment about what its like to be a dad of new baby--even added the pic for a little humor. I was kinda expecting, "oh yeah. I remember that" responses rather than a technical analysis of whether that is the issue or not.

Maybe I shoulda added this: NOT INTENDED TO BE TAKEN AS DEEP OR SERIOUS BASKETBALL ANALYSIS.

 

[elindholm]

I was making a lighthearted comment about what its like to be a dad of new baby--even added the pic for a little humor. I was kinda expecting, "oh yeah. I remember that" responses rather than a technical analysis of whether that is the issue or not.

It's a valid point, but (a) probably none of us became new parents with the luxury of an eight-figure salary and (b) fathers vary a lot in how much they are involved, or want to be involved, in the very early stages of child rearing. And given that Ayton's problems date back to before when he was drafted -- you know, his early 20s -- I think the "new father" excuse probably doesn't hold water.

 

[Cheesebeef]

My goodness. Maybe chill a little?

I was making a lighthearted comment about what its like to be a dad of new baby--even added the pic for a little humor. I was kinda expecting, "oh yeah. I remember that" responses rather than a technical analysis of whether that is the issue or not.

Maybe I shoulda added this: NOT INTENDED TO BE TAKEN AS DEEP OR SERIOUS BASKETBALL ANALYSIS.

Lol... “my goodness... chill a little.” Did you just feel attacked because I merely disagreed with you?

 

[Chris_Sanders]

How about his turnover rate? I'd guess that it's also higher.

No it's the same as Ayton and Paul at 0.2, which is in the 75ish rank amongst player. Also the same as his steal rate so it's really a wash.

Some big names and some familiar names in that top 20 of turnover rate.

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[AzStevenCal]

Our defense was poor last night because Ayton was stuck in mud. But for the season we have a very good defense and IMO he's the main reason for it, not the only reason, just the most irreplaceable part of it. I don't think it's a coincidence that his slo-mo nights seem to coincide with the nights we complain the most about team defense and our inability to hold leads.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Our defense was poor last night because Ayton was stuck in mud. But for the season we have a very good defense and IMO he's the main reason for it, not the only reason, just the most irreplaceable part of it. I don't think it's a coincidence that his slo-mo nights seem to coincide with the nights we complain the most about team defense and our inability to hold leads.

this is fair.

I think the most frustrating thing about Ayton is in trying to figure out what would be the missing piece to make them dominant, where we wouldn’t worry about playing a healthy Lakers or Nets team, the answer is Ayton himself actually reaching his potential night in, night out.

 

[Covert Rain]

For those of you think everyone is making excuses for Ayton. Calling out facts that he has played shortened seasons isn't an excuse. It's a fact. Not many 3rd year players who are future stars on their team have missed that many games unless it is because of injury. I make ZERO excuses for the REASONS for some of this time missed because he seems to not have his head screwed on straight just yet. Which is linked to why he has mental lapses. I don't think it's motor related one bit. I think it's all mental which is a scary thought for long term consistency.

 

[Mainstreet]

Monty talks about Ayton's performance.

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[Cheesebeef]

For those of you think everyone is making excuses for Ayton. Calling out facts that he has played shortened seasons isn't an excuse. It's a fact. Not many 3rd year players who are future stars on their team have missed that many games unless it is because of injury. I make ZERO excuses for the REASONS for some of this time missed because he seems to not have his head screwed on straight just yet. Which is linked to why he has mental lapses. I don't think it's motor related one bit. I think it's all mental which is a scary thought for long term consistency.

everyone played a shortened season last year. did Ayton screw himself by missing more? Yes. But again, rounding into the end of his third year, his game should ASCENDING, not going backwards. If anything, with a short-season... ah forget it.

make all the excuses y'all want.

also I think mental and motor go hand in hand.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Speaking of not missing someone when they are out. Worst clutch plus minus on the team

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Lol. How significant is that data set?

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

To be fair, it's the fans making the excuses, not the player. The player has been silent on why he can't be consistent.

True. Though in his mind he might think there’s no need to make excuses for inconsistency because he’s DOMINAYTON!!!

 

[Mainstreet]

Our defense was poor last night because Ayton was stuck in mud. But for the season we have a very good defense and IMO he's the main reason for it, not the only reason, just the most irreplaceable part of it. I don't think it's a coincidence that his slo-mo nights seem to coincide with the nights we complain the most about team defense and our inability to hold leads.

If we only knew what triggers Ayton's on/off button. It was obvious Chris Paul was trying to discuss strategy during the game. If it was a player just one player posing a challenge it would be less of a concern but the Thunder were scoring almost at will in the paint. The Suns help defense was not at it's best so it wasn't all Ayton but still he is the Suns last line of defense.

 

[Covert Rain]

everyone played a shortened season last year. did Ayton screw himself by missing more? Yes. But again, rounding into the end of his third year, his game should ASCENDING, not going backwards. If anything, with a short-season... ah forget it.

make all the excuses y'all want.

also I think mental and motor go hand in hand.

Facts are not excuses. Nowhere did I excuse the reasons. Are you also saying he is not better this year than the first two? I believe that is the definition of ascending.....maybe not ascending as fast as he should but.....

ahhhh...never mind.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Facts are not excuses. Nowhere did I excuse the reasons. Are you also saying he is not better this year than the first two? I believe that is the definition of ascending.....maybe not ascending as fast as he should but.....

ahhhh...never mind.

Almost every measurable statistic other than shooting percentage is either the same or down. Almost every. Single. One. His defense is improved, but has been more wildly inconsistent toward the latter part of the year and his hands seem worse this season. He’s definitely not ascending.

now, don’t take that statement of facts and observation the wrong way - he’s still a huge contributor to the suns being where they are. In fact, no way they would be in contention for a top seed without his presence. He’s incredibly impactful for this squad. But that doesn’t mean (a) that he’s above criticism; and (b) that he’s not failing to ascend.

 

[Covert Rain]

Almost every measurable statistic other than shooting percentage is either the same or down. Almost every. Single. One. His defense is improved, but has been more wildly inconsistent toward the latter part of the year and his hands seem worse this season. He’s definitely not ascending.

now, don’t take that statement of facts and observation the wrong way - he’s still a huge contributor to the suns being where they are. In fact, no way they would be in contention for a top seed without his presence. He’s incredibly impactful for this squad. But that doesn’t mean (a) that he’s above criticism; and (b) that he’s not failing to ascend.

(A). Never ever said he was above criticism (I have done plenty of that). My problem is the over the top crap. (B). That's what I am saying. Also, I have not done an update as of the last 15 games or so. For a large chunk of the season I posted his numbers and he was up there with the rest of the league at his position. However, you are right about his overall numbers being down in multiple areas. We also have CP3 and Ayton is no longer the second option on the team. I would argue despite the inconsistency he is more impactful this year than the previous two. His play as of late is definitely cause for concern and he needs to get back on track before the playoffs if we are going to make a run.

This team is going to live or die by two players in the playoffs as X-factors. IMO that is Ayton and Bridges. We know what we are going to get out of Booker and CP3 but those two players will make the team impossible to stop if they are on as well.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

(A). Never ever said he was above criticism (I have done plenty of that). My problem is the over the top crap. (B). That's what I am saying. Also, I have not done an update as of the last 15 games or so. For a large chunk of the season I posted his numbers and he was up there with the rest of the league at his position. However, you are right about his overall numbers being down in multiple areas. We also have CP3 and Ayton is no longer the second option on the team. I would argue despite the inconsistency he is more impactful this year than the previous two. His play as of late is definitely cause for concern and he needs to get back on track before the playoffs if we are going to make a run.

This team is going to live or die by two players in the playoffs as X-factors. IMO that is Ayton and Bridges. We know what we are going to get out of Booker and CP3 but those two players will make the team impossible to stop if they are on as well.

I think Ayton/bridges are definitely X factors. I’d throw the bench in there too. Will their effectiveness remain high when other teams tighten rotations and they have to play more against top line talent or their minutes decrease?

 

[95pro]

I think Ayton/bridges are definitely X factors. I’d throw the bench in there too. Will their effectiveness remain high when other teams tighten rotations and they have to play more against top line talent or their minutes decrease?

In a 7 game series, i think our deep bench is going to payoff big time.

We dont have to rely on bridges getting hot, but we do need Ayton to remain consistent. If Ayton can be a 10-15/10 guy then we should keep on doing well.

 

[JCSunsfan]

Our depth is one of the main reasons our record is what it is. More players can carry, which means stars can play within themselves and not press, that produces less injuries AND the ability to win when injuries do come. I think the depth has really been good for CP3.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Our depth is one of the main reasons our record is what it is. More players can carry, which means stars can play within themselves and not press, that produces less injuries AND the ability to win when injuries do come. I think the depth has really been good for CP3.

I think depth is a primary driver of regular success. I think it loses some impact in the playoffs.