Suns updates and discussion for the 2023-24 season

[Ronin]

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[Proximo]

I disagree about Damion Lee because he shot .455 from three last season. The Suns can use another knock down shooter. Of course, it's up to the coach to use him.

We will have to wait and see what Bol Bol can do. He is still mostly an unknown with Phoenix.

I like Goodwin's defense, but he is not a good outside shooter which limits his play.

I've been waiting on Little, however, the Suns need to win now, not later.

I'm hoping the Suns can get at least a couple of players that can help, minimally, like Royce O'Neale and Bismack Biyombo.

Of course, I hope for something better. The buyout or trade market might offer some surprises.

I wanted Damien Lee cut before he got injured so my opinion could not be much lower on him. I always find it amazing how when players are out for long stretches fans only seem to remember all the good parts of their game but forget their weaknesses. Yuta shot 48% from three last year, but has been the suns worst player not just because he is in a shooting slump but because his defense sucks. Damien Lee is similar.

Royce and Biyombo don't move the needle at all - in fact I would guess in the majority of games they will not even get playing time.

Goodwin may not be a good shooter, but he's better than Okogie - and better than Saben Lee who you seem to love, but he does bring defensive pressure which can be game changing and was in several of our early games.

I don't really see a way the Suns are going to be good enough to compete for the title if I am being honest, because we aren't going to have depth, Beal has underperformed, and our coaching is way below average.

 

[BirdGangThing]

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damn good interview

“It’s not going to be like last night every game. My coaches didn’t want me to shoot threes and we needed to be better in our roles, so I was like, ‘I’m all in on this.’ Most of the time, if you don’t like your role, you try to play something that people don’t want you to play and I just want to complement these people and players and be the best teammate I can. … I’m trying to do my best in my role to be a star. Whatever it takes to win the game, I’m trying to do.”

 

[Covert Rain]

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This last game is the most physical I have seen Nurk. I would love to see this more consistently. That completely changes the team when he plays like that. Not those games where he gets into foul trouble or disappears defensively.

 

[Covert Rain]

I don't really see a way the Suns are going to be good enough to compete for the title if I am being honest, because we aren't going to have depth, Beal has underperformed, and our coaching is way below average.

Beal's last 10 games he has averaged 17.2 points, shot 48% from 2, 34.7 from 3, 4.3 rebounds, 4.3 assists. Not to mention saved our bacon in multiple games over that stretch with timely scoring.

 

[JCSunsfan]

Beal's last 10 games he has averaged 17.2 points, shot 48% from 2, 34.7 from 3, 4.3 rebounds, 4.3 assists. Not to mention saved our bacon in multiple games over that stretch with timely scoring.

Yep. When you have three stars, not everyone can be a 25-point scorer, especially when you have other scorers on the roster like Grayson and Gordon. Although, if we are really going to improve this roster (as in pg like everyone says) then you have to trade Beal. A backup pg is just not going to make that much of an impact. Its a dilemma. We really need Book as a scoring guard. That means Beal or Grayson have to be the point guard.

 

[Proximo]

Beal's last 10 games he has averaged 17.2 points, shot 48% from 2, 34.7 from 3, 4.3 rebounds, 4.3 assists. Not to mention saved our bacon in multiple games over that stretch with timely scoring.

You don't think that is underperforming?

KD and Bookers numbers are roughly equivalent / better than last year, he is below last season in every stat except slightly better rebounding.

It's not as if he doesn't have opportunity to be more of an impact. The 34% from 3 is especially problematic considering how many are wide open.

 

[Proximo]

Yep. When you have three stars, not everyone can be a 25-point scorer, especially when you have other scorers on the roster like Grayson and Gordon. Although, if we are really going to improve this roster (as in pg like everyone says) then you have to trade Beal. A backup pg is just not going to make that much of an impact. Its a dilemma. We really need Book as a scoring guard. That means Beal or Grayson have to be the point guard.

Beal is untradeable. He is grossly overpaid and has a no trade clause. Maybe once he has 1 year left on his contract, but we are stuck with him till then.

 

[JCSunsfan]

The only player I see out there that might get traded that could make a difference is Tyus Jones. We would have to give up at least four players to get him.

 

[Proximo]

The only player I see out there that might get traded that could make a difference is Tyus Jones. We would have to give up at least four players to get him.

I disagree, Miles Bridges would make more of an impact by far than he would if you can stomach him on this team because our guard play is already sufficient.

We need a wing and a center not a PG.

 

[Suns_fan69]

The 34% from 3 is especially problematic considering how many are wide open.

And also problematic as his percentages drop in the 4th. A lot of these are good to great looks (catch and shoot in the corners), but his inability to convert these at even a league average rate hurt.

 

[JCSunsfan]

I disagree, Miles Bridges would make more of an impact by far than he would if you can stomach him on this team because our guard play is already sufficient.

We need a wing and a center not a PG.

We need someone to cut turnovers and keep the team settled in the 4th quarter. Jones would run point for the backups, and when Book is really shooting well, he could bring the ball up and initiate the offense so Book can score.

 

[Covert Rain]

You don't think that is underperforming?

KD and Bookers numbers are roughly equivalent / better than last year, he is below last season in every stat except slightly better rebounding.

It's not as if he doesn't have opportunity to be more of an impact. The 34% from 3 is especially problematic considering how many are wide open.

Splitting hairs. I thought we could get 20 PPG out of him and he averaged 18.4 for the month. When you add in he is getting over 4 assists and has come to the rescue multiple times in the past month he is doing what we brought him here for. Sure, I would love if he got to 20 PPG and brought up his 3 Point shooting but he is doing other things well all while still trying to find his role in the lineup.

Beal is not our problem. Vogel's implementation of the big 3 offensively, Vogel's defensive scheme and lack of bench play is. In fact, if we had a more cohesive offense instead of what Vogel is doing Beal is easily getting the extra 1.6 points to get to 20 PPG.

 

[Mainstreet]

It’s bad roster construction/ coaching. It’s painful to watch.

Those role players aren’t gonna help.

I agree the Suns roster, particularly the bench, is poorly constructed. However, if the Suns can find a reliable 8-man rotation, it would definitely help.

A part of Vogel's problem is the bench. They do not consistently produce.

Adding one player that could be a rotation player would benefit the team. The Suns especially need more size.

 

[Mainstreet]

I wanted Damien Lee cut before he got injured so my opinion could not be much lower on him. I always find it amazing how when players are out for long stretches fans only seem to remember all the good parts of their game but forget their weaknesses. Yuta shot 48% from three last year, but has been the suns worst player not just because he is in a shooting slump but because his defense sucks. Damien Lee is similar.

Royce and Biyombo don't move the needle at all - in fact I would guess in the majority of games they will not even get playing time.

Goodwin may not be a good shooter, but he's better than Okogie - and better than Saben Lee who you seem to love, but he does bring defensive pressure which can be game changing and was in several of our early games.

I don't really see a way the Suns are going to be good enough to compete for the title if I am being honest, because we aren't going to have depth, Beal has underperformed, and our coaching is way below average.

It's hard to find stars on minimum contracts.

I do think O'Neal and Biyombo would help stabilize the Suns rotation, but of course I hope for more if the Suns are to contend.

There is nothing wrong with trying to develop players on two-way contracts. Sometimes one will surprise you.

The Suns problems involve their standard 15-man roster and finding a rotation that works.

 

[Vacard]

Durant is top 5 in minutes again. Thats a testament of our bench

 

[Mainstreet]

John Gambadoro says no to another trade rumor, not that I thought this one had legs.

However, if the Suns could get a backup point guard in a trade, it would fortify the Suns bench.

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[CardsSunsDbacks]

You don't think that is underperforming?

KD and Bookers numbers are roughly equivalent / better than last year, he is below last season in every stat except slightly better rebounding.

It's not as if he doesn't have opportunity to be more of an impact. The 34% from 3 is especially problematic considering how many are wide open.

Someone by default has to take a hit because you just aren't going to get 28-30 from two guys and then still get another 25 or so from a third guy. The only way we could do that is to simply run all of our offense through big 3 ISO and I don't think any of us want that.

 

[Proximo]

Someone by default has to take a hit because you just aren't going to get 28-30 from two guys and then still get another 25 or so from a third guy. The only way we could do that is to simply run all of our offense through big 3 ISO and I don't think any of us want that.

If he would just shoot 40% from 3 that would be 20 points a game - which is what he should be doing.

I am complaining more about about his efficiency than anything, but I don't think he has been aggressive enough either and absolutely could be getting more shots up. His main skill we are lacking elsewhere on the team is his penetration and I don't think he does that enough either. Even if it's to pass it would be helpful.

 

[Covert Rain]

Durant is top 5 in minutes again. Thats a testament of our bench

Yep, not being able to rely on the bench is causing us to use some of our guys more than normal. Definitely, a factor in the 4th.

 

[Proximo]

It's hard to find stars on minimum contracts.

I do think O'Neal and Biyombo would help stabilize the Suns rotation, but of course I hope for more if the Suns are to contend.

There is nothing wrong with trying to develop players on two-way contracts. Sometimes one will surprise you.

The Suns problems involve their standard 15-man roster and finding a rotation that works.

I agree about the 2 way players. The Suns seem to want to sign 25 year olds instead of young guys which I think totally screws your chance of finding a diamond in the rough.

We know what Biz is. He is a guy that you can't play in the playoffs because he shoot's 30% or worse from the free throw line. There is a reason Memphis just cut him - he's not a good player. He is a 10-12th man at best on any roster.
That is not a rotation piece.

O'Neal likewise is not a difference maker. He is a weak defender - I am going off is DB+-, and his offense is basically just standing in the corner and shooting 3's - streakily at 35%. Little can already do that - KBD can already do that and he plays better defense.

 

[Proximo]

Yep, not being able to rely on the bench is causing us to use some of our guys more than normal. Definitely, a factor in the 4th.

I am not convinced the issue is just our bench players being bad. I think a lot of them looking so bad is the lack of ball movement and them getting very few opportunities.

 

[Covert Rain]

I am not convinced the issue is just our bench players being bad. I think a lot of them looking so bad is the lack of ball movement and them getting very few opportunities.

You are basing that just on game time. The coaches watch these players almost daily and how they perform in practice. I agree some of it might be coaching but our bench isn't great.

 

[Mainstreet]

I agree about the 2 way players. The Suns seem to want to sign 25 year olds instead of young guys which I think totally screws your chance of finding a diamond in the rough.

We know what Biz is. He is a guy that you can't play in the playoffs because he shoot's 30% or worse from the free throw line. There is a reason Memphis just cut him - he's not a good player. He is a 10-12th man at best on any roster.
That is not a rotation piece.

O'Neal likewise is not a difference maker. He is a weak defender - I am going off is DB+-, and his offense is basically just standing in the corner and shooting 3's - streakily at 35%. Little can already do that - KBD can already do that and he plays better defense.

It's all about improving the team. Biz and O'Neale move the need forward some because they can play, especially if there is an injury.

Of course, I want the Suns to shoot higher.

However, it's like the saying, you don't always get what you want.

 

[Covert Rain]

It's all about improving the team. Biz and O'Neale move the need forward some because they can play, especially if there is an injury.

Of course, I want the Suns to shoot higher.

However, it's like the saying, you don't always get what you want.

Biz is at BEST a situational player but not a player that can be part of the regular rotation. You would bring him in during specific defensive situations. I have to agree with the above take that he likely would see no time in the playoffs. So, for me he doesn't move the needle at all. He would be a depth guy only. He would be a luxury signing but not fill our current need.