Suns will show interest in Shawn Marion... per Gambo

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For what its worth I would be okay with Hill playing that role instead of Marion with STAT and Chandler as well.

I just think he is going to leave and that if Marion is going to be anywhere near the player he was two years ago it would be here in Phoenix and alongside Nash.
 

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The only problem with Marion was his high salary and some occasional complaining because he thought he deserved more credit. Both of these issues should be resolved now. Marion should know where he stands around the league. I'd like to have him back.

Yes, while Nash was winning mvp's, Marion and Bell and SSOL covered his defensive problems. Just as great running backs need a good offensive line, and they usually give credit to them during interviews. Nash just needed to say "Shaun covers my ass on defense countless times when my man gets by me" in a few of his many interviews he had during those years. Also, Marion made more money than Amar'e and Nash, but he wasn't the best of the three so, it is understandable for management to look at trading his contract, not necessarily him or his skills. If Marion made less money he would not have been traded. IMO
 

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Id be OK w/ them bringing Marion back for cheap. In the Suns system he could still do well, and maybe he'd be motivated to make Kerr look foolish, who knows.

The Suns wouldnt win any titles, but a line up of:

Chandler/Lopez
Amare/Amundson/Griffin
Marion/Dudley/Clark
Jrich/LB/Tucker
Nash/Dragic

would be fun to watch and good enough for a 6-8 seed in the playoffs probably. With out their own 2010 pick, maybe it is best to just be mediocre but fun to watch next year. I dunno, Ive lost all long term hope at this point.
 

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Id be OK w/ them bringing Marion back for cheap. In the Suns system he could still do well, and maybe he'd be motivated to make Kerr look foolish, who knows.

The Suns wouldnt win any titles, but a line up of:

Chandler/Lopez
Amare/Amundson/Griffin
Marion/Dudley/Clark
Jrich/LB/Tucker
Nash/Dragic

would be fun to watch and good enough for a 6-8 seed in the playoffs probably. With out their own 2010 pick, maybe it is best to just be mediocre but fun to watch next year. I dunno, Ive lost all long term hope at this point.


See, I'd think this is a team that could be a top 5 team in the west. We were right in the mix a couple games back from a top 5 seed the majority of last year, and played terribly, while also missing Stat.
 

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See, I'd think this is a team that could be a top 5 team in the west. We were right in the mix a couple games back from a top 5 seed the majority of last year, and played terribly, while also missing Stat.

Agree. Athough relying on good health with that team might be asking alot.
 
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Are we overvaluing this Suns 2010 First Round Pick?

Golden State, Memphis, Minnesota, Oklahoma City, Clippers, Sacramento, Indiana, Charlotte, Milwaukee, New Jersey, Toronto, New York, and Washington were the other non-playoff teams. Have any of them improved their team that much?

The Suns probably aren't a bottom 10 team now. With Yao out and especially if Chandler leaves New Orleans, the Suns should be able to get a playoff position at least.
 

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Are we overvaluing this Suns 2010 First Round Pick?

Golden State, Memphis, Minnesota, Oklahoma City, Clippers, Sacramento, Indiana, Charlotte, Milwaukee, New Jersey, Toronto, New York, and Washington were the other non-playoff teams. Have any of them improved their team that much?

The Suns probably aren't a bottom 10 team now. With Yao out and especially if Chandler leaves New Orleans, the Suns should be able to get a playoff position at least.

I can assure you with Robin Lopez as your starting center you are not going to make the playoffs in the West.
 

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Are we overvaluing this Suns 2010 First Round Pick?

Golden State, Memphis, Minnesota, Oklahoma City, Clippers, Sacramento, Indiana, Charlotte, Milwaukee, New Jersey, Toronto, New York, and Washington were the other non-playoff teams. Have any of them improved their team that much?

The Suns probably aren't a bottom 10 team now. With Yao out and especially if Chandler leaves New Orleans, the Suns should be able to get a playoff position at least.

I think it's more that if the Suns had their 2010 pick they could make any move they wanted, including trading away the productive vets, without fearing that they are giving a lotto pick to another team.
 

Covert Rain

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Answer me this - What are we going to get for Amare or Nash now and sucking all next year with Lopez starting at Center? You lose millions in your product, still lose those name players, and Don't have a legit draft pick to help brign in some youth.

If Nash and Amare play out of their minds they will be worth something. If you look at the contracts guys get in a contract year when playing out of their minds, I have no doubt Amare will get a huge payday. Use their value now to bring something back or go out and get a guy like Chandler to play with them. If you don't get Chandler, I say there probably is no other size to get and this team will suck anyway.

Roll these guys out there as is and this team doesn't make the playoffs your going to lose millions anyway. Less revenue from TV Ratings, less Jersey sells and fewer people at games. Even if you keep Nash & Amare.

Pay Amare and Nash the money they are asking (Nash 29 Million & Amare the Max), then you strap your team even more hurting the future. The salary cap is going down next season and the luxury cap threshold as well. This team will have less flexibility doing that as well.

IMO the West will be down.

You mean the Lakers who just signed Artest? You mean the San Antonio spurs who just got better? What about the Blazers? I don't see the West is getting worse. I see the West as getting better.

Lakers - Better
San Antonio - Better
Blazers - getting better each season
Utah - still tough
Denver - tough
Hornets - Even without Chandler - tough
Dallas - probably the same but were better then us last year
Houston - if Yao gone for year, this is the only team that will probably be worse.

The West is not going "down" anytime soon.

Are we overvaluing this Suns 2010 First Round Pick?

Golden State, Memphis, Minnesota, Oklahoma City, Clippers, Sacramento, Indiana, Charlotte, Milwaukee, New Jersey, Toronto, New York, and Washington were the other non-playoff teams. Have any of them improved their team that much?

The Suns probably aren't a bottom 10 team now. With Yao out and especially if Chandler leaves New Orleans, the Suns should be able to get a playoff position at least.

In short yes. The draft is never a guarantee even with a good pick. It's a gamble. If having a 2010 draft pick is going to make or break your season then your team is in trouble. You need a mix of players drafted and free agents. No one draft pick is going to make or break your team unless you missed on on the next LeBron or something like that. What are your chances of that?
 
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I love how everyone assumes that chandler will be here next season and even if he is that he is destined to be a huge asset to our team. I think we may be getting a little bit ahead of ourselves with all of this chandler talk but that's JMHO
 

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I love how everyone assumes that chandler will be here next season and even if he is that he is destined to be a huge asset to our team. I think we may be getting a little bit ahead of ourselves with all of this chandler talk but that's JMHO

In the context of what is being discussed I don't think anybody is saying he is a lock for us to get them. However, he is a popular "what if" scenario. I have not heard anybody really assuming he is ours.
 

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SUNS are making a mistake by letting the absence of a '2010 pick dictate what direction they decide to go with the team. So what if OKC ends up with a high lotto pick because we rebuild and only win 30 games? That directly affects our roster how?.....it doesn't ,because it's not our pick.
My point is that by retooling an old roster just to get bounced in the first round by the LAKERS just so that OKC doesn't pick in the top 5 is bad GM'ing IMO.
To Sarver/Kerr: Do whats best for our roster now because you feel it's the right thing to do now.....for us.....****OKC.
If they(Sarver/Kerr) want to rebuild....rebuild now.
If they want to retool because they have a sound plan to make a nice title run.....do it now.
This reasoning that we should wait a year to rebuild(if thats the plan) just because OKC gets our '10 pick is highly misguided and stinks of purely a pride and marketing i$$ue.
imho
 
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elindholm

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SUNS are making a mistake by letting the absence of a '2010 pick dictate what direction they decide to go with the team. So what if OKC ends up with a high lotto pick because we rebuild and only win 30 games? That directly affects our roster how?.....it doesn't ,because it's not our pick.

That's not quite true. Oklahoma City is shaping up to be a major powerhouse in a few years. If the Suns want to rebuild, they should at least be thinking about who their competition is going to be in the next wave. The Lakers, Spurs, etc. will be old news by then, but the Thunder won't be. Which team would you rather the Suns be facing in the 2013 playoffs: Durant/Green/Harden/Westbrook etc., or that core plus yet another high lottery pick?

Let next year's top picks go to irrelevant teams like the Timberwolves, Kings, and Bucks. The Thunder already have more than enough stellar young talent.
 

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That's not quite true. Oklahoma City is shaping up to be a major powerhouse in a few years. If the Suns want to rebuild, they should at least be thinking about who their competition is going to be in the next wave. The Lakers, Spurs, etc. will be old news by then, but the Thunder won't be. Which team would you rather the Suns be facing in the 2013 playoffs: Durant/Green/Harden/Westbrook etc., or that core plus yet another high lottery pick?

Let next year's top picks go to irrelevant teams like the Timberwolves, Kings, and Bucks. The Thunder already have more than enough stellar young talent.
Most definately,but do you really think that by winning 50 games next year as opposed to 30 that we're going to somehow keep OKC from becoming a powerhouse anyway?...at the expense of how we want to run our own team? SUNS obviously made a mistake with that pick,i say we just move on from it. By rebuilding anyway(if thats the plan) it's a way of saying to OKC
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, you're not holding us hostage and dictating our FO moves just because you own our pick.
 

elindholm

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Most definately,but do you really think that by winning 50 games next year as opposed to 30 that we're going to somehow keep OKC from becoming a powerhouse anyway?

Which team would you rather the Suns be facing in the 2013 playoffs: Durant/Green/Harden/Westbrook etc., or that core plus yet another high lottery pick?

:shrug:
 

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If Nash and Amare play out of their minds they will be worth something. If you look at the contracts guys get in a contract year when playing out of their minds, I have no doubt Amare will get a huge payday. Use their value now to bring something back or go out and get a guy like Chandler to play with them. If you don't get Chandler, I say there probably is no other size to get and this team will suck anyway.

Roll these guys out there as is and this team doesn't make the playoffs your going to lose millions anyway. Less revenue from TV Ratings, less Jersey sells and fewer people at games. Even if you keep Nash & Amare.

Pay Amare and Nash the money they are asking (Nash 29 Million & Amare the Max), then you strap your team even more hurting the future. The salary cap is going down next season and the luxury cap threshold as well. This team will have less flexibility doing that as well.



You mean the Lakers who just signed Artest? You mean the San Antonio spurs who just got better? What about the Blazers? I don't see the West is getting worse. I see the West as getting better.

Lakers - Better
San Antonio - Better
Blazers - getting better each season
Utah - still tough
Denver - tough
Hornets - Even without Chandler - tough
Dallas - probably the same but were better then us last year
Houston - if Yao gone for year, this is the only team that will probably be worse.

The West is not going "down" anytime soon.



In short yes. The draft is never a guarantee even with a good pick. It's a gamble. If having a 2010 draft pick is going to make or break your season then your team is in trouble. You need a mix of players drafted and free agents. No one draft pick is going to make or break your team unless you missed on on the next LeBron or something like that. What are your chances of that?

Lakers-they are better but they are not invincible(their pick and roll defense, moments of passiveness and underestimating their opponents, their three point defense). They were the most emo team in the 2009 playoffs as they showed very little heart in some of the games they played. They are a team that coasts off of their rediculous talent. However, they are the cream of the West

San Antonio-they probably are better. But do they have enough lock down defenders. Kurt Thomas, Oberto, and Bowen are gone. Three quality defenders(even though Bowen was severely declining). They also suffer from the injury bug and Manu Ginobli might still suffer from injury. Without Manu, they are an average team which was proven when Dallas easily(IMO) beat them in the playoffs. If Manu is injured again, they will be very very good because of Jefferson but not great. You also have to wonder if Tim Duncan will continue to severely decline and suffer from knee problems. He complained about his knees, and when a big man complains about his knees in his near mid 30s, the end of his career or productive seasons is near.

Blazers-I believe people(including people on this board) over hyped them way too much last off season. Some people said they would make the Western Conference Finals and even come out of the West and win the Finals. They have a lot of talent yes, but they are too much off a jump shooting team to contend for a title or make a deep playoff run. Remember, we owned them in our house even when we weren't playing style where we are most dominant in. The Blazers lack a low post presence and it showed in the playoffs when the Rockets easily disposed of them and gave them a shock when they blew them out in Game 1 and Yao had a perfect game. I must admit however, that the Blazers are a machine in their building. Absolutely amazing.

Utah-Utah proved they are pretenders and not contenders this season. They still cannot consistently win on the road in big games, and they only play great at home. Until they learn to win on the road, they aint going anywhere. There interior defense is not impressive either. Boozer and Okur are not good defenders and they will always be beaten by teams with dominant big men in the 2nd round. The Rockets are an exception with Yao because they had McGrady, the 2nd round virgin who cursed them.

Denver-we match up well with them and we beat them twice. We could have swept them if we didn't give away a game in their house but the past is the past. Denver doesn't scare me at all. They became overrated after the playoffs because they beat up on weak New Orleans and a Mavericks team that struggled against them.

Hornets-With Chandler, they are a playoff team. Without him, they are a lottery team. Did you not see how Denver obliterated them by beating them by 56 points in the post season? They are a one man show with Chris Paul dominanting the ball 95% off the time. They have a weak bench, a injury riddled SF in Peja and a jump shooting PF who plays like a SG. The Hornets went from pretenders to a mediocre near lottery team. If they lose Chandler, they will be a low seed again or might not even make the playoffs.

Dallas-I might agree hear. Dallas has always given us problems. However, we did blow them out badly in one game(I know, they blew us out twice this season). Also remember we lost one game after a tough back to back and playing under Porter(Porter sucked), and lost to them without Amare twice. Us against them is a toss up next season.

Rockets-The Rockets have always been overrated and have always been pretenders. We own the Rockets, and now with Yao and Artest gone, we will own them even more.

The Suns are better than you might think. If the Suns play like they did under Gentry with Amare back and under the notion that Chandler is here(not saying he will be, but if he is), they will make the playoffs. You can only go up from there.
 
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SUNS are making a mistake by letting the absence of a '2010 pick dictate what direction they decide to go with the team. So what if OKC ends up with a high lotto pick because we rebuild and only win 30 games? That directly affects our roster how?.....it doesn't ,because it's not our pick.
My point is that by retooling an old roster just to get bounced in the first round by the LAKERS just so that OKC doesn't pick in the top 5 is bad GM'ing IMO.
To Sarver/Kerr: Do whats best for our roster now because you feel it's the right thing to do now.....for us.....****OKC.
If they(Sarver/Kerr) want to rebuild....rebuild now.
If they want to retool because they have a sound plan to make a nice title run.....do it now.
This reasoning that we should wait a year to rebuild(if thats the plan) just because OKC gets our '10 pick is highly misguided and stinks of purely a pride and marketing i$$ue.
imho

Have the Suns made any mention of wanting that pick back? Most of the complaints about the 2010 pick I hear comes from columnists or this board. But I do agree, we shouldn't build our season around one first round draft pick next year.

As much as I hate the waiting, the Suns should be sitting on the Ben Wallace salary space. Dumping salary for the 2009-2010 season is going to be worth A LOT to someone. I kinda get the feeling that the Chandler deal is in place just waiting for the Suns to pull the trigger. What' s the rush? Maybe a better offer will come around for a more desperate trading partner.
 

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I love how everyone assumes that chandler will be here next season and even if he is that he is destined to be a huge asset to our team. I think we may be getting a little bit ahead of ourselves with all of this chandler talk but that's JMHO

Thank you. I pointed this out a month ago. Getting Chandler is not the panacea to our issues in the 5 slot. He is a good player, but has a track record for missing games. He failed OKC's physical when NO tried to trade him last season. He is coming off major surgery on both his left toe and ankle. Plus, he is on the books for two more seasons at around $24 mil. If we are in "rebuilding mode" we should save that $12 mil for next offseason and attempt to get someone else that can atleast play 85% of the games in a season.
 

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Lakers-they are better but they are not invincible(their pick and roll defense, moments of passiveness and underestimating their opponents, their three point defense). They were the most emo team in the 2009 playoffs as they showed very little heart in some of the games they played. They are a team that coasts off of their rediculous talent. However, they are the cream of the West

San Antonio-they probably are better. But do they have enough lock down defenders. Kurt Thomas, Oberto, and Bowen are gone. Three quality defenders(even though Bowen was severely declining). They also suffer from the injury bug and Manu Ginobli might still suffer from injury. Without Manu, they are an average team which was proven when Dallas easily(IMO) beat them in the playoffs. If Manu is injured again, they will be very very good because of Jefferson but not great. You also have to wonder if Tim Duncan will continue to severely decline and suffer from knee problems. He complained about his knees, and when a big man complains about his knees in his near mid 30s, the end of his career or productive seasons is near.

Blazers-I believe people(including people on this board) over hyped them way too much last off season. Some people said they would make the Western Conference Finals and even come out of the West and win the Finals. They have a lot of talent yes, but they are too much off a jump shooting team to contend for a title or make a deep playoff run. Remember, we owned them in our house even when we weren't playing style where we are most dominant in. The Blazers lack a low post presence and it showed in the playoffs when the Rockets easily disposed of them and gave them a shock when they blew them out in Game 1 and Yao had a perfect game. I must admit however, that the Blazers are a machine in their building. Absolutely amazing.

Utah-Utah proved they are pretenders and not contenders this season. They still cannot consistently win on the road in big games, and they only play great at home. Until they learn to win on the road, they aint going anywhere. There interior defense is not impressive either. Boozer and Okur are not good defenders and they will always be beaten by teams with dominant big men in the 2nd round. The Rockets are an exception with Yao because they had McGrady, the 2nd round virgin who cursed them.

Denver-we match up well with them and we beat them twice. We could have swept them if we didn't give away a game in their house but the past is the past. Denver doesn't scare me at all. They became overrated after the playoffs because they beat up on weak New Orleans and a Mavericks team that struggled against them.

Hornets-With Chandler, they are a playoff team. Without him, they are a lottery team. Did you not see how Denver obliterated them by beating them by 56 points in the post season? They are a one man show with Chris Paul dominanting the ball 95% off the time. They have a weak bench, a injury riddled SF in Peja and a jump shooting PF who plays like a SG. The Hornets went from pretenders to a mediocre near lottery team. If they lose Chandler, they will be a low seed again or might not even make the playoffs.

Dallas-I might agree hear. Dallas has always given us problems. However, we did blow them out badly in one game(I know, they blew us out twice this season). Also remember we lost one game after a tough back to back and playing under Porter(Porter sucked), and lost to them without Amare twice. Us against them is a toss up next season.

Rockets-The Rockets have always been overrated and have always been pretenders. We own the Rockets, and now with Yao and Artest gone, we will own them even more.

The Suns are better than you might think. If the Suns play like they did under Gentry with Amare back and under the notion that Chandler is here(not saying he will be, but if he is), they will make the playoffs. You can only go up from there.

Give credit where credit is due.

You basically bashed every playoff team and put the Suns on a pedistal. For example, you say that the Lakers are laxidazical and take plays off. Well, they did win the championship, right? And you can't fault SA for getting Jefferson. That is a huge aquisition and makes them relavent again. Just about everyone else is status quo at this point

The only team out of your list I agree with is Houston. They will not have Yao and Artest, plus they will not have T-Mac for the beginning of the season. We could possibly knock them out of the playoffs and make a run for the 7th or 8th seed. But there is one other team that may look a lot better next season that shouldn't be overlooked: the OKC Thunder.
 

elindholm

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If we are in "rebuilding mode" we should save that $12 mil for next offseason and attempt to get someone else that can atleast play 85% of the games in a season.

Chandler has played at least 85% of the games in a season (70) in seven out of the eight years of his career. He has averaged fewer than five missed games over the past five years.
 

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Chandler has played at least 85% of the games in a season (70) in seven out of the eight years of his career. He has averaged fewer than five missed games over the past five years.
Yeah i was looking at that too. The last two years have been rough for Chandler but outside of that i don't see anything to be overly concerned about. There is the magic training staff factor here to think about...;)
Chandler was a high FG% 12/12/1.5 guy before the injuries took hold.
 

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Chandler has played at least 85% of the games in a season (70) in seven out of the eight years of his career. He has averaged fewer than five missed games over the past five years.

Understand, but he is coming off two major surgeries. Is he going to be 100% this year? Is he going to play enough games? Magic 8-ball says "Outlook fuzzy" at this time
 
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ASUCHRIS

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Understand, but he is coming off two major surgeries. Is he going to be 100% this year? Is he going to play enough games? Magic 8-ball says "Outlook fuzzy" at this time

Regardless, he's a perfect compliment to the Suns best player, and he is only on the hook for 2 more years at 12 mil per. Even if he is constantly injured, it's only a two year mistake. I trust our training staff we'll be able to keep him effective.
 

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