Suns vs Jazz thread

[Cheesebeef]

- Mike D needs to get straight with Amare. Amare needs to start feeling some love. Quit pussying around with his minutes, and run his ass into the ground. If he's not exerting enough energy on the court, then sit him.

Mike D and Nash need to quit kidding themselves. This team IS Amare. Get him the ball every time down the floor (exaggerating). So far, Nash has not been looking for him. I get the feeling Nash is trying to prove some kind of point about the Suns not needing Amare.

couldn't agree more - it's almost as if last season might be a hindrance right now. Nash is amazing but the only way this team gets ANYWHERE is if Amare is a HUGE part of the team. They got some good breaks last year in the playoffs with some HUGE clutch shots/scheduling/playoff seeding and it's almost as if because of how far they made it, they act like we won the title last year. last year was a SPECIAL run, but that team is HISTORY.

It almost seems like Amare's being frozen out by the team and the coach - it doesn't make sense to me and it seems like everyone on the team is fooling themselves if they don't think he's the meal-ticket now and in the future.

 

[CaptainInsano]

As long as this team shoots 25-28% for 3 we can kiss that title goodbye.

 

[elindholm]

When Bell fouled out with 2:16 to go and the Suns up by four, D'Antoni put in Banks ... at SF. I knew immediately that that decision would cost the Suns the game. Sure enough, Banks got completely lost on defense the next two plays, Utah tied it easily, and the momentum had shifted for good. D'Antoni realized his error and went with Jones instead, and that might have been enough had Barbosa not blown the layup.

Each of the two losses has featured a Nash-Barbosa-Banks lineup at some point. It's ridiculous. It may work as a fluke once in a while -- and I assume D'Antoni will keep trying it until it does -- but it has no future. So far Banks is a disaster as the backup PG, but turning him into the crunch time SF is not the answer.

 

[hawaiiansun]

Amare has played 12, 25, and 17 minutes in the first three games. Hope he gets things back in check.

 

[cly2tw]

Amare's minutes are just fine. He's been either overconfident or over-pessimist. The coach needs to limit his minutes so that there is no reason for either extremes. Slowly, with better conditioning and feel for the new team, we'll get him back dominangt for the playoffs. That's the only thing that counts.

 

[hawaiiansun]

Amare's minutes are just fine. He's been either overconfident or over-pessimist. The coach needs to limit his minutes so that there is no reason for either extremes. Slowly, with better conditioning and feel for the new team, we'll get him back dominangt for the playoffs. That's the only thing that counts.

Yeah i Know, I was just pointing out the roller coaster ride

 

[Treesquid PhD]

couldn't agree more - it's almost as if last season might be a hindrance right now. Nash is amazing but the only way this team gets ANYWHERE is if Amare is a HUGE part of the team. They got some good breaks last year in the playoffs with some HUGE clutch shots/scheduling/playoff seeding and it's almost as if because of how far they made it, they act like we won the title last year. last year was a SPECIAL run, but that team is HISTORY.

It almost seems like Amare's being frozen out by the team and the coach - it doesn't make sense to me and it seems like everyone on the team is fooling themselves if they don't think he's the meal-ticket now and in the future.

I think this is also a good point, I wonder if the Suns are scripting their first 20 games much like a Football coach scripted his first 20 plays.

D'Antoni is playing Banks eventhough he traditionally shys away from bad shooters to spare Nash
He is playing Thomas a lot
Diaw being made an example of
Using Amare only 15-20 mins, never at end of games
Barbosa being given a larger role "Go to guy"
Seeing what they have in James Jones

I think it's a script that is backfiring on him. I expect him to start to make changes soon.


My guess
Rose replaces Banks, banks sits more
Nash will play more mins
Diaw will get more time and more leeway
Amare gets more minuets possibly starts in 5 games

 

[hawaiiansun]

I am frustrated that we are not getting Amare the ball when he is in there. He was running the floor but not getting rewarded for it. Not to high on Marcus Banks in this game in particular. He was 0 for 8 with one assist and he seems to force his shots and does not get Amare or anyone else the ball on a regular basis. Why are we not playing Amare and Kurt together at times? I thought that was the plan when we traded for Kurt. It would open it up for Amare inside if Kurt was shooting the fifteen foot jumper like he does so well. I also hate giving up these leads and getting outrebounded. Hope Diaw shows up sometime this year also.

I do agree with you here, this game Marcus Banks was pretty bad I admit that, I'm just willing to give him time to learn this new offense and learn that he doesn't need to be the shoot first kinda guy he was in Boston and Minny. Banks gotta work on some pick and rolls with Amare .

 

[Treesquid PhD]

When Bell fouled out with 2:16 to go and the Suns up by four, D'Antoni put in Banks ... at SF. I knew immediately that that decision would cost the Suns the game. Sure enough, Banks got completely lost on defense the next two plays, Utah tied it easily, and the momentum had shifted for good. D'Antoni realized his error and went with Jones instead, and that might have been enough had Barbosa not blown the layup.

Each of the two losses has featured a Nash-Barbosa-Banks lineup at some point. It's ridiculous. It may work as a fluke once in a while -- and I assume D'Antoni will keep trying it until it does -- but it has no future. So far Banks is a disaster as the backup PG, but turning him into the crunch time SF is not the answer.

I agree, we'll see how the GM D'Antoni differs from the Coach D'Antoni.

The GM D'Antoni may not be as williing to sit his hand picked back up pt guard. We will see.

 

[Treesquid PhD]

I do agree with you here, this game Marcus Banks was pretty bad I admit that, I'm just willing to give him time to learn this new offense and learn that he doesn't need to be the shoot first kinda guy he was in Boston and Minny. Banks gotta work on some pick and rolls with Amare .

and I would rather give the time to Diaw a proven commodity.

 

[CaptainInsano]

Banks looked good up until now when I am starting to realise he LITERALLY can't hit a 3. Why did the suns sign someone who can't shoot worth a damn?

Hopefully Rose turns out to be Tim Thomas part 2. *edit as in not actual playing style but a saving grace

 

[hawaiiansun]

and I would rather give the time to Diaw a proven commodity.

I gotta agree, Diaw knows how to play in the system and until Banksy lives up to the hype i would go with Diaw too. I do like Banks though, and I want him to suceed.

 

[TJ]

We lead the Lakers by 19....we lose

We lead the Jazz by 15.....we lose

Bottom line: we have problems closing out games. Similar to the Cardinals. Unbelievable

 

[cly2tw]

When Bell fouled out with 2:16 to go and the Suns up by four, D'Antoni put in Banks ... at SF. I knew immediately that that decision would cost the Suns the game. Sure enough, Banks got completely lost on defense the next two plays, Utah tied it easily, and the momentum had shifted for good. D'Antoni realized his error and went with Jones instead, and that might have been enough had Barbosa not blown the layup.

Each of the two losses has featured a Nash-Barbosa-Banks lineup at some point. It's ridiculous. It may work as a fluke once in a while -- and I assume D'Antoni will keep trying it until it does -- but it has no future. So far Banks is a disaster as the backup PG, but turning him into the crunch time SF is not the answer.

The ultra small lineup of Nash-Bell-Barbs is a gambling one: Gamble on mistakes of the opponents and stir it up to seize some chance to turn the table around. Without solid rebounding its chance to succeed is small at best. But we should try to establish some "securing the lead" lineup for late game situation too, which should also look for solid defense and high-odds offense like Amare's 1-on-1 or Amare-Nash p&r.

 

[elindholm]

The ultra small lineup of Nash-Bell-Barbs is a gambling one: Gamble on mistakes of the opponents and stir it up to seize some chance to turn the table around.

Yes, but there are smart gambles and stupid gambles, and this is a stupid gamble.

 

[TJ]

id rather see Diaw @ SF than Banks in the clutch.....I agree with you guys when you say that the substitutions were sketch

 

[Cheesebeef]

Barbosa apparently blames missing the layup on... THE BALL.

**** Suns about the ball - EVERYONE plays with it - deal with it. Good lord, if I hear this team complain about the ball again, I will seriously wonder about their mental make-up.

 

[JS22]

Barbosa apparently blames missing the layup on... THE BALL.

**** Suns about the ball - EVERYONE plays with it - deal with it. Good lord, if I hear this team complain about the ball again, I will seriously wonder about their mental make-up.

Yeah, but it's not just him. A TON of players are complaining about the ball "slipping." Stern is just a jackass who refuses to listen.

(On a side note, I do agree that blaming the missed layup on the ball is weak.)

 

[mribnik]

I'm not too worried about the start this year. We did the same thing last year and everything turned out great. The difference this year is that we have higher expectations. D'Antoni will figure out the rotations soon enough and we'll be playing together as well. Also, it's not like we've played any bad teams so far. We've played three good teams that would be hard for any team to beat with a bunch of new players.

 

[panfolk]

Clearly, D'Anotini is out thinking himelf. Just play Diaw, you can't just never play him, we know he is a good player he just needs to work it out I am starting to think the same for Amare.

If you are going to lose then lose with guys that have an actual upside for God sakes.

Agreed.

 

[Mike Olbinski]

I'm not too worried about the start this year. We did the same thing last year and everything turned out great. The difference this year is that we have higher expectations. D'Antoni will figure out the rotations soon enough and we'll be playing together as well. Also, it's not like we've played any bad teams so far. We've played three good teams that would be hard for any team to beat with a bunch of new players.

Didn't we start 4-4 or something?

We'll be fine, we'll find our legs and our rotation.

Barbosa is even better than last year...

Also, our three-point shooting is way off, we'll find the mark there too.

 

[AZ Shocker]

Also, our three-point shooting is way off, we'll find the mark there too.

It's the new ball. Seriously...

 

[Muggum]

I just don't see any lineup consistency at all! Last year, D'Antoni got things down to a science. I could set my watch by when Barbosa would first check into the game, when House would enter and exit, when Nash would take his breathers, etc.

Now, it's just a Doc-Rivers-style hodge-podge. Tonight, we finished the game with Kurt Thomas and James Jones on the floor. I was scratching my head.

We need Boris Diaw in the game. I'm not sure I get it. If he's fat and out-of-shape and lazy and passive, and we planned not to play him, then we shouldn't have signed him to the big deal. Rather, we should have let him fade into a reduced role and then signed him next year for a lot less. But we paid him the big bucks, so clearly we didn't think he was fat/out-of-shape/lazy/passive. We thought he was near-max in ability. In that case, why aren't we playing him the 38 minutes a game we played him last year? He DOMINATED in the playoffs. And I'm supposed to be happy with him on the bench?

Amare is killing us. He's just not the player he was... yet... by a LONG shot, and yet we feel obligated to give him minutes. There seems to be a tradeoff between investing in his future (i.e., getting him out there) and actually winning games. I say let's win the games. Until he can dominate in practice, there's no reason to put him in It's just sad.

Banks is looking more and more like a shockingly bad personnel move, the kind that causes me to lose faith in the GM and scouts. We were sitting on both Williams and Rondo (hell, we even DRAFTED Rondo), and let them go in favor of the more expensive and obviously inferior Banks. I don't get it. The Rondo mistake will haunt us for years and years.

Still not sure what's going on with the 3-point shooting. They just aren't falling. Losing Tim Thomas has hurt. Kurt Thomas doesn't have the range. Marcus Banks apparently can't shoot it. Bell is in a slump. Marion is his usual shabby self. Amare hasn't uncorked any, despite all the rumblings of how great a shooter he became during his rehab.

I'm certainly not panicky, but I do think D'Antoni needs to get back to a consistent lineup. And now here comes Rose, which is only going to hurt matters...

 

[AZ Shocker]

D'Antonni takes a while to see who he wants, and at what times he wants them in there. Same as last year. Give him 'til at least Christmas. He'll get it figured out. But I agree...I kinda don't like Banks. At least at this point. Perhaps he'll get it going after a few more games, but ouch...so far not so good.

 

[Errntknght]

The ultra small lineup of Nash-Bell-Barbs is a gambling one: Gamble on mistakes of the opponents and stir it up to seize some chance to turn the table around.

Yes, but there are smart gambles and stupid gambles, and this is a stupid gamble.

This is a very normal D'Antoni line up... last year Bell played over a quarter of his minutes at SF. I thought Bell did about as well as anyone defending Harpring. Harpring can and does bang him around a good bit but Bell uses his guile to compensate. Now, putting Banks on Harpring at the end was dumb - he's not used to guarding guys down low and he was giving up 5" & 35 lbs to a tough, savvy frontcourt player. Diaw was the obvious choice but he's in D'Antoni's doghouse it appears.