The Big Summer of 2012

[slinslin]

You get a pass because both Williams and Howard are much better players than Gortat.

 

[crisper57]

We won't get to the summer before it is a failure. Howard will be dealt and on a new team by then. Hell, at this rate, Steve Nash will be the biggest free agent to hit the market. So we will feel the pressure to overpay the mediocre talent left. It will be good enough for us to luck into a bottom tier playoff spot and keep us out of the lottery.

And the cycle will continue.

 

[elindholm]

You get a pass because both Williams and Howard are much better players than Gortat.

Relative to their positions, no, Williams is not much better than Gortat. Williams is in the second tier of league PGs, behind the top few (Rose, Paul, Westbrook), just as Gortat is in the second tier of league centers.

 

[Covert Rain]

You get a pass because both Williams and Howard are much better players than Gortat.

slinslin nobody needs a pass with the junk you come up with. However, based on another thread we now know why.

Relative to their positions, no, Williams is not much better than Gortat. Williams is in the second tier of league PGs, behind the top few (Rose, Paul, Westbrook), just as Gortat is in the second tier of league centers.

Agreed that is not that big of a gap. Williams is no LeBron. In fact, I go as far as he is not even a Nash in his prime.

 

[slinslin]

Relative to their positions, no, Williams is not much better than Gortat. Williams is in the second tier of league PGs, behind the top few (Rose, Paul, Westbrook), just as Gortat is in the second tier of league centers.

Based on what? Just last year Deron Williams was called the best PG in the league by half of the GMs in the league. Calling Deron Williams a "second tier" PG in the league is ridiculous especially when naming Westbrook a tier above him.

 

[elindholm]

Just last year Deron Williams was called the best PG in the league by half of the GMs in the league.

Behind which one: The MVP Rose, or the injured but otherwise obviously superior Paul?

Calling Deron Williams a "second tier" PG in the league is ridiculous especially when naming Westbrook a tier above him.

You're allowed to have your own opinions and I'm allowed to have mine. I wouldn't even place Williams above Nash right now, for this season. Williams just isn't that good. He's not a good shooter and has never led a team anywhere. His numbers this year are terrible, and you say, he's on a bad team, well guess what, Nash is on a bad team too.

Williams is probably the most overrated PG in the league, or second to Rondo.

 

[slinslin]

Behind which one: The MVP Rose, or the injured but otherwise obviously superior Paul?



You're allowed to have your own opinions and I'm allowed to have mine. I wouldn't even place Williams above Nash right now, for this season. Williams just isn't that good. He's not a good shooter and has never led a team anywhere. His numbers this year are terrible, and you say, he's on a bad team, well guess what, Nash is on a bad team too.

Williams is probably the most overrated PG in the league, or second to Rondo.

Two things:
1. I am talking about the NBAs GM poll at the beginning of each season which is where 50% rated Deron Williams #1 at the beginning of last season.

2. Deron Williams supporting cast in New Jersey is considerably worse than what Nash has here in Phoenix, especially with Brook Lopez out.

And one more last thing. Deron Williams did not take off time during the lockout. He went to play in europe and struggled there in the beginning as adapting to a new team, style and rules before he absolutely dominated. It is no surprise that he has gotten off to a slow start this year in a year the Nets were tanking from the beginning since they could not get Howard.

Deron Williams made the WCF with the Jazz and lead them to the semis twice.

 

[slinslin]

Gallinari accepted the extension, Westbrook did, Love dide and Gordon might be next.. the Pacers will match any offer for Hibbert.

Deron Williams, Dwight Howard, Brook Lopez might be the only noteworthy free agents if they even hit the market. Brook Lopez at PF next to Gortat would make an intriguing 7 footer combo I guess.

Other than that you will be allowed to gamble on Beasley, Mayo or Anthony Randolph.

Time to start scouting the 2013 draft

Shabazz Muhammad 6'6 SG projected #1 pick in 2013

 

[Griffin]

With Gallinari, Love and Westbrook signing extensions, the Suns free agents options have decreased significantly. This was supposed to have been a big free agent summer, but the only max-worthy free agents remaining are probably Dwight Howard and Deron Williams who both are likely to opt out of their current deals and neither likely to want to play in Phoenix. There's also Eric Gordon who will be a restricted free agent, but he missed half the season last year and is injured this year as well. So if the Suns are going to sign anyone, it almost certainly won't be a max-caliber player.

So who is left? In no particular order:

Notable unrestricted free agents

• Ray Allen
• Kevin Garnett
• Boris Diaw
• Antawn Jamison
• Jason Kidd
• Jason Terry
• Andre Miller
• Randy Foye
• Carlos Delfino
• Ersan Ilyasova
• Chauncey Billups
• Steve Nash
• Marcus Camby
• Raymond Felton
• Tim Duncan
• Leandro Barbosa
• C.J. Miles
• Mehmet Okur
• Chris Kaman
• Chase Budinger
• Sam Young
• Kirk Hinrich

Notable restricted free agents

• D.J. Augustin
• Brandon Rush
• Courtney Lee
• George Hill
• Roy Hibbert
• Eric Gordon
• Ryan Anderson
• Nicolas Batum
• Marreese Speights
• O.J. Mayo
• Darrell Arthur
• Michael Beasley
• Anthony Randolph
• Brook Lopez
• Landry Fields
• J.J. Hickson
• Jason Thompson
• Daniel Green
• Jerryd Bayless
• JaVale McGee
• Rudy Fernandez

Players who can become unrestricted free agents

• Mo Williams
• Derek Fisher
• Jordan Farmar
• Deron Williams
• Brandon Bass
• Dwight Howard
• Jameer Nelson
• Elton Brand
• Gerald Wallace
• Louis Williams

Off the market

• Derrick Rose
• Russell Westbrook
• Kevin Love
• Danilo Gallinari

 

[Mainstreet]

Kris Humphries only signed a one year contract with the Nets for 8M. He would be worth a look.

http://espn.go.com/new-york/nba/story/_/id/7375686/kris-humphries-re-signs-new-jersey-nets

 

[jandaman]

Gallinari accepted the extension, Westbrook did, Love dide and Gordon might be next.. the Pacers will match any offer for Hibbert.

Deron Williams, Dwight Howard, Brook Lopez might be the only noteworthy free agents if they even hit the market. Brook Lopez at PF next to Gortat would make an intriguing 7 footer combo I guess.

Other than that you will be allowed to gamble on Beasley, Mayo or Anthony Randolph.

Time to start scouting the 2013 draft

Shabazz Muhammad 6'6 SG projected #1 pick in 2013

yup

started looking at 2013 already after seeing all the 2012 FAs extending with their current teams..


I would still chase
- Oden
- A.Randolph
- Gordon
- Beasley

atleast 2 of them...

 

[slinslin]

With Gallinari, Love and Westbrook signing extensions, the Suns free agents options have decreased significantly. This was supposed to have been a big free agent summer, but the only max-worthy free agents remaining are probably Dwight Howard and Deron Williams who both are likely to opt out of their current deals and neither likely to want to play in Phoenix. There's also Eric Gordon who will be a restricted free agent, but he missed half the season last year and is injured this year as well. So if the Suns are going to sign anyone, it almost certainly won't be a max-caliber player.

So who is left? In no particular order:

Notable unrestricted free agents

• Ray Allen - will go to contender
• Kevin Garnett - will go to contender
• Boris Diaw
• Antawn Jamison - will go to contender
• Jason Kidd - will go to contender
• Jason Terry - will go to contender
• Andre Miller - will go to contender
• Randy Foye
• Carlos Delfino
• Ersan Ilyasova
• Chauncey Billups - will go to contender
• Steve Nash - will go to contender
• Marcus Camby - will go to contender
• Raymond Felton
• Tim Duncan - will go to contender
• Leandro Barbosa
• C.J. Miles
• Mehmet Okur
• Chris Kaman
• Chase Budinger - for a reasonable deal
• Sam Young
• Kirk Hinrich

Notable restricted free agents

• D.J. Augustin - Charlotte will likely match offers unless you overpay and Augustin is not that good
• Brandon Rush
• Courtney Lee
• George Hill
• Roy Hibbert - Indiana will match any offer
• Eric Gordon - New Orleans is likely to match any offer, if not the Suns don't look like the front runner
• Ryan Anderson - Orlando will match any reasonable offer
• Nicolas Batum - Portland will match any reasonable offer
• Marreese Speights
• O.J. Mayo - could be interesting because he has talent to compensate overpaying a bit
• Darrell Arthur - could be interesting because he has talent to compensate overpaying a bit but serious injury
• Michael Beasley - could be interesting because he has talent to compensate overpaying a bit
• Anthony Randolph- could be interesting because he has talent to compensate overpaying a bit
• Brook Lopez - New Jersey will probably let him go to go for Howard but looking at how things are going with Robin, I doubt he would come to Phoenix and I dont know if he would want to play PF although that could work great for him
• Landry Fields
• J.J. Hickson
• Jason Thompson - could be interesting because he has talent to compensate overpaying a bit
• Daniel Green
• Jerryd Bayless - could be interesting because he has talent to compensate overpaying a bit
• JaVale McGee
• Rudy Fernandez

Players who can become unrestricted free agents

• Mo Williams - unlikely to opt out
• Derek Fisher
• Jordan Farmar
• Deron Williams - likely to go to NJ or DAL
• Brandon Bass
• Dwight Howard - likely to go to NJ or DAL
• Jameer Nelson - unlikely to opt out
• Elton Brand - unlikely to opt out
• Gerald Wallace - unlikely to opt out
• Louis Williams - could be interesting, he is basically as good as Monta Ellis

Off the market

• Derrick Rose
• Russell Westbrook
• Kevin Love
• Danilo Gallinari

There are some players missing on that list like Wilson Chandler (RFA), Greg Oden, Aaron Brooks, Johnny Flynn and Hasheem Thabeet.

RFA - Mayo, Randolph, Beasley, Brook Lopez, Jason Thompson, Jerryd Bayless, Wilson Chandler
UFA - Chase Buddinger, Louis Williams, Greg Oden, Aaron Brooks, Randy Foye, Johnny Flynn, Hasheem Thabeet.

Nobody else is worth giving more than 1 year deal to or simply can't be signed by the Suns to a reasonable deal.

As a rebuilding team I would not mind taking a flyer on some of the young guys by giving out a big 1 year deal to a guy like Flynn, Thabeet, Mayo, Beasley etc and see what they give me.

 

[JCSunsfan]

Will have to see how the draft goes first. I would think you draft the bpa and then sign free agents that fit. Otherwise you end up with a Knicks situation.

I wonder if there any great young players buried at the end of someones bench like JJ was when we got him from Boston.

 

[slinslin]

JJ wasn't really buried and was like 2 months into his rookie season, so the answer is likely no.

Evan Turner, OJ Mayo are maybe in the same type of situation where they could flourish as the go-to guy for a team with a role player at PG that does not dominate the ball.

 

[Covert Rain]

yup

started looking at 2013 already after seeing all the 2012 FAs extending with their current teams..


I would still chase
- Oden
- A.Randolph
- Gordon
- Beasley

atleast 2 of them...

I wouldn't go near Oden unless you can get him for the minimum. Mark my words the guy will NEVER have another healthy season in the NBA IMO. To much risk not enough reward.

Besides, the Suns ownership was not willing to take a risk on Amare and his condition. Oden is 100 times the risk Amare was. There is ZERO chance this ownership team takes a risk like that.

 

[JCSunsfan]

Oden is the last thing we need right now. We need a pg of he future. A big starting 2 with an all around game in the mold of JJ. We need a starting wing . And we might need a starting 4 depending on the development of Morris.

At least one of those pick ups needs to be a star caliber player. We have the draft and free agency to accomplish this. Trades are a remote possibility.

 

[slinslin]

Why do we need a PG of the future, when was the last time a championship team was build around a star PG?

Chauncey Billups and Tony Parker are the best PGs to be on a championship team the last 20 years.

We simply need a franchise player. Anything else is really pointless and the Suns would be stupid to waste their capspace on complimentary players before they have a franchise player in place or else they will end up like the Detroit Pistons with Charlie V and Ben Gordon.

 

[Neo]

Why do we need a PG of the future, when was the last time a championship team was build around a star PG?

Because we are the Suns. In the last quarter century we have had KJ, Kidd, Marbury, and Nash running the point. Excluding 03-04 (which is a year I am denying having ever occured) we have had an all-star caliber point guard for since the A-team went off the air.

Except for the Barkley years, we have pretty much always been built around our point guard. Unfortunately, ownership has not seemed to notice that the one time we had a legit chance of winning it all was when we were built around a post player, not the back court.

 

[slinslin]

I hope we can pick up Myck Kabongo later in the draft. He probably will never be a star PG but he is a true PG and sufficient enough to start and play alongside a star SG.

 

[JCSunsfan]

Why do we need a PG of the future, when was the last time a championship team was build around a star PG?

Chauncey Billups and Tony Parker are the best PGs to be on a championship team the last 20 years.

We simply need a franchise player. Anything else is really pointless and the Suns would be stupid to waste their capspace on complimentary players before they have a franchise player in place or else they will end up like the Detroit Pistons with Charlie V and Ben Gordon.

Um. I guess that depends on what your definition of pg of the future is. Do you not believe we need a future starting pg? I said one of the 4 starters we add needs to be star quality. I did not say it had to be a pg.

It looks to me like we are saying about the same thing sans anything regarding Gortat.

My point was Oden makes no sense.

It is also very unlikely that any franchise player is going to be available through free agency. I suppose we could go for Howard or maybe Deron Williams, but signing them is unlikely. Still I would rather the Suns go for the franchise player than spend big money on mid level players. The draft is where we have to focus.

 

[JCSunsfan]

I hope we can pick up Myck Kabongo later in the draft. He probably will never be a star PG but he is a true PG and sufficient enough to start and play alongside a star SG.

I would be fine with a distributing type pg like Kabongo. He does have to improve his shooting though, just to keep defenses honest. He is one of those players that still has a boy's body. It will be interesting to see how he changes as his body matures.

 

[jlove]

Notable unrestricted free agents

• Ray Allen
• Kevin Garnett
• Boris Diaw
• Antawn Jamison
• Jason Kidd
• Jason Terry
• Andre Miller
• Randy Foye
• Carlos Delfino
• Ersan Ilyasova
• Chauncey Billups
• Steve Nash
• Marcus Camby
• Raymond Felton
• Tim Duncan
• Leandro Barbosa
• C.J. Miles
• Mehmet Okur
• Chris Kaman
• Chase Budinger
• Sam Young
• Kirk Hinrich

Notable restricted free agents

• D.J. Augustin - Unrestricted now, no tender given
• Brandon Rush
• Courtney Lee
• George Hill
• Roy Hibbert
• Eric Gordon - UNRESTRICTED NOW. DID NOT SIGN EXTENSION
• Ryan Anderson - Unrestricted now, no tender given
• Nicolas Batum - Unrestricted now, no tender given
• Marreese Speights
• O.J. Mayo
• Darrell Arthur
• Michael Beasley - Unrestricted now, no tender given
• Anthony Randolph - Unrestricted now, no tender given
• Brook Lopez
• Landry Fields
• J.J. Hickson - Unrestricted now, no tender given
• Jason Thompson - Unrestricted now, no tender given
• Daniel Green - Unrestricted now, no tender given
• Jerryd Bayless - Unrestricted now, no tender given
• JaVale McGee
• Rudy Fernandez

Players who can become unrestricted free agents

• Mo Williams
• Derek Fisher
• Jordan Farmar
• Deron Williams
• Brandon Bass
• Dwight Howard
• Jameer Nelson
• Elton Brand
• Gerald Wallace
• Louis Williams

Off the market

• Derrick Rose
• Russell Westbrook
• Kevin Love
• Danilo Gallinari

Some are now UFA's since their teams didn't tender them the qualifying offer. The bold players would definitely be on my radar for the Suns, especially Dwight, Deron and Gordon. The rest would depend on contract.

 

[slinslin]

Sorry but Eric Gordon is not unrestricted same for the other players. None of them are unrestricted.

They simply did not get a contract extension, they will still be restricted. The only way they become unrestricted is this offseason they take the qualifying offer from their teams and become unrestricted in 2013 which is what is happening to Aaron Brooks right now.

 

[SunsTzu]

Sorry but Eric Gordon is not unrestricted same for the other players. None of them are unrestricted.

They simply did not get a contract extension, they will still be restricted. The only way they become unrestricted is this offseason they take the qualifying offer from their teams and become unrestricted in 2013 which is what is happening to Aaron Brooks right now.

Yeah, only the extension deadline has passed, not the deadline to pick up the QO. Pretty much all the players who were slated to be RFA still will be.

 

[Griffin]

The only way they become unrestricted is this offseason they take the qualifying offer from their teams and become unrestricted in 2013 which is what is happening to Aaron Brooks right now.

Brooks is still an RFA and will be again next summer if he doesn't play in the NBA this season and the Suns keep the qualifying offer on the table. The other way for players to become unrestricted is if teams withdraw or do not make qualifying offers.