Suns vs Spurs 10-31-14

[elindholm]

We'll see wont we? They paid IT big bucks to come here thinking possibly Bled wouldnt be. If the Suns have a chance to land a star later in the year, I think its bye bye to Bledsoe in a package.

It's a weird situation, that's for sure. Dragic was the odd man out down the stretch tonight, and the brief experiment of the three-PG lineup was a disaster. Bledsoe is a good defender, but is an offensive liability more often than not. I was surprised that Hornacek did not put Dragic in for Bledsoe, but maybe he was afraid of disrupting the defensive energy.

Unless someone else develops an in-between game, it's going to be hard to keep Thomas off the floor. And unless the three-PG lineup can be a lot more effective, it's not going to be a viable option. So where do Thomas's minutes come from?

 

[82CardsGrad]

It's ridiculous to suggest that IT makes Bled "expendable"... The Suns will be a team led and run by Bled for many, many years to come. IT plays an entirely different type of game, which is awesome and which the Suns totally knew when they brought in IT. But by NO means was IT expected to replace Bled now, or ever!


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[elindholm]

The Suns outSpurred the Spurs.

Heh, including benefitting from a bogus call in the closing seconds (the five-second inbound on Diaw, which accelerated through 3 and 4 and was terminated at about 4 1/2). I wonder what Popovich will say about that.

 

[82CardsGrad]

Heh, including benefitting from a bogus call in the closing seconds (the five-second inbound on Diaw, which accelerated through 3 and 4 and was terminated at about 4 1/2). I wonder what Popovich will say about that.

Really? Give it a rest dude... The Suns earned every inch of that win. The Spurs get the benefit of the doubt from the refs all game. The Suns had a horrendous shooting night and yet, they overcame the refs and their shooting woes to beat the defending champs. LOVE IT!!!


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[ProdigalSun]

so pissed that I had to work late tonight and miss this game. If Len can put up double doubles consistently this team has a chance to be special this year

 

[JS22]

Heh, including benefitting from a bogus call in the closing seconds (the five-second inbound on Diaw, which accelerated through 3 and 4 and was terminated at about 4 1/2). I wonder what Popovich will say about that.

Count it yourself. Watch the video. It was clearly 5 seconds. The official just did a horrible job of counting it.

 

[Superbone]

Count it yourself. Watch the video. It was clearly 5 seconds. The official just did a horrible job of counting it.

I watched many highlight shows which had a counter attached. It was 5 seconds before Diaw's hands met for the TO.

 

[elindholm]

Count it yourself. Watch the video. It was clearly 5 seconds. The official just did a horrible job of counting it.

Yeah, we see it differently, but not a big deal, I was just making a joke. The Suns were up 3 with something like 6.5 seconds left. The game wasn't already won by that point, but the odds were strongly in their favor.

 

[AzStevenCal]

It's a weird situation, that's for sure. Dragic was the odd man out down the stretch tonight, and the brief experiment of the three-PG lineup was a disaster. Bledsoe is a good defender, but is an offensive liability more often than not. I was surprised that Hornacek did not put Dragic in for Bledsoe, but maybe he was afraid of disrupting the defensive energy.

Unless someone else develops an in-between game, it's going to be hard to keep Thomas off the floor. And unless the three-PG lineup can be a lot more effective, it's not going to be a viable option. So where do Thomas's minutes come from?

In what way? Didn't we outscore them 10 - 2 when we went to those three? And the only Spurs points came on that questionable foul on the three point shot.

Steve

 

[sunsfan88]

It's a weird situation, that's for sure. Dragic was the odd man out down the stretch tonight, and the brief experiment of the three-PG lineup was a disaster. Bledsoe is a good defender, but is an offensive liability more often than not. I was surprised that Hornacek did not put Dragic in for Bledsoe, but maybe he was afraid of disrupting the defensive energy.

Unless someone else develops an in-between game, it's going to be hard to keep Thomas off the floor. And unless the three-PG lineup can be a lot more effective, it's not going to be a viable option. So where do Thomas's minutes come from?

What? Do you know what an offensive liability is? A player who teams double off of and leaves open on purpose. Tucker, for example, is an offensive liabilty at times. Bledsoe? Not even close. I have yet to see teams double off him and leave him open. His turnovers are still a bit of a problem but its improved a ton since he started for us last season. His decision making in the pick and roll is pretty good, he's EXCELLENT at finding the roll man.

His shooting is still inconsistent agreed, but its not awful. And Bledsoe is the 2nd best PG in the NBA at finishing at the rim through contact. Only Westbrook is better than him at that.

Its simply ridiculous to say that Bledsoe is an offensive liability most of the time. Other teams and their coaches and fans aren't relaxed when Bledsoe has the ball and is running a fast break or running a pick and roll or when he's driving at the rim.

Heh, including benefitting from a bogus call in the closing seconds (the five-second inbound on Diaw, which accelerated through 3 and 4 and was terminated at about 4 1/2). I wonder what Popovich will say about that.

True, but the Spurs were gifted a BS shooting foul on Ginobili right before, so it makes up for that.

If you watched the game, you'd see that overall the Spurs got much more favorable calls than the Suns.

 

[sunsfan88]

The vision shown here for a 7 ft play is amazing

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It was a complete no look pass, not once during the pick and roll did Len even look at Kieff.

I was watching through the Spurs broad cast and they said it best, "Most 7ft big men have a hard time chewing gum and running at the same time, its amazing that Len had the instinct to find Morris here for the easy jam".

 

[Phrazbit]

I think if NativeAZfan had said, "They brought IT here thinking possibly Bled wouldn't be", instead of referring to big bucks, it would be closer to the reason the Suns signed IT. It looked like a safety precaution.

If Bledsoe had gotten the offers he wanted from other teams, we wouldn't have evolved into the 3 Point Guard concept. Signing IT would have left us with two excellent Point Guards.

I find it odd people are still saying this... the Suns said all along Bledsoe was not going anywhere, they had every intention of carrying all 3 guards so they would not have to play guys like Ish anymore, and constently have an attacking guard on the court. Then they backed up that promise by breaking the bank for Bledsoe. It was not an insurance policy... Bledsoe could have signed in June and I am fully convinced they still would have gone for Thomas in July.

It's a weird situation, that's for sure. Dragic was the odd man out down the stretch tonight, and the brief experiment of the three-PG lineup was a disaster. Bledsoe is a good defender, but is an offensive liability more often than not. I was surprised that Hornacek did not put Dragic in for Bledsoe, but maybe he was afraid of disrupting the defensive energy.

Unless someone else develops an in-between game, it's going to be hard to keep Thomas off the floor. And unless the three-PG lineup can be a lot more effective, it's not going to be a viable option. So where do Thomas's minutes come from?

It was a disaster? We came back and won the game with all 3 of them on the court. Not sure how that translates. I'm not sure what you expect, them all to be dropping huge numbers at the same time? The Spurs had a lot to account for and a lot of trouble defending it. They might have not lit it up their own stat sheets like they would if they were out there individually, but it clearly worked for the Suns tonight.

 

[95pro]

The vision shown here for a 7 ft play is amazing

You must be registered for see images

It was a complete no look pass, not once during the pick and roll did Len even look at Kieff.

I was watching through the Spurs broad cast and they said it best, "Most 7ft big men have a hard time chewing gum and running at the same time, its amazing that Len had the instinct to find Morris here for the easy jam".

If you watched the reverse angle you can see the agility he has.

 

[elindholm]

In what way? Didn't we outscore them 10 - 2 when we went to those three? And the only Spurs points came on that questionable foul on the three point shot.

I'm pretty sure Dragic had already been subbed out. The Spurs got a few easy baskets right after Hornacek went 3PG and he changed back.

 

[elindholm]

In what way? Didn't we outscore them 10 - 2 when we went to those three? And the only Spurs points came on that questionable foul on the three point shot.

It was a disaster? We came back and won the game with all 3 of them on the court.

Ah, okay, I see my mistake. There were two 3PG shifts in the second half. I can't remember who the bigs were in the first one, maybe Tolliver and someone. That one was a disaster. But the one with Len and MkM at the end was effective. So you're right, it wasn't a disaster overall.

 

[JS22]

Yeah, we see it differently, but not a big deal, I was just making a joke. The Suns were up 3 with something like 6.5 seconds left. The game wasn't already won by that point, but the odds were strongly in their favor.

It just looked horrible because the ref sped up his count. I think he realized that he counted too slow the first few seconds.

Just a minor screw-up by the ref which happened at a pretty bad time.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Ah, okay, I see my mistake. There were two 3PG shifts in the second half. I can't remember who the bigs were in the first one, maybe Tolliver and someone. That one was a disaster. But the one with Len and MkM at the end was effective. So you're right, it wasn't a disaster overall.

Right now I think you have to pretty much ignore anything that happens with Tolliver on the court. He's really dragging us down despite his very limited minutes. I hope his hand fully heals and he finds his game soon otherwise once Tucker returns he's likely to be bounced from the rotation.

Steve

 

[95pro]

the NBA gametime show, shows a realtime clock in the recap of the 5 second violation. it definitely was 5 seconds.

 

[devilalum]

Right now I think you have to pretty much ignore anything that happens with Tolliver on the court. He's really dragging us down despite his very limited minutes. I hope his hand fully heals and he finds his game soon otherwise once Tucker returns he's likely to be bounced from the rotation.

Steve

The Suns have so many positive contributors, Toliver at the end of the bench is a luxury they can afford. We can't expect every move to be a diamond.

 

[Sci Fi]

The bigs were Plumlee and Kieff. Plumlee was the problem. (re: the bigs paired witg the 3 PG's)

Here's the gameflow.

http://www.popcornmachine.net/gf?date=20141031&game=SASPHO

 

[Sci Fi]

The Suns have so many positive contributors, Toliver at the end of the bench is a luxury they can afford. We can't expect every move to be a diamond.

Tolliver is only paid 3 million this year and the next year is unguaranteed. He could easily earn his keep if his hand heals soon.

 

[devilalum]

Tolliver is only paid 3 million this year and the next year is unguaranteed. He could easily earn his keep if his hand heals soon.

Yeah, I was thinking he might contribute more against certain teams. The Spurs aren't going to leave him alone to shoot uncontested 3s from the corner even if his hand is healed.

 

[Suns_fan69]

Ah, okay, I see my mistake. There were two 3PG shifts in the second half. I can't remember who the bigs were in the first one, maybe Tolliver and someone. That one was a disaster. But the one with Len and MkM at the end was effective. So you're right, it wasn't a disaster overall.

It was also pretty bad in the first half IIRC. That being said, I would venture to guess that using it in the 4th when the other team is presumably more tired is probably the most effective time to use it.

This is going to be an unpopular opinion but I see what Boogie Cousins was complaining about with IT. The man dominates the ball on offense. It's great when he's on (which he has been on so far) but hopefully he can balance it with some playmaking once he breaks the defense down. I thought he showed really good court vision in the intra-squad practice and in some of the preseason so he definitely has the ability.

 

[AzStevenCal]

It was also pretty bad in the first half IIRC. That being said, I would venture to guess that using it in the 4th when the other team is presumably more tired is probably the most effective time to use it.

This is going to be an unpopular opinion but I see what Boogie Cousins was complaining about with IT. The man dominates the ball on offense. It's great when he's on (which he has been on so far) but hopefully he can balance it with some playmaking once he breaks the defense down. I thought he showed really good court vision in the intra-squad practice and in some of the preseason so he definitely has the ability.

Yeah, it's an unpopular opinion with me. I want him to continue playing just the way he has. He does dominate the ball but when all around you are laying bricks, best to build your own house. Considering how "me, me, me" oriented Cousins is, I'd ignore his comments and let Thomas build his own reputation here. If he starts consistently ignoring wide open scorers, I'll have a problem with him but not until then.

Steve

 

[devilalum]

The Stats on this game are amazing. Any one of these 3 should have meant a loss to the Spurs.

2-18 from 3.
11 points in the first quarter.
41% shooting.
Even 22 points total from backcourt 2013.

Positive unexpected stats.

Outrebounded Spurs 50-45?
Outturnovered the Spurs 12-7 and even committed fewer fouls.