Suns trying to be 3rd wheel in Butler trade to land Dragic

[Town Drunk]

Apparently some would. I think he's grossly overrated on this forum and Kemba is almost as underrated here. When contract time comes, Walker will likely get the max or thereabouts and I don't see that happening with Rubio despite being 6 months younger than Kemba.

Totally agree. If I had to throw money at someone, I’d throw it at Kemba.

 

[Chaplin]

Apparently some would. I think he's grossly overrated on this forum and Kemba is almost as underrated here. When contract time comes, Walker will likely get the max or thereabouts and I don't see that happening with Rubio despite being 6 months younger than Kemba.

That's a little extreme, considering how much Rubio is actually discussed on this forum, which is hardly at all. I think the biggest thing with Rubio is that Igor was the one that made him into the player he is now, and that carries a lot of weight.

That said, I prefer Kemba over Rubio.

 

[Raindog]

I prefer Rubio over Kemba, for three reasons:

1. Rubio isn't going to cost anywhere near what Kemba will.

2. We need a facilitator much more than a ball-dominant PG.

3. Rubio might actually sign here. I'm not sure that is a reality with Walker.

 

[AzStevenCal]

That's a little extreme, considering how much Rubio is actually discussed on this forum, which is hardly at all. I think the biggest thing with Rubio is that Igor was the one that made him into the player he is now, and that carries a lot of weight.

That said, I prefer Kemba over Rubio.

I think Rubio is discussed quite a bit here, I guess it's a matter of perspective. To me, Rubio is perhaps the best of the non-star PG's but Kemba is a star. And he doesn't wilt in big moments.

 

[AzStevenCal]

I prefer Rubio over Kemba, for three reasons:

1. Rubio isn't going to cost anywhere near what Kemba will.

2. We need a facilitator much more than a ball-dominant PG.

3. Rubio might actually sign here. I'm not sure that is a reality with Walker.

1. Probably but IMO Rubio isn't worth anywhere near what Kemba is and we'll have to see what they go for.

2. Last year, arguably Rubio's best, he averaged 5.3 assists and 2.7 turnovers while surrounded by quality talent. The same year, Kemba, with trash around him, averaged 5.4 assists and 2.2 turnovers. Not to mention scoring more effectively from the 2 and the 3 while averaging 9 more points per game.

3. Maybe. But Kemba is in his 8th season, all with one team. Rubio is now on his 2nd team in the same number of seasons. Hard to call either player a vagabond or mercenary but the edge goes to Walker so far.

Having said all that, should the front office feel Rubio is a better candidate to stay and if they can get him on an appreciably more reasonable contract then he might be our better choice. But I was primarily arguing which player is better and I think Kemba is the clear cut winner even if Rubio is the better option for us.

 

[JCSunsfan]

1. Probably but IMO Rubio isn't worth anywhere near what Kemba is and we'll have to see what they go for.

2. Last year, arguably Rubio's best, he averaged 5.3 assists and 2.7 turnovers while surrounded by quality talent. The same year, Kemba, with trash around him, averaged 5.4 assists and 2.2 turnovers. Not to mention scoring more effectively from the 2 and the 3 while averaging 9 more points per game.

3. Maybe. But Kemba is in his 8th season, all with one team. Rubio is now on his 2nd team in the same number of seasons. Hard to call either player a vagabond or mercenary but the edge goes to Walker so far.

Having said all that, should the front office feel Rubio is a better candidate to stay and if they can get him on an appreciably more reasonable contract then he might be our better choice. But I was primarily arguing which player is better and I think Kemba is the clear cut winner even if Rubio is the better option for us.

Rubio is a better defender, so that might make him a better fit. But if the money is the same, I want Kemba. I would fear greatly that Rubio's shooting would revert to his norm.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Rubio is a better defender, so that might make him a better fit. But if the money is the same, I want Kemba. I would fear greatly that Rubio's shooting would revert to his norm.

Kemba also has been effective in the past when supported by a decent defender down low (Jefferson, for example, when he could still move a little).

 

[Raindog]

Undoubtedly, Walker is the better player. I am looking at it from the standpoint of who is the better (and more realistic) fit. Rubio would be an ideal stopgap until Okobo (or Melton) come of age.

And you also have to wonder how Walker would adjust to a situation where he is no longer the number one option, but instead will likely have to play third fiddle to Booker and Ayton. I don't know Walker's makeup well enough - and he may be a fine teammate - but there could be chemistry issues. Rubio is accustomed to being in a supporting role.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Undoubtedly, Walker is the better player. I am looking at it from the standpoint of who is the better (and more realistic) fit. Rubio would be an ideal stopgap until Okobo (or Melton) come of age.

And you also have to wonder how Walker would adjust to a situation where he is no longer the number one option, but instead will likely have to play third fiddle to Booker and Ayton. I don't know Walker's makeup well enough - and he may be a fine teammate - but there could be chemistry issues. Rubio is accustomed to being in a supporting role.

My issue with either would be acquisition cost. I'd be fine with signing Rubio to a reasonable 3 year deal while we develop or search for a long term answer. But if we look at him as a mid-season solution, I just don't think he's worth what it might cost to get him in addition to stepping up for a new contract. But lastly, I don't want a point guard that is comfortable being in a supporting role, not in today's game. IMO you either have a star at that spot or you're in search of a new point guard.

 

[95pro]

Ingles doesn't bother me that much only because I've been so focused hating Rubio. Now that I'm warming to the idea of the Suns acquiring him I'll try shifting that hate to Ingles.

Like Mainstreeet said, just watch Ingles. It'll make you throw a hammer at your 65" 4k ultra ultra TV.

 

[95pro]

Walker better individually than Rubio.

Rubio better fit for us and probably cheaper.

Rubio's D is overrated imo, can get steals off passes but also gets abused by more physical/athletic guards.

 

[slinslin]

Walker is a better fit because he is a much better player

Better shooter, great handle, low turnovers

 

[slinslin]

We‘ll sign Kevin Durant


Ayton
Durant
Bridges
Jackson
Booker

That is going to be our lineup

 

[Carolinacacti]

The feeling here in Charlotte is Kemba's not worth the max. But Kupchak is the GM so who knows what will happen. Kemba is a star and good individual but not a Super Max player.

 

[Hoop Head]

Raindog hit on almost every reason I prefer Rubio to Kemba. The idea he's a playmaker rather than someone looking for his own shot primarily is another reason I prefer Rubio. We have guys who will need touches and Kemba becoming a 3rd or 4th option could be an issue, especially at his projected pay rate. I know Knight's falling off was mentioned in regards to Rubio and that applies more to Kemba, I think. Kemba has always had an offense that he can control, like Knight, and once that was taken from Knight is when he fell apart. If Kemba needs to share a team with Booker and Ayton, will he still contribute that much? Will what he does contribute be worth the max? I'd rather pay Rubio 80 million for 4 years instead of Kemba 140 million for 4 years. That's not even a debate, IMO.

 

[JCSunsfan]

Raindog hit on almost every reason I prefer Rubio to Kemba. The idea he's a playmaker rather than someone looking for his own shot primarily is another reason I prefer Rubio. We have guys who will need touches and Kemba becoming a 3rd or 4th option could be an issue, especially at his projected pay rate. I know Knight's falling off was mentioned in regards to Rubio and that applies more to Kemba, I think. Kemba has always had an offense that he can control, like Knight, and once that was taken from Knight is when he fell apart. If Kemba needs to share a team with Booker and Ayton, will he still contribute that much? Will what he does contribute be worth the max? I'd rather pay Rubio 80 million for 4 years instead of Kemba 140 million for 4 years. That's not even a debate, IMO.

I get it. Booker is going to average 20-25 a game. Same with Ayton. We expect JJ to get 15-20. Ariza should be averaging 15 or so as well. Warren is a 20 ppg scorer. Ryno should be somewhere around 15. Bridges should get 8-10. Thats 120 right there. Not going to happen. There is no room to add a guy who thinks he needs 20 ppg to that bunch even if you include a player like Warren or Bridges in the trade.

In a pg we need passing, defense, and three point shooting efficiency. We do not need volume scoring.

 

[AzStevenCal]

The feeling here in Charlotte is Kemba's not worth the max. But Kupchak is the GM so who knows what will happen. Kemba is a star and good individual but not a Super Max player.

He isn't worth the max. Neither is Booker (so far). But the stupid Super Max has turned a bunch of pretty good players into max wannabe's.

 

[95pro]

He isn't worth the max. Neither is Booker (so far). But the stupid Super Max has turned a bunch of pretty good players into max wannabe's.

Completely a players market these days.

 

[sunsfan88]

Completely a players market these days.

Owners got completely screwed by Michelle Roberts in the last CBA negotiations.