The Cardinals' Draft Was Scripted

[Cardiac]

Simple our pass coverage was terrible especially when they had to cover deep threats and the Cards were too small to really be playing a 3-4. Once the field got compressed it became easier for our secondary to cover and the Cards got bigger along the line. Guys like Branch and Williams and Watson came into the game.

Great points. I would add that the Cards spent a ton of practice time on redzone D so that helped them perform better as well.

 

[kerouac9]

DeMarcus Ware and Brian Orakpo come to mind.

But that being said I don't think there were any guys with that kind of talent in this draft.

Brian Orakpo was a 4-3 OLB his first season.

 

[Reddog]

Mitch if you had some prior info on Andre Wadsworth's knee problems would you have taken him at #38? Sure hindsight is 20/20 but having that insight going in on Bowers is the reason he slid. He will most certainly need knee surgery within the next four years according to the experts and will best be used situationally ideally for under 20 plays per game. You need to be stacked and close to a championship to roll the dice on a high draft pick with such limitations. I like the Williams pick and hope we will all celebrate the draft vision for choosing him when we finally have a run game.

 

[Duckjake]

Brian Orakpo was a 4-3 OLB his first season.

Didn't know that. OF course I still hate the Redskins from our NFC East days so pay as little attention to them as possible. If Orakpo weren't from Texas I wouldn't know anything about them.

Are there very many former college DEs that end up playing OLB in a 4-3? Seems like that would be an even harder transition.

 

[kerouac9]

Didn't know that. OF course I still hate the Redskins from our NFC East days so pay as little attention to them as possible. If Orakpo weren't from Texas I wouldn't know anything about them.

Are there very many former college DEs that end up playing OLB in a 4-3? Seems like that would be an even harder transition.

Matthias Kiuwanuka with the Giants is one I know of for sure. These kinds of transition players don't generally develop into top-of-the-roster types.

 

[Mitch]

Mitch if you had some prior info on Andre Wadsworth's knee problems would you have taken him at #38? Sure hindsight is 20/20 but having that insight going in on Bowers is the reason he slid. He will most certainly need knee surgery within the next four years according to the experts and will best be used situationally ideally for under 20 plays per game. You need to be stacked and close to a championship to roll the dice on a high draft pick with such limitations. I like the Williams pick and hope we will all celebrate the draft vision for choosing him when we finally have a run game.

The context I was referring to about Bowers, Reddog, is that with an extra 2nd and 4th from the Lions, you can afford a risk/reward player like Bowers who may well have been the #1 pick in the draft.

To be honest, this is what I would have done---and---you and everyone can make the argument that we were better off doing what we did---but check this out"

#13 (from DET): Ryan Kerrigan, OLB/DE, Purdue. Toughest player I saw on tape of all the top prospects.

#38: Dontay Moch, OLB/SS, Nevada. He's rare in the sense that he's not only super fast he is extremely tough and is one of the best tacklers in the draft.

#44 (from DET): Stephen Paea, DT, Oregon St. I take him over Bowers here because we were already able to draft two pass rushers, and now I want to add strength and superior toughness to the interior of a defensive line that has had significant trouble stopping the run.

#69: Mason Foster, ILB, Washington. He was my favorite ILB propsect all along---he's got very good range and finished his tackles well---plus he can get after the QB (162 tackles, 7 sacks last year).

PAUSE: I see potential starters and major contributors here.

While there's much to like about Ryan Williams' talent (2009---style)---as we've seen from high pick RBs in our history it takes several years for them to become good, reliable NFL RBs---see Thomas Jones and Garrison Hearst---and thus, especially with the awkwarndess of the RB situation with THT and Beanie already in the system, it makes me wonder just how quickly Williams can emerge as the go-to feature RB.

As for Rob Housler---if he was ineffective bocking at the college level, the question is will he ever become a capable blocker in the NFL? If not, he is never going to be a starter...and thus what you are drafting here is a slot WR---yet, don't we already have a player with Houlser's size and speed on the roster? His name is Stephen Williams---he's 6-5 and runs a 4.4...do you think he could be a threat up the seams? Yes, he went from catching everything in sight in pre-season for big gains to getting the dropsies as a rookie in his early action in games---but most rookie WRs go through early bouts of the dropsies---as teammate Andre Roberts did---but Roberts overcame it and developed confidence. Steve Breaston hardly ever saw the field at WR as a rookie---yet he emerged and blossomed in his second year.

This is my sticking point about Housler---it's one thing to draft a TE at #69 who is going to be your starter---but, to draft one who is situational and may always be situational is, in my way of thinking, a poor decision, especially when there's a starting ILB in Mason Foster sitting right there at #69 (as well as other potential starters)...and especially in light of the greater need on defense.

Here's the rest of my draft:

#103: Christian Ballard, 34DE, Iowa. Played very well at the Senior Bowl---and his best football is ahead of him as he is just starting to realize his vast potential. Has talent as a 4 man rush DE.

#107 (from DET): James Brewer, T, Indiana. Amazing value at this spot in th draft. Is huge, can maul and, most importantly, can pass block.

#136: Daniel Kilgore, G, Appalachian St. One of the best kept sectets in this draft. Tough kid who thrived in a passing offense.

#171: Charles Clay, RB/TE/FB/HB, Tulsa. Versatile and a perfect fit for the dink and dunk because he can perform a variety of roles.

#184: Greg McElroy, QB, Alabama. Smart, tough and dependable in the clutch.

#248: DeMarco Sampson, WR, San Diego St. The Cardinals know their WR talent and I completely trust in that.

Recap:

1-Ryan Kerrigan, OLB/DE
2-Dontay Moch, OLB/SS
2-Stephen Paea, NT/DT
3-Mason Foster, SILB
4-Christian Ballard, 34DE
4-James Brewer, T
5-Daniel Kilgore, G
6-Charles Clay, HB/FB/RB
6-Greg McElroy, QB
7-DeMarco Sampson, WR

I guess I stand alone in thinking this is a much better draft---which enabled us to strengthen the defense (at SOLB, WOLB/SS, NT, SILB, 34DE) and the offensive line (which was ignored entirely in the draft). And we get one smart QB and two good skill player fits in the dink and dunk.

 

[Cardiac]

As the NFLN has their on going post draft grades and comments I heard some interesting comments today. The mentioned how the Pats and Jets didn't adress glaring needs at the OLBer position in this draft and the reason why is that there wasn't much talent in this years draft. I think a read (wrote) that somewhere earlier on some thread.

I think that now that the draft is over some media members are getting more inside scoop information. So as Lombardi or Casserly or... contacts teams they have good relationships with they are getting the real thinking that took place in war rooms.

Only Von Miller was considered a top notch LBer in this draft and probably the only one with 1st round value, that does not include potential conversion type 3-4 players.

I feel better and better about the Cards draft every day and now it's wait and see time for me.

 

[Early]

Double post to the one below...Sorry...

 

[Early]

Great thoughts Mitch, amazing. For Housler's blocking , it's not bad - it's terrible. I bet many slot WR's are better than him. Went through some of his tapes these days, and that was obvious.... Both the strength as well as technique lacked, which leads to me to think he will never become a good blocker. If he had one of the two, there would be something to build on.

With Warner under center, he would have been great option. He catches everything in traffic underneath, and he can stretch the field. He can adjust in the air and make the catch in traffic. His speed is not what makes him a good receiver, he is much more than that, and he is extremely fluid in his route running, he has some very flexible hips, and he has some YAC ability. It's not jus the seam. He can be a target all over the place. His lack of blocking wouldn't be a problem, since Leonard Pope was just as bad, and we came away with it.

If we don't get a veteran QB that can make this a great passing offense, Housler pick could be terrible one...I completely agree... Which makes me lose some of the excitement that i had for the pick...

As for Peterson, i'm watching tape on him every day, and the more I watch, the more I think on Jimmy Smith's tapes...He is just a better man to man corner. Peterson is the better athlete, he is a freak of nature. Smith on other hand is not as fast, but he is playing the corner with technique that i have only seen Nnamdi Asomugha play. He does have stiff hips as we saw in combine, but so does Nnmadi somewhat, he is neither that athlete. He never puts himself into position where he needs to redirect 180 degrees. He has complete control of the WR from the first step and only gives him one way to go, the way he controls. Peterson is beat in every game. Jimmy Smith's tapes...You can wait alot of time till you see someone beat him... couple of times...per season... He puts those long hands on you,and he is stuck to you all the way, he commands where you go, not the other way around. With Peterson, it's more the WR that is in command where his route is going to be, but Peterson uses the supreme athleticism to cover so that QB doesn't throw that way. That will be less effective in NFL. But he is good in turning around and finding the football, which is crucial in NFL.

I like Peterson's personality much better, Smith doesn't remind of Asomugha at all in that regard, he is not a very humble person (Jimmy). The comparison fades away at this point...

But we are going to ask them to play cover 3, 5-10 yards off man..So who knows what is going to work...

Who of the veteran QB's do you hope we land?

I did the following breakdown of them, wanted to hear your opinions on them

I would rate them as following:

1. Marc Bulger

Sometimes time off the field is the best that can happen to an experienced QB. So did Warner and it made him a much better QB. Nobody elsewhere, and even few on this message board, believed in him. I think this is another case we are looking at here. Bulger has proven so far he can be one of the best QB's in the game. He definitely has the skills, so it's not about that at all. He has one of the most accurate arms in the game and he can put that ball so that only the WR can get it. Very few QB's can do that over the entire field and on all type of throws; Bulger is one of the few. Backshoulder throws that WR with amazing hands love, Fitz would develop great chemistry with either Bulger or Orton. Orton is the only other on this list that also has that ability.

He is ready to play, he has spend some time of the field, and is hungry like in 2006 where he had 24 TD's and 8 INT's. He is not Kurt Warner. He is just as accurate, but he is not that brilliant, he is not the signal caller that Warner was (basically an offensive coordinator behind the center). Many times, it was the brilliant calls that Warner made that made the offense work. Bulger does not have that skill, but if our coordinator knows how to call plays, he can execute. Also, the reason is that he isn't Warner, is toughness. He is tough, but far from Warner tough.

Bulger i believe is the best option for Cardinals, we want supreme accuracy, we want high percentage throws, we do have the WR's to make it work. He would make the offense explode at times, but not consistently.

2. Matt Hasselbeck

He is a very good west coast QB. He does not have supreme accuracy, or the best signal call ability. But he is extremely good in making decision over the entire game. He would provide a very sure option and although the offense would not be explosive, it would at least be solid and move the chains. Also, it would be amazing to leave the Seahawks with Whitehurst as their QB. It's the most secure option for the offense, but would never make the unit explosive.

3. Kyle Orton

Very accurate QB, that will develop the chemistry with Fitzgerald for sure. What he did with Lloyd, would be even better with Fitz, imagine that. Knows how to put the ball so that only WR can get it. He is extremely accurate, but his decision making is not good at all. A rule of thumb for me is that QB's decision making ability is easiest to observe in the redzone. Here, the field is compressed, and you live and die by your ability to make fast and good decisions. He has been very bad in those situations so far. However, provided good playcalling, he has the supreme accuracy that we look for. He has gained alot of experience in McDaniels system and has the ability to make the offense explosive.

4. Donovan McNab

He has a great deep ball. But he isn't necessary that accurate. Also, much of his success is due to Phily's QB friendly system. Have you ever seen a QB there playing bad for quiet some time? Even AJ Feeley when in, was doing well. Vick. Kolb. McNabb. They all are playing there better than they are/would(IMO) somewhere else. They have great playcalling that takes the pressure of the QB's, good defense. They have the players and playbook to kill you deep and teams need to respect that. Maybe it's not entirely true, but i really do believe it is easier to be a QB there than most other places. McNabb did not play well for the Redskins at all. He is a good QB and would be a huge upgrade over any of our QB's, but i think all of the 3 above, would make a better offense.

5. Carson Palmer

He quit on his team and was playing very bad football last year. I didn't like anything what i saw from him. He probably needs some break from football, to get his inspiration back, he has the skills, but he is down mentally at the moment. I think he is very overrated and he made some of the worst decisions i have ever seen a QB make, last year. One year he has shown he can be very good. He could regain that with some time on the bench to think about things.

6. Kevin Kolb

I want to bring the Phily argument back again. And when put under pressure to make a hard decision, he almost always fails on tape IMO. He has good fundamentals in his throw, mechanics. However, his decision making and reading of defenses need alot of work. I don't like his accuracy as people state is his strength. To me, it's the opposite. I think we need to refine the meaning of this word.

Accuracy to me means ability to make a sick throw, and consistently, into an area where only the WR can get it and not the corner.

However, what Kolb has is some other sort, it's what can be called precision. This is the ability to reproduce your throw. He can reproduce it because he keeps his mechanics very well in all sorts of situations. But it doesn't mean he can place the ball with sick accuracy into a tight area available only for the WR.

Kolb has the precision to not make the inaccurate throws. But he doesn't have elite accuracy to consistently target well covered receivers with good completion percentage.

I hate his decision making under pressure and much of his short success is due to the design of offense. Most of his "good" throws are to wide open receivers. The amazing throws are extremely rare.

All that being said, he is still alot better than any QB we currently have. And i would still like the move, even if it costed us alot, because with current QB's, it would just be a rebuilding year. I would do anything for just one more win.