Suns to Make a Play for Howard

[Covert Rain]

So, Gambo today said the Suns are in a position to hand out 2 max contracts next season. Currently no other team in the NBA can do that at the moment. Some teams could shed salary and players to get there but at the moment it's only the Suns.

He said the Suns are interested in Howard and could offer something other teams can't. He was referring to the possibility of CP, Williams or both being on the market and asking Howard which one he wants. They could use that as a selling point to Howard to say pick which one you want and we will make an offer. Supposedly selling it to him that no other team can dangle the same kind of carrot.

The problem with this scenario is you have to entertain for one second that Howard would even come here. Personally I think after a small market in Orlando he wants something bigger. Second, I don't think the Suns are good destination any longer thanks to Sarver. Last but not least there is also no guarantee if you managed to get Howard by some miracle that it automatically means you will get lucky twice and be able to get CP or Williams. Again assuming they they even hit the market.

Dreaming is free I guess. Having said that Sarver would probably charge for that too if he could find a way to do it.

 

[TheHopToad]

Gambo said

You lost me after that part...

 

[BillsCarnage]

Dreaming is free I guess. Having said that Sarver would probably charge for that too if he could find a way to do it.

Uh yeah, look for ticket prices to be raised after this season.

Sarver, "Our fans want a championship, so now it's time for the to pay for that with higher ticket prices."

Translation: Kevin Love here we come!!

 

[sunsfan88]

Forget Howard or CP3, if the Suns could somehow even get Westbrook & Love, I'd be impressed.

Maybe we can pull a trade off for both of them THIS season? OKC has been unhappy with Westbrook's ball distribution ability, so maybe we can send Nash to OKC for him?

If Westbrook says something like "I'm only going to sign an extension with PHX because there I can play with another superstar for years to come" then I think other teams will back off and the market will be low for him leaving Nash as the best offer OKC can get.

Going after Kevin Love will make the deal even more sweeter for both Love & Westbrook since they used to be teammates back in college.

Love would also have to something like Westbrook said.

But I have no idea what we can offer for Love cause it's not going to be Gortat or Dudley. Maybe if Lopez can have a strong season, then Minny will take him + draft picks?

Yes this is all my dream.

 

[Covert Rain]

Forget Howard or CP3, if the Suns could somehow even get Westbrook & Love, I'd be impressed.

Maybe we can pull a trade off for both of them THIS season? OKC has been unhappy with Westbrook's ball distribution ability, so maybe we can send Nash to OKC for him?

If Westbrook says something like "I'm only going to sign an extension with PHX because there I can play with another superstar for years to come" then I think other teams will back off and the market will be low for him leaving Nash as the best offer OKC can get.

Going after Kevin Love will make the deal even more sweeter for both Love & Westbrook since they used to be teammates back in college.

Love would also have to something like Westbrook said.

But I have no idea what we can offer for Love cause it's not going to be Gortat or Dudley. Maybe if Lopez can have a strong season, then Minny will take him + draft picks?

Yes this is all my dream.

No way I would take those 2 over Howard and CP3....it's not even close. However, that would be decent consolation IMO.

 

[Bert]

I'll believe it when I see it.

Cmon guys, why would we sign Howard to a max contract? We could get 3 grappy players for the same amount of money!

 

[elindholm]

Remember about eight years ago when the same guy said that the Suns would land both Bryant and McGrady? Credibility isn't a priority.

 

[sunsfan88]

No way I would take those 2 over Howard and CP3....it's not even close. However, that would be decent consolation IMO.

Lol neither would I but at this point I think it's more than likely that CP3 goes to NY, Howard goes to either LA or NJ.

 

[Covert Rain]

I'll believe it when I see it.

Cmon guys, why would we sign Howard to a max contract? We could get 3 grappy players for the same amount of money!

Agree. Can't think of a reason Howard would come here.

Remember about eight years ago when the same guy said that the Suns would land both Bryant and McGrady? Credibility isn't a priority.

That's the truth. However, in this case he was only speculating the Suns would make a play for Howard. The rest was conjecture on his part.

 

[JS22]

Remember about eight years ago when the same guy said that the Suns would land both Bryant and McGrady? Credibility isn't a priority.

He brought that up again yesterday. He is insistent that the Suns had interest in both. I don't think he ever said they'd land them though.

Even though he is incredibly annoying he seems to have pretty decent sources inside the organization.

 

[elindholm]

Even though he is incredibly annoying he seems to have pretty decent sources inside the organization.

All I know about him is what I read on this board, but I'm at a loss to understand how this impression about him persists. His "sources" within the organization either don't exist or deliberately feed him bogus information just to get a rise out of him.

 

[Gaddabout]

His source is usually Sarver. I think Sarver toys with him, not because it's to Sarver's advantage, but because I honestly believe Sarver loves playing that game. They are allegedly close family friends.

I'm still at a loss (a) What the Suns have to offer other teams and (b) Why any player would want to come here to play with Father Time and the 10 Dwarves.

 

[HooverDam]

If Jerry Colangelo was still running things here we could entertain the idea of big time free agents being interested in playing for the Suns. Because of Jerry the Suns were a small/mid market team that had the cache of a bigger market. Sarver has destroyed all that good will and once Nash finally retires I imagine we're in for a long, bleak trail of tears.

When a guy as nice and all around classy as Nash turns on an owner, you know he's a real turdbag. I pray for the day Jerry C decides he's had enough, rallies up a group of local investors and stages a coup down at USAC.

 

[elindholm]

Father Time and the 10 Dwarves.

LOL, excellent! I may have to steal that as a fantasy team name.

 

[TJ]

If Jerry Colangelo was still running things here we could entertain the idea of big time free agents being interested in playing for the Suns. Because of Jerry the Suns were a small/mid market team that had the cache of a bigger market. Sarver has destroyed all that good will and once Nash finally retires I imagine we're in for a long, bleak trail of tears.

When a guy as nice and all around classy as Nash turns on an owner, you know he's a real turdbag. I pray for the day Jerry C decides he's had enough, rallies up a group of local investors and stages a coup down at USAC.

The problem is Phoenix is the 5th largest market in the United States and has teams from each of the major professional sports leagues, but inept owners such as Sarver and the Bidwills make it seem like a small sports town due to poor business decisions and inconsistent performance.

Jerry Colangelo was a master at selling the Suns brand, and even able to do so at a time when Phoenix/Metro barely had a million people. I would love for Jerry to come back to the franchise as some sort of major decision maker/influence. Dreaming is free, I guess.

 

[slinslin]

Phoenix can only offer Howard and Paul a max deal as it if if they do not sign anyone right now beyond 2012 and amnesty Childress.

The cap will be 58.000.000. The max would be 17.400.000. That means the Suns need 35.000.000 cap room at least just to sign Howard and Paul and minimum players as I believe they would have to renounce the MLE or else it would occupy capspace?


http://www.storytellerscontracts.info/resources/Phoenix.htm

1. As of right now the Suns sit at 29.700.000 for 2012 which is 28.300.000 cap room.

2. Add in a lottery pick at around 3.000.000 unless they **** us over again and trade the pick to get more caproom as they did with Iguodala then you sit at 25.300.000 cap room.

3. Amnesty Childress and you are at 31.800.000 cap room.

4. The Suns would still have to shave 4.000.000 off of their cap to afford 2 max players. (eg Warrick, Dudley, Frye or Gortat)

5. Waiving Warrick would and strechting the remaining 8.000.000 of his contract over the next 5 years would shave just 2.000.000 off of their cap.

 

[Gaddabout]

The problem is Phoenix is the 5th largest market in the United States and has teams from each of the major professional sports leagues, but inept owners such as Sarver and the Bidwills make it seem like a small sports town due to poor business decisions and inconsistent performance.

Jerry Colangelo was a master at selling the Suns brand, and even able to do so at a time when Phoenix/Metro barely had a million people. I would love for Jerry to come back to the franchise as some sort of major decision maker/influence. Dreaming is free, I guess.

Nope, not how it works. The City of Phoenix (proper) is the 5th most populated city in the U.S. Phoenix Metro as a TV market (which is what counts) is 13th in the U.S. So 14 out of 28 is mid-market, especially when you consider how much bigger New York, LA, Chicago, Philly, Dallas/Ft Worth, the Bay, and Boston are compared to Phoenix. Here's how I think it plays out in terms of revenue:

BIG CITY MARKETS
1. New York (7.3 million households)
2. Los Angeles (5.56m)
3. Chicago (3.5m)
4. Philly (3m)
5. Dallas (2.6m)
6. SF/Oakland/SJ (2.5m)
7. Toronto (2.5m)
8. Boston (2.4m)
9. D.C. (2.3m)
10. Atlanta (2.3m)

MID-SIZED MARKETS
11. Houston (2.1m)
12. Detroit (1.8m)
*(Seattle-Tacoma, 1.8m)
13. Phoenix, 1.8m
14. Minnesota (1.72m)
15. Miami, Denver (1.5 mil)

SMALL MARKETS
Everyone else, bottoming out with Oklahoma City (712K) and New Orleans (643K).

But the bigger reality is 21 Century NBA is no longer driven by TV money, but billionaire owners who view their team as a toy rather than an investment. We should probably start ranking the teams by how much the owner is worth.

 

[Gaddabout]

Here are the wealthiest owners in the NBA as ranked by Forbes in September:

1. Paul Allen (Microsoft), Portland, $13.2 billion
2. Richard DeVos (Amway), Orlando, $5 billion
3. Mickey Arison (Carnival), Miami, $4.2 billion
4. Stan Kroenke (Walmart), Denver, $3.2 billion
5. Tom Gores (private equity), Detroit, $$2.5 billion
6. Mark Cuban (media), Dallas, $2.3 billion
7. Glen Taylor (printing/electronics), Minnesota, $1.8 billion
8. Herb Simon (real estate), Indiana, $1.6 billion
9. Dan Gilbert (Quicken), Cleveland, $1.5 billion
10. Michael Heisley (rape/pillage), Memphis, $1.5 billion

Sarver doesn't even make the Top 20. I believe he's 23 and holding. As you can see, a lot of the wealthiest guys are in the smallest markets. It's a double-hit for Suns fans because we have neither the TV market clout nor the bottomless bank account to compete if the NBA is all about salary.

 

[slinslin]

That list does not really show the truth though because Robert Sarver is only the head of a group that owns the Suns and owns the biggest share.

And I don't think the worth of the owner means anything. Some of the guys you have listed there in your top 10 are known as cheapskates or at least not rich. Also New Jerseys owner is missing and the Knicks are owned by the network.

When the Suns were good they didn't have a problem getting national recognition. The best examples are Barkley and Nash. 3 MVPs in the last 20 years in the NBA is something few teams have had.

The problem is not how much money Sarver has. The problem is how he is portrayed in the media. Some of that is his own fault some of that is driven by the media.

 

[Cheesebeef]

apparently, we're trying to get Hill signed to a TWO year deal. For the love of God... why? So he can eat up cap space next summer when we "try" to sign one of the big names? is there ZERO forward thinking in the suns front office? (yes, that was a rhetorical question).

 

[slinslin]

My comment to that is :

They want to start "project refresh" but feed us the same crappy boring mediocre ancient team again next season? Good luck with project refresh because with the make-up of that team I will gladly miss the entire season as a fan.

 

[Gaddabout]

That list does not really show the truth though because Robert Sarver is only the head of a group that owns the Suns and owns the biggest share.

Sarver is the wealthiest by far. He has four times more worth than Jenny Craig, and Sarver is an NBA pauper.

The ownership group is an investment fund made up of 14 of Sarver's friends and clients. The team is being managed just as if it were a real estate fund or a bond fund. Most of those investors are either in real estate or have large real estate holdings in the Pacific and Southwest regions, so they're being hammered on the wrong end of things.

This team is screaming to be sold, but it's appreciated a meager 2.5% in the 7 years they've owned it, so they probably couldn't even cover their losses right now. With a gross revenue of about $150 million a year and all the conventional ways to raise revenue on lock down (regional TV, radio, etc.), all they can do is raise ticket prices, keep costs down, and hope the league as a whole can raise their value for the right buyer. If Sarver could get out on break even right now, I believe he'd do it, but I don't believe his partners will let him.

 

[TJ]

apparently, we're trying to get Hill signed to a TWO year deal. For the love of God... why? So he can eat up cap space next summer when we "try" to sign one of the big names? is there ZERO forward thinking in the suns front office? (yes, that was a rhetorical question).

"Zero" forward thinking would an accomplishment for this three-ring circus known as the Suns FO

 

[SirStefan32]

apparently, we're trying to get Hill signed to a TWO year deal. For the love of God... why? So he can eat up cap space next summer when we "try" to sign one of the big names? is there ZERO forward thinking in the suns front office? (yes, that was a rhetorical question).

If he's gonna play for the minimum, I have no problem with that. He is a great guy to have around, he is well-respected around the league. Sending Hill to recruit Howard and/or Paul is a much better option than sending Sarver to do it.

 

[TJ]

Here are the wealthiest owners in the NBA as ranked by Forbes in September:


10. Michael Heisley (rape/pillage), Memphis, $1.5 billion

Sarver doesn't even make the Top 20. I believe he's 23 and holding. As you can see, a lot of the wealthiest guys are in the smallest markets. It's a double-hit for Suns fans because we have neither the TV market clout nor the bottomless bank account to compete if the NBA is all about salary.

Politician?