Terry Porter new Suns coach, 3 year contract.

[Mainstreet]

D'Antoni's tenure showed a lot of good things (as you detailed above), but in the end, the goal is to win a championship and that goal was never realized. Mike D'Antoni deserves all the criticism that comes along with failing to do so with a high-level team. This one criticism far outweighs the collective great things from the above post.

Realistically D'Antoni only had four years to win a Championship. After averaging 58 wins over the past four seasons and two WCF appearances, I guess this means he cannot win the big one.

Also it should be noted D'Antoni choose the player to run his system, Steve Nash. It took some smarts to install this system with Nash as the sparkplug. IMO, some Suns fans are just plain spoiled with success. They get D'Antoni's brief but highly successful tenure with the Suns confused with forty years of frustration and not winning a Championship.

I'm sure Porter is now going to roll up the Championships. As much as I wish to be proved wrong, I just do not seeing it happening unless the Suns have a KG or Gasol type moment.

 

[Mainstreet]

Those with skills that fit his system could indeed become confident and perform complimentarily for better stats then would be in other systems. If developing is interpreted as "improving stats", then no dispute here. But it's not.

However, isn't that what coaching in the NBA is all about. Getting players to fit a coach's system.

 

[cly2tw]

However, isn't that what coaching in the NBA is all about. Getting players to fit a coach's system.

Well, I never said DA was useless. He won games, without having or maybe willing to develop much. It's both what's good and bad from him. As Chaplin put it, with the talent on the team he failed to deliver a championship, and failed repeatedly in about the same manner to the same team. That's his demise here despite the regular season frenzies his style of play generated.

 

[Chaplin]

Realistically D'Antoni only had four years to win a Championship. After averaging 58 wins over the past four seasons and two WCF appearances, I guess this means he cannot win the big one.

Also it should be noted D'Antoni choose the player to run his system, Steve Nash. It took some smarts to install this system with Nash as the sparkplug. IMO, some Suns fans are just plain spoiled with success. They get D'Antoni's brief but highly successful tenure with the Suns confused with forty years of frustration and not winning a Championship.

I'm sure Porter is now going to roll up the Championships. As much as I wish to be proved wrong, I just do not seeing it happening unless the Suns have a KG or Gasol type moment.

I'm trying to figure out if you're putting words into my mouth or not. Nobody expects Porter to "roll up the championships."

The bottom line is that D'Antoni failed in trying to get the Suns a championship--he tried, no denying that, and he had the personnel to do it, but his coaching style and stubbornness showed that he would never win the championship with the Phoenix Suns.

Why do fans love to complain about the team not winning a championship in 40 years, but want to hold onto a guy who definitely wouldn't deliver one? To me, that smacks of hypocrisy.

 

[nowagimp]

D'Antoni developed Joe Johnson no matter how one looks at it. When he first arrived in Phoenix he was a very timid player. He became a star in Phoenix and then went to a weaker team so he could an All-Star. Also JJ did not want to be the fourth star in Phoenix. In regard to Amare, perhaps he is not a post-up player. I guess the other examples cited by Nowagimp doesn't mean anything either

Yep, JJ learned enough in phoenix to be the player that the hawks built the team around, paying him 70M to sign. Its bullcrap that "JJ learned with the hawks", he pretty much looks like the same player, a very good '2', not a PG. JJ has the same skills, off the dribble, as a shooter and as a decent finisher that he had as a sun. Just a few years more experience, hardly serious player development.

 

[nowagimp]

Realistically D'Antoni only had four years to win a Championship. After averaging 58 wins over the past four seasons and two WCF appearances, I guess this means he cannot win the big one.

Also it should be noted D'Antoni choose the player to run his system, Steve Nash. It took some smarts to install this system with Nash as the sparkplug. IMO, some Suns fans are just plain spoiled with success. They get D'Antoni's brief but highly successful tenure with the Suns confused with forty years of frustration and not winning a Championship.

I'm sure Porter is now going to roll up the Championships. As much as I wish to be proved wrong, I just do not seeing it happening unless the Suns have a KG or Gasol type moment.

Forget it mainstreet, no convincing suns fans who are so frustrated that they dont see the forrest through the trees. POPs himself said the suns offense was the hardest offense in the NBA to prepare for. I seriously doubt Kerr could improve on it. If the suns had failed for 4 years playing big, as just about every other team has, the small ball blame game wouldnt even come up. If the suns win last year w/out suspensions, or if JJ wasnt traded and the suns won it all, it would be a different story. But they didnt and fanatics are not known for their objectivity. The only thing that is "definite" is that the suns didnt win and a green GM took over and is pushing all the buttons with MR foam finger. Hopefully Porter can pick up the pieces and save something. Kerr may be a better GM that DAntoni -that aint saying much- but I'm laughing at Kerr for thinking he knows how to coach NBA offense.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

50+ and fade is fun for some fans and thats not a knock on "those" fans either.
Some of us aren't falling for that type of "success" though.
If the SUNS can prove over the course of an 82 game season that they can get stops on the defensive end and execute their offense in crunch time then i give them a better chance at doing something important when the games start to count.
D'Antoni NEVER gave me that confidence during a playoff series and i think it's safe to say now that Kerr wasn't falling for the 50+ and fade either. Was D'Antoni micro-managed last year?...No doubt.
IMO he was also forced to shake it up with the Shaq trade. You will never convince me that Mikey D. was in favor of that decision....(just re-watch the press conference and it's clear as day). It was Kerr's answer to D'Antoni's reluctance to "change." In hindsight i'm not impressed with Sarver/Kerr mortgaging our future in an attempt to strong arm D'Antoni by gambling on an old Shaq on the downslide, but it is what it is.
D'Antoni's days were numbered as soon as Shaq stepped off the plane at Sky Harbor.

Welcome, Terry Porter. You've got a tough regular season act to follow....but if you can just compete with the other Western Conference coaches over the course of a 7 game playoff series without looking foolish you've given me much hope going forward.

i couldn't have written this better if i wrote it myself. i agree with each and every topic you hit.

happy to see porter here. interested to see what he's got. would have liked to have explored thibidoueuou (sp?) just for shiz and giggles.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

I was very impressed with Silas as a head coach, so I hope it works out. I have not followed the work of Dave Cowens (former Celtics great) who was a coach with the Pistons, so he may be Porter's choice.

i'd be stoked if we got cowens as a big man coach. i can't remember who he worked with, but i recall an impressive big crediting him with his success. he's also worked with some very young bigs in detroit that were contributors . . . a good sign.

 

[Irish]

I find the criticism of D'Antoni to be too scattered for my taste. He had some issues that I hope Porter can address (better team defense and better judgement on shot selection), but I don't see a wholesale change in the Suns offense.

If there is to a changes on offense, it will be on the hald court sets. Under D'Antoni, the Suns scored very well in the first 10 seconds, OK in the early pick and roll offense, and were just awful with the clock running down. My biggest conceern was that the team relied too much on Nash's wandering around and not enough on movement and back screens.

For example, when Diaw is playing inside, I'd like to see some of the sets run by the Kings early in the decad with Divac at the high post using cutters and back screens.

 

[Yuma]

I'm hoping Terry Porter works out like the Chargers changing their coach. Marty Schottenheimer was racking up the regular season wins like D'Antoni. He just couldn't get us a win in post season. We bring in Norv Turner, who everyone thought was a lesser coach, but he got us into the AFC Championship, where injuries arguably derailed our season. Maybe Porter doesn't rack up as many regular season wins, but if he gets us in the Finals, it's all good!

 

[mojorizen7]

I'm hoping Terry Porter works out like the Chargers changing their coach. Marty Schottenheimer was racking up the regular season wins like D'Antoni. He just couldn't get us a win in post season. We bring in Norv Turner, who everyone thought was a lesser coach, but he got us into the AFC Championship, where injuries arguably derailed our season. Maybe Porter doesn't rack up as many regular season wins, but if he gets us in the Finals, it's all good!

Solid analogy Yuma.

 

[shazaam6]

That is just an ignorant statement, almost pure ignornace. Objective criticism is not in your bag is it? this criticism smell like a sewer, its almost the opposite of the truth.


So no one improved or developed under Dantoni?

Joe Johnson went from talented enigma to near all star, to the Hawks
Diaw, unwanted hawks scrub to NBA MIP
Barbosa, from a non english speaking rookie to NBA 6th man
Nash became 2 time NBA MVP, after being "washed up" according to cuban
Amare Stoudemire went from promising high schooler to 1st team all NBA.

All this happened under DAntoni, while the roster turnover was quite high as only Nash and amare remain from the '04 rotation.

Why dont you just stick to the non use of the bench or some other supportable argument like defensive strategy. there are plenty of supportable criticisms of DAntoni, he was a poor GM, he didnt acquire and retain quality assistant coaches.


And yes, steve Kerr an unproven nobody of a GM craps golden nuggets and trades away (2) #1 picks to unload an expiring contract.

Diaw went from inconsistent to still inconsistent.
Barbosa still cant draw a foul or play effective defense.
The Nash-led Mavericks led the NBA in scoring the 2 years prior to joining the Suns. Successful without D'antoni
Amare is a rare talent of strength and coordination and determination to dominate. He would be successful anywhere. I think he would be better if he had more balanced coaching of the fundamentals.
Marion was here before D'antoni. What significant way did his game improve due to D'antoni?
What rookie or young player did he improve or develope? They just seem to sit on the bench no matter what. Joe Johnson had all the tools just not the confidence.

You have your opinion, mine is that he could have done better with the talent here.

I'm glad he left. D'antoni was too set in his ways to be effective here anymore. Because he only played 7 or 8 players, he was always one player injury away from having an undermanned team. Foolish, kind of like going cross country on a rough road with no spare tire. Then blaming bad luck for the probable flat.

If D'antoni is so good of a coach why can't anyone else run the offense effectively when Nash is out? Ok so no one plays like Nash but run some other offense that can be run successfully when Nash is out. The 29 other teams run something on offense without Nash.

It was like he ignored the weaknesses that were obvious to others and blamed circumstances that all teams face.

 

[shazaam6]

That is just an ignorant statement, almost pure ignornace. Objective criticism is not in your bag is it? this criticism smell like a sewer, its almost the opposite of the truth.


So no one improved or developed under Dantoni?

Joe Johnson went from talented enigma to near all star, to the Hawks
Diaw, unwanted hawks scrub to NBA MIP
Barbosa, from a non english speaking rookie to NBA 6th man
Nash became 2 time NBA MVP, after being "washed up" according to cuban
Amare Stoudemire went from promising high schooler to 1st team all NBA.

All this happened under DAntoni, while the roster turnover was quite high as only Nash and amare remain from the '04 rotation.

Why dont you just stick to the non use of the bench or some other supportable argument like defensive strategy. there are plenty of supportable criticisms of DAntoni, he was a poor GM, he didnt acquire and retain quality assistant coaches.


And yes, steve Kerr an unproven nobody of a GM craps golden nuggets and trades away (2) #1 picks to unload an expiring contract.

I'll think, say, or do whatever I want. I read your opinion of my post and I don't agree with you. So don't tell me what I should stick to like you are an authority about what I know.

I'm looking forward to seeing what Porter does with the Suns and I'm optimistic that I will see a different/better philosophy in many areas.

 

[Irish]

D'Antoni had his strengths and weaknesses. A year ago the Suns won more games against the Spurs than any other team in the playoffs dispite not having Bell and some very "odd" officiating. This year the Suns were competiative dispite losing Hill in the middle of G ame 1.

Could he have done better? I think so. IMHO he was too much of a true believer in speed balll without recognizing the need to counter the way Spurs were defensing them and he took too long to figure out how to deal with Parker. Subtle stuff, but ultimately fatal.

We don't need to trash him to suggest things needed to be changed: better team defense (and less predicatble sets), more variety int eh half court, and improved depth so that the Suns don't get killed every year by an untimely injury.

I like what I'm hearing from Porter. Hopefully he'll build on the good stuff D'Antoni did and add what was missing.

 

[nowagimp]

Diaw went from inconsistent to still inconsistent.
Barbosa still cant draw a foul or play effective defense.
The Nash-led Mavericks led the NBA in scoring the 2 years prior to joining the Suns. Successful without D'antoni
Amare is a rare talent of strength and coordination and determination to dominate. He would be successful anywhere. I think he would be better if he had more balanced coaching of the fundamentals.
Marion was here before D'antoni. What significant way did his game improve due to D'antoni?
What rookie or young player did he improve or develope? They just seem to sit on the bench no matter what. Joe Johnson had all the tools just not the confidence.

You have your opinion, mine is that he could have done better with the talent here.

I'm glad he left. D'antoni was too set in his ways to be effective here anymore. Because he only played 7 or 8 players, he was always one player injury away from having an undermanned team. Foolish, kind of like going cross country on a rough road with no spare tire. Then blaming bad luck for the probable flat.

If D'antoni is so good of a coach why can't anyone else run the offense effectively when Nash is out? Ok so no one plays like Nash but run some other offense that can be run successfully when Nash is out. The 29 other teams run something on offense without Nash.

It was like he ignored the weaknesses that were obvious to others and blamed circumstances that all teams face.

Youre just making up a bunch of excuses, no objectivity(like 2 time MVP, MIP, NBA 6th man, all-star). Yeah we have our opinions, its just that mine have SOME facts to back them up, yours have none at all. Why cant anyone else run the the offense when nash is out? Its so obvious, its silly. NO LEGITIMATE BACKUP PG over the last 4 years. Damn, you need that expained to you?

 

[shazaam6]

Youre just making up a bunch of excuses, no objectivity(like 2 time MVP, MIP, NBA 6th man, all-star). Yeah we have our opinions, its just that mine have SOME facts to back them up, yours have none at all. Why cant anyone else run the the offense when nash is out? Its so obvious, its silly. NO LEGITIMATE BACKUP PG over the last 4 years. Damn, you need that expained to you?

I know about the facts: Nash's 2 MVP's, Diaw's MIP, and Barbosa's 6th man Award and various All-star and All NBA recognitions.
I dont draw the same conclusion as to the cause of those facts that you do.

You credit D'antoni for Nash's MVP's right? Would you credit Westphal for Barkley's MVP or that he had better players around him and went far enough in the playoffs to allow him to be recognized as the MVP. As you said in another thread (D'antoni gone, now Nash? ... post #63)he had better years statisically as a Sixer than a Sun.

Diaw has not played up to his MIP award level for almost 2 years. Shows flashes but nothing that can be counted on which is similar to what he was when we got him.

Barbosa is a one dimensional player with all the tools but only using half. He gets to the rim or shoots 3's but can't draw fouls because he hasn't learned to jump into the defender to create contact to get the call like Parker. Why not? It would improve his game but he just shoots awkwardly around the defender instead to avoid their block. He is/was good enough to win the 6th man award but not improved since. Also doesn't defend well eventhough he is long, fast and according to some announcers, stronger than he looks.

Bell has been on all NBA defensive teams with the Suns. I don't think he taught Bell defense. If he did, why not teach Barbosa and Amare to be at least adequate. No, Bell knew how to play D already.

Marion all star level but consistant stats before and after D'antoni got here. No improvement to a mid range shot or the ability to drive on his man and not a reliable ball handler when guarded closely.

I don't think D'antoni was responsible for elevating their talent. My opinion is that they were talented already and got the recognition they deserved. I see them playing D'antoni's style but I don't see where anyone made significant improvements to their game due to D'antoni.

As far as your NO LEGITIMATE BACKUP PG.
I agree there isn't one and everyone has known it. However, Nash needs to rest sometime. I didn't see D'antoni having a plan B offense for when Steve was out that we could count on, being practiced during the season. Since everyone saw that we had a hard time scoring with Nash out, the other teams caught up or extended their leads. He could have had a tough defensive team developed to at least slow down their scoring. But that would require a shift of focus from offense to defense just for a few minutes to rest Nash, and that wasn't going to happen with D'antoni.

 

[Ronin]

With their big guys, their perimeter guys and (Brandon) Roy at the end of games, they’re going to be a very good team for a long time.”
Porter is going to have a very good team, himself. The goal in Phoenix will be to continue the running game established by Mike D’Antoni – but with a little more attention to the defensive end.
“I don’t think we will be shooting the ball every seven seconds,” Porter says, referring to D’Antoni’s stated goal. “We want to take advantage of the skills of the people we have to run. But we’ll probably gear it down just a little from what it was.”
Porter was the head coach of the Milwaukee Bucks for two seasons but didn’t have a lot of talent on those teams. He got the Bucks to a surprising .500 record in 2003-04 but fell back in ’04-’05 to 30-52. The team he will inherit in Phoenix will be much, much better than anything he had in Milwaukee.
“It is a nice mixture of veterans and youth,” he says. “It’s definitely a plus to come into a job and have this kind of talent. I’m very excited about the job. It is a championship-caliber team.”

http://www.portlandtribune.com/sports/story.php?story_id=121304922870873500

 

[Yuma]

I see no problem with scoring in seven seconds or less when we have the open opportunity. The problem I hated is when we went half court and didn't even get a shot off by turning it over. Our ball control was way bad this year, imho! If we cut the turnovers in half or better down to a third, we will be OK, imho.

 

[Superbone]

shazaam6, who the heck is that in your avatar?

 

[YouJustGotSUNSD]

G&A just reported the Phoenix Suns are interviewing former NBA center Bill Cartwright for an assistant coaching position.



From KTAR

Cartwright is currently an assistant on the New Jersey Nets coaching staff.
Cartwright was the head coach of the Chicago Bulls from the middle of the 2001-02 season to the beginning of the 2003-04 season. Under Cartwright's guidance the Bulls were 51-100. His only full season at the helm was the 2002-03 season.
Cartwright was on Phil Jackson's staff in Chicago after his playing days were over. Cartwright was a member of three NBA titles (1991, 1992, and 1993) with Chicago.
Cartwright played 16 NBA seasons with the New York Knicks, Chicago Bulls and Seattle SuperSonics.

They also said Tom Chambers, Eddie Johnson, Dan Majerle, Jeff Hornacek, and someone else are also being considered for the coaching staff.

 

[WuRaider]

G&A just reported the Phoenix Suns are interviewing former NBA center Bill Cartwright for an assistant coaching position.

I'd rather have Silas, guess he was blowing smoke up Kerr's ass.