Suns updates and discussion for the 2023-24 season

[AsUpRoDiGy]

Anyone remember how long it took to give Monty the boot last year?

Edit… it only took 2 days to fire Monty. We’re at 8 days and counting on Vogel. Starting to think this FO is so high on its own supply that there’s no way they can admit a mistake as big evidenced by firing the coach after 1 year.

I think they're waiting to see who might be available on playoff teams?

 

[leclerc]

Hope you're right, AsUpRoDiGy.

 

[leclerc]

Rather have Beal than Harden, but guys, let's get a legit point guard, ey? Do we have any first round picks this year?

To be clear, if Harden wants to come here and play for the minimum, why not. Swapping Beal for Harden, that I am against.

 

[Chaplin]

Anyone remember how long it took to give Monty the boot last year?

Edit… it only took 2 days to fire Monty. We’re at 8 days and counting on Vogel. Starting to think this FO is so high on its own supply that there’s no way they can admit a mistake as big evidenced by firing the coach after 1 year.

Monty wasn't hired on Ishbia's watch. It was probably pretty easy for him to give Monty the pink slip because of that.

 

[Yuma]

I think they're waiting to see who might be available on playoff teams?

I would hope, but I am thinking this is wishful thinking at this point now.

 

[Yuma]

Monty wasn't hired on Ishbia's watch. It was probably pretty easy for him to give Monty the pink slip because of that.

I feel like JJ is the ultimate Yes man. Those guys seem to linger longer than what is thought.

 

[Phrazbit]

I feel like JJ is the ultimate Yes man. Those guys seem to linger longer than what is thought.

JJ's job is probably made secure by the position being so unappealing to any serious candidate.

Sky high expectations, no assets, no cap space, old and inflexible roster, only real way to bring in new players is through the league minimum.

 

[Superbone]

Anyone remember how long it took to give Monty the boot last year?

Edit… it only took 2 days to fire Monty. We’re at 8 days and counting on Vogel. Starting to think this FO is so high on its own supply that there’s no way they can admit a mistake as big evidenced by firing the coach after 1 year.

Today or tomorrow according to our favorite Nostradumbass:

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[95pro]

Today or tomorrow according to our favorite Nostradumbass:

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I've watched PHNX a lot this season, he's grown on me, some annoying things but they all have it on those type of shows/podcasts. He actually seems to have other national connections and relations with some national media. His takes are pretty sound and overall he's a positive guy looking forward on the suns future. For sure his inside guy is on medical/training. I'm not on X/twitter so i can't say if he's toned down the generalized takes.

 

[somethingshesaid]

I was just thinking about Josh Okogie and how he still can't shoot. He makes a perfectly good case study in the type of player who befuddles me. I've never understood why it's obviously just difficult to learn to shoot properly. Okogie also typifies a player who gives great effort. I can only assume, then, that such effort includes trying hard to learn to shoot (and, more generally, to score and play offense). But...if so, it's not working. I wonder why.

I'm glad Okogie is on the Suns; but regrettably, the contemporary requirements of the NBA don't easily allow a player to play only defense. Or only any non-offensive skill. Unless possibly that player is the very best at it, and possibly not even then. (And Okogie isn't one of the best defenders ever anyway. He's just tenacious.) I'm skeptical of whether a player like Dennis Rodman, who was the best at rebounding and defense but just didn't play offense, would be allowed to play that way. I believe that almost every team would pressure him to become a three-point shooter.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I was just thinking about Josh Okogie and how he still can't shoot. He makes a perfectly good case study in the type of player who befuddles me. I've never understood why it's obviously just difficult to learn to shoot properly. Okogie also typifies a player who gives great effort. I can only assume, then, that such effort includes trying hard to learn to shoot (and, more generally, to score and play offense). But...if so, it's not working. I wonder why.

I'm glad Okogie is on the Suns; but regrettably, the contemporary requirements of the NBA don't easily allow a player to play only defense. Or only any non-offensive skill. Unless possibly that player is the very best at it, and possibly not even then. (And Okogie isn't one of the best defenders ever anyway. He's just tenacious.) I'm skeptical of whether a player like Dennis Rodman, who was the best at rebounding and defense but just didn't play offense, would be allowed to play that way. I believe that almost every team would pressure him to become a three-point shooter.

yeah... I got on him early this season about not being able to shoot the 3 and questioned what he did in the off-season, but that dude GRINDS. I've got to believe he TRIED his hardest to work on that part of his game, not only because the team needed him to, but because if he did, he'd have to know he'd be looking at a significant pay day. Some guys just can't get there for whatever reason. They're probably nails in practice, but when it comes to game-play, they just might be in their own heads too much.

It's really a shame. He'd be such a great weapon and valued piece this team desperately missed this year.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Eh? You got on him? Do you mean literally that you know him; or only that you posted criticism?

lol... no. just meant posted criticism about him here.

 

[Phrazbit]

yeah... I got on him early this season about not being able to shoot the 3 and questioned what he did in the off-season, but that dude GRINDS. I've got to believe he TRIED his hardest to work on that part of his game, not only because the team needed him to, but because if he did, he'd have to know he'd be looking at a significant pay day. Some guys just can't get there for whatever reason. They're probably nails in practice, but when it comes to game-play, they just might be in their own heads too much.

It's really a shame. He'd be such a great weapon and valued piece this team desperately missed this year.

Some guys just can't get there.

Wesley Johnson was a dude who the analysts raved about his pure shooting stroke, said he worked on his form constantly, wasn't shy about hoisting em up either... only problem was he couldn't shoot. Dude was a trainwreck on offense.

I can't imagine that Okogie isn't putting in the effort to get better from three, but it just isn't happening for him. If he could get even to an average rate... 36% or so, he'd probably be looking at 10 million a season.

 

[ASUCHRIS]

Some guys just can't get there.

Wesley Johnson was a dude who the analysts raved about his pure shooting stroke, said he worked on his form constantly, wasn't shy about hoisting em up either... only problem was he couldn't shoot. Dude was a trainwreck on offense.

I can't imagine that Okogie isn't putting in the effort to get better from three, but it just isn't happening for him. If he could get even to an average rate... 36% or so, he'd probably be looking at 10 million a season.

He also was better two years ago...he was so bad this last year that he became unplayable.

 

[Dan H]

I can’t believe we took Ayton over Doncic. I’ve never been more wrong about anything in sports in my entire life.

If we had a Doncic/Booker back Court just surrounded by 3 and D guys, that team woulda been a contender for a decade.

As an organization we've had a big man fetish since we lost the coin flip.

It's like we always thought a + center was the final piece, but it's a bunch of "what could have been" more than anything else.

Alvan Adams did yeoman's work even though he didn't have the size. Nick Vanos died in a plane crash.

Early Colangelo years was like a constant run to try and get tougher inside. Armen Gilliam. James Edwards. Rick Robey. Sheesh, we even brought in Joe Barry Carrol and Xavier McDaniel.

Trading for Barkley ...

Oliver Miller could have been that guy, he flamed out.

We tried to trade Barkley for Mutombo. We traded Majerle for Hot Rod.

We had a year of McDyess and he took off on us. We literally went to court in Greece to bring Jake Tsakalidis over (good grief, that was pre-Twitter and I was up at 2AM refreshing international news sites to see what the court decision was).

Amare was that guy, for a while ...

We brought in Shaq for a trial run ...

Getting the number one pick the year Ayton was coming out almost seemed like fate, so it was was kind of predictable he would be the no-brainer choice, even though we probably should have recognized that it's not a center league anymore, and he just doesn't have the engine.

Fingers crossed we've learned the lesson, finally.

 

[clyde2tw]

He also was better two years ago...he was so bad this last year that he became unplayable.

That's nonsense. He is the same player, Vogel's game plan made him unplayable, maybe listening to fans who claim we could not play an elite defender without a good 3pt shot.

 

[95pro]

That's nonsense. He is the same player, Vogel's game plan made him unplayable, maybe listening to fans who claim we could not play an elite defender without a good 3pt shot.

Scouting. Teams were on to him last season. They dared him to shoot even before Vogel.

 

[clyde2tw]

Scouting. Teams were on to him last season. They dared him to shoot even before Vogel.

Presumed that JO were no use on offense other than parking at the 3pt line

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

That's nonsense. He is the same player, Vogel's game plan made him unplayable, maybe listening to fans who claim we could not play an elite defender without a good 3pt shot.

He is not an elite defender. He was a good defender who tried as hard as he possibly could. But he wasn’t a mcdaniels or butler, or thybulle level defender. Not even close.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Presumed that JO were no use on offense other than parking at the 3pt line

You’re right, he was also excellent at driving wildly into traffic and getting his layup blocked or just flat out missing it.

Look, he’s an nba player. No doubt. But he’s an extremely limited specialist. Nothing more than that.