Suns updates and discussion for the 2021-22 season

[Mainstreet]

It's crazy the sort of talent out there right now. I wonder if our perception is a skewed because we went so long without that I could easily build a 15 man roster of free agents that would rival the 2017-18 Suns, minus Booker.

Tyrell Terry, Kris Dunn, Avery Bradley, Nik Staukus, Jabari Parker, even Brandon Knight is available again.

They aren't world beaters but there is some decent end of the bench talent available. Maybe signing Elfrid Payton was a mistake because I'd prefer someone like Bradley or Dunn, maybe even offer Knight a shot. Elf is decent for a 3rd stringer but I like some other guys potential to be more than that much more than him.

I'm pleased the Suns have Elfrid Payton on their roster but some of these younger players have a chance to be rotation players or even starters for a team one day.

Point guard Joel Ayayi has already been claimed off waivers by the Wizards and I lied Tyrell Terry a lot in the 2020 draft.

The Heat have already proven they can find undrafted talent.

 

[Covert Rain]

The Suns released Chasson Randle over the weekend. That means the Suns have one available full-time roster spot and one available two-way spot. Many teams carry a full-time roster sport through the midway point for things like vet buy outs etc. Sure doesn't sound like the Suns are in a hurry to sign anybody. I would say it's not likely the Suns trade or add anybody to the roster until the trade deadline. They still have the $4.5 million mid-level cap exception. I don't expect the rumored trade with the Spurs to happen. The way the team has played in pre-season I think that shut down the Suns being aggressive.

Looks like we will go into the regular season with the primary rotation looking like:

Paul, Booker, Payne, Shamet, Bridges, Crowder, Johnson, Ayton, McGee. While the rotational guys will be Payton, Nader, Kaminsky, Hutchison and Smith coming in and out of the lineup depending on how games go (foul trouble), injuries and back to backs. Keeping in mind that Smith and Hutchison are not really proven yet to be regular rotational players ready to contribute.

I think it's a mistake and one injury to this FC would expose the lack of depth on this roster. Let's assume that Smith and Hutchison simply are still not ready? That gives you nobody on the backend of your rotation that has high potential to contribute on a consistent basis. I think the Suns need one more player but it appears their start has them content to wait it out.

Sorry for the long post but this also makes things abundantly clear. The Suns are going for it. There is zero doubt. We have no first round pick now after the Shamut trade, no pick in 2022 because of the Paul trade and currently no G-League team. They are putting all their eggs in the "Paul" basket while he is here. Regardless of what happens in this Chris Paul run? The Suns are going to have to be aggressive in the FA/Trade market to reload with younger talent in the coming years.

 

[Mainstreet]

Since there is no deal on Ayton I hope the Suns get Landry Shamet extended. Hopefully it's another piece of the puzzle.

 

[1Sun]

Since there is no deal on Ayton I hope the Suns get Landry Shamet extended. Hopefully it's another piece of the puzzle.

There won't BE a puzzle once CP3 declines if the Suns don't have another star to pair with Booker. Even if Booker accepts being the only elite player on tge roster, a team featuring Booker surrounded with nothing but role players is going nowhere.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Since there is no deal on Ayton I hope the Suns get Landry Shamet extended. Hopefully it's another piece of the puzzle.

why? that would only further choke our cap going forward with role players. if Ayton's not going to be part of the picture moving forward, loading on on the Shamets of the world is going to be the same mistake we made loading up on the Warrick and Childress' of the world.

 

[Mainstreet]

why? that would only further choke our cap going forward with role players. if Ayton's not going to be part of the picture moving forward, loading on on the Shamets of the world is going to be the same mistake we made loading up on the Warrick and Childress' of the world.

If the Suns sign Shamet to reasonable extension he is another asset going forward rather than a 1 year rental. They do have the option to sign him as a RFA.

 

[Hoop Head]

why? that would only further choke our cap going forward with role players. if Ayton's not going to be part of the picture moving forward, loading on on the Shamets of the world is going to be the same mistake we made loading up on the Warrick and Childress' of the world.

It all depends on the deal. If we can get him for 2-3 years at around $5-6 million then he can be easily used as salary filler in a larger trade while not hamstringing the cap. It adds to the roster continuity James Jones values. I see no real downside to it because he's a quality player with a fairly important role off the bench.

It wouldn't be that difficult to replace him and his production, I think it's better that we have him here and not worry about spending our limited resources replacing him going forward. If we're a tax paying team then the MLE is cut by about 40%, leaving us with $5.9 million to spend outside of minimum deals to address holes on the bench. That is really just enough for 1 rotation player which will likely be needed to replace JaVale McGee next summer.

Shamet was in extension talks prior to news of Ayton's extension being difficult. It shouldn't be viewed as spending Ayton's money elsewhere but solidifying our 2nd unit. Having him on a good contract is more beneficial to the Suns future than letting him walk after the season for nothing.

 

[Ronin]

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[SirStefan32]

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[SirStefan32]

That is a pretty large contract they handed out.

 

[Cheesebeef]

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WTF?! They are already setting up for a cap-choking Pupu platter of fine-middling players to replace Ayton’s would be salary in the coming years.

This stinks of the old Pennywise, pound foolish crap that defined the Suns for over a decade.

 

[Cheesebeef]

It all depends on the deal. If we can get him for 2-3 years at around $5-6 million then he can be easily used as salary filler in a larger trade while not hamstringing the cap. It adds to the roster continuity James Jones values. I see no real downside to it because he's a quality player with a fairly important role off the bench.

It wouldn't be that difficult to replace him and his production, I think it's better that we have him here and not worry about spending our limited resources replacing him going forward. If we're a tax paying team then the MLE is cut by about 40%, leaving us with $5.9 million to spend outside of minimum deals to address holes on the bench. That is really just enough for 1 rotation player which will likely be needed to replace JaVale McGee next summer.

Shamet was in extension talks prior to news of Ayton's extension being difficult. It shouldn't be viewed as spending Ayton's money elsewhere but solidifying our 2nd unit. Having him on a good contract is more beneficial to the Suns future than letting him walk after the season for nothing.

Well, the contract isn’t anything near 2 or 3 years at 5-6 million. It’s a 4 year deal for over 43 million.

That’s a gross overpay, IMO.

 

[Covert Rain]

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WTF?! They are already setting up for a cap-choking platter of fine-middling players to replace Ayton’s would be salary.

This stinks of the old Pennywise, pound foolish crap that defined the Suns for over a decade.

This is hilarious considering they broke off talks with Ayton's team.

 

[Hoop Head]

Well, the contract isn’t anything near 2 or 3 years at 5-6 million. It’s a 4 year deal for over 43 million.

That’s a gross overpay, IMO.

I agree it's an overpay. When I heard talk of him resigning it was around $5-6 in most reports. I saw 8 million once but thought that was a bit too much. I like Shamet but for more than the MLE doesn't make sense. Should have let him hit restricted free agency and prove he can get that money. Hopefully it doesn't blow up on us.

 

[Yuma]

Don't you need big contracts to match up for big trades to other players? Also, in the Ayton threads, I see the comments you have to pay more to be a contender?

 

[AzStevenCal]

Don't you need big contracts to match up for big trades to other players? Also, in the Ayton threads, I see the comments you have to pay more to be a contender?

Yes you do. Once you know you're going to be over the cap the more high dollar contracts you have the less limited you are by the salary cap. I doubt if that enters the picture though if Robert is still micro-managing everything. I'm not saying he is, just don't know.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Don't you need big contracts to match up for big trades to other players? Also, in the Ayton threads, I see the comments you have to pay more to be a contender?

you have to pay more to the RIGHT PEOPLE. Contracts like this only choke a cap, making it more difficult to get the big star.

and this contract doesn't kick in until NEXT year so it can't be used to try and make a trade to get better this year.

 

[AzStevenCal]

you have to pay more to the RIGHT PEOPLE. Contracts like this only choke a cap, making it more difficult to get the big star.

and this contract doesn't kick in until NEXT year so it can't be used to try and make a trade to get better this year.

It makes it more difficult to sign a big time free agent, it makes it easier to trade for one.

 

[Cheesebeef]

It makes it more difficult to sign a big time free agent, it makes it easier to trade for one.

yeah. because big time stars are going to be clamoring to come here?

 

[Hoop Head]

yeah. because big time stars are going to be clamoring to come here?

Does Chris Paul not count? I mean, what you said kind of reinforces what Steve said. We can't sign big time free agents but we can make trades for them.

Everyone we've added by trade has been happy to be here from Chris Paul to Kelly Oubre to Landry Shamet. All of the players with value we've traded for have reupped here going back to Bledsoe. That's not to say relationships didn't change but I can't of anyone who was angry or upset we traded for them.

 

[Yuma]

Does Chris Paul not count? I mean, what you said kind of reinforces what Steve said. We can't sign big time free agents but we can make trades for them.

Everyone we've added by trade has been happy to be here from Chris Paul to Kelly Oubre to Landry Shamet. All of the players with value we've traded for have reupped here going back to Bledsoe. That's not to say relationships didn't change but I can't of anyone who was angry or upset we traded for them.

Free Agency signing of Ariza backfired..... I know it wasn't a trade. Austin Rivers basically refused to play for us after being traded here!

 

[Hoop Head]

Free Agency signing of Ariza backfired..... I know it wasn't a trade. Austin Rivers basically refused to play for us after being traded here!

The Ariza signing didn't work out but I wouldn't say it backfired since we were able to get Oubre for him. Ariza didn't lose value while here and we added a better player that fit with our team much better. Oubre was a young up and comer who was more valuable than Ariza by years end and we ended up getting Paul for him and Rubio.

Austin Rivers has gone back on his words a few times. Last I read is that he actually wanted to be here and was caught off guard by being waived. Of course I remember it differently when it went down but I don't think the Suns cared very much whether he wanted to be here or not, the trade was made for Kelly and Rivers was salary filler. Austin Rivers has had issues everywhere he's been and seems to be a bit of a headcase.

 

[Yuma]

"They have a new brand, The Valley, that’s on fire. The only thing harder to find in Phoenix than an affordable mortgage is a Devin Booker The Valley jersey on the team shop racks." - Kellen Olsen

 

[JCSunsfan]

Things have changed since Ariza. Booker has established himself, they are winning, they have a culture that all the present players praise, they have JJ instead of McD, they have Monty, they have the best training facility in the league (Ariza complained about the training facility more than anything).

 

[Yuma]

Things have changed since Ariza. Booker has established himself, they are winning, they have a culture that all the present players praise, they have JJ instead of McD, they have Monty, they have the best training facility in the league (Ariza complained about the training facility more than anything).

I could live in that practice facility!!!