The Cards' Draft Dilemma

[Duckjake]

The Cards defense was rated higher in the first half of the season because they were playing teams with weak passing games. Once the Cards started playing teams that could pass the d's rating dropped.

 

[40yearfan]

Yeah, I agree. Its why the inactivity in FA on the defensive side is so frustrating. We need at least 5 new players, some starters, some key reserves. Depending on getting that from the draft is ludicrous. Get a DE, OLB, and CB in FA before you close up shop for the year. Smith and Dockett will wear down as the game and season wears on. Our current nickle back is Adams. Berry may be able to provide a little of pass rush but if he is pushed into starting duty he'll be injured quickly. We don't know how well Okeafor will play since he missed the entire year.

There are still a few depth, and possibly starting players left, but as far as I can tell we haven't even talked to them about coming to visit.

We can't sign anybody until the league approves Fitz's contract.

 

[WildBB]

We already have a young right guard in Deuce Lutui. That's the position that McGlynn played. We never talked to Levi Brown at all through the draft process. Maybe we talked extensively with Buster Davis. That didn't work out well.

No, not saying that he's my choice. Just that the Cards are looking into him closely. He played RT at Pitt for 4 yrs. BTW. Only 3 games at G. So they might like his makeup and the fact that they might be able to get this guy later in the draft. I think they like his potential down the road.

Quote:
Well, it must have been because the defense was so good that they allowed 26 points to the Baltimore Ravens (their second-highest scoring total on the season), 25 points to the Carolina Panthers (9 points over their average PPG last year), and 20 points to a San Francisco offense that wouldn't score 20 points again until November--when they scored 37 against--wait for it--the Arizona Cardinals.

I never said that Okeafor was washed up. I said you didn't know what to expect from him this season. You can assert that Berry's not washed up, but there's a reason he reduced his base salary 75% and hasn't completed a 16 game schedule in two years.

The last two seasons, the Cards have been in the Bottom 10 in the NFL in scoring defense. Hoping that the entire defensive unit can stay healthy (and that Antrel Rolle or Aaron Francisco are improvements at FS) is not a plan to improve a defense that--whether you like it or not--hasn't been able to stop opposing teams when they needed to.[/QUOTE]

The SF game was the first game of the year. EVeryone knows, you throw the first game out, anything can happen in that game. The 2nd time they played they were allready decimated and Gore ran roughshod over them.

The Baltimore game they played not so good.

The Caronlina game, I was at, and the D kept us in that game the whole way when Warner went down on like the 2nd series and the O blew chunks the rest of the game. We were up like 9-7 with under 6 min. left, when they let Steve Smith, the only guy that could have beat us get behind Hood w/o any FS help. Go figure. That deflated everyone, and they mailed it in after a stallwart effort all game long.

Finally I'm not saying that's the plan that this team stays healthy. We do need an infusion of talent on the D, there's no doubt about it. Every NFL team today needs that infusion of talent to challenge incumbents or just get plain better. There's no arguing there.

There is no arguing however, that if you can control the ball on the ground on offense and keep the opposing teams offense off the field, that is your best defense on any team.

 

[DaisyCutter]

There is no arguing however, that if you can control the ball on the ground on offense and keep the opposing teams offense off the field, that is your best defense on any team.

Actually, I might argue this a little bit. The Arizona Cardinals in 2007 were 10th in the NFL in offensive time of possession. We had better TOP than the San Diego Chargers. Better than the Vikings and their run game.

Our WRs are good enough that we can use the passing game to control the clock and keep the chains moving. The problem is that our defense can't make the big play (except in bunches, as we learned with Antrel Rolle), and can't get opposing offenses out of the end zone.

Maybe tomorrow, I'll look at the first 9 or 10 games of the season, and examine if we kept any of those teams from scoring less than their average points on the season. I'd be surprised. We've been ranking well in the total defensive categories, but the defense breaks and gives up at the most inopportune times.

I watched a lot of Steelers games in the Cowher era, and a lot of great defensive teams (was a big Bucs fan under Dungy). Sometimes, the defense not only has to keep you in a game, but has to win some for you. The defense has folded too often the past couple years when we needed them most.

 

[Duckjake]

Maybe tomorrow, I'll look at the first 9 or 10 games of the season, and examine if we kept any of those teams from scoring less than their average points on the season. I'd be surprised. We've been ranking well in the total defensive categories, but the defense breaks and gives up at the most inopportune times.

The first half of the season the Cards played non-division games against Pittsburgh, Tampa, Carolina, Baltimore and Washington all teams that usually have run oriented offenses. They ranked 22,16,29,23 and 14th in passing offense.

In the second half the Cards played teams ranked 3,7,9,12 and 18th in passing. New Orleans, Cincy, Detroit,Cleveland and Atlanta.

So I still say that while the injuries to Wilson and Berry did contribute some to the decline in defensive stats it was more a result of playing teams that actually knew how to run a passing offense, an area we almost all felt was a weakness for the Cards going into the season.

But as usual stats never seem to work right for Arizona. In those first 5 games the Cards gave up 103 points and were 1-4. In the second five they gave up 127 points and were 4-1.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

I like Groves but he's just not worth the 16th overall pick. That's why i suggested in another thread that,if Groves is still on the board at 26-31,which is likely, trade next year's #1 for him. That way we can fill all our major holes to make a run this year. Our draft could be:
16-Mendenhall
27-Groves
50-Cason

or
16-DRC/Jenkins
27-Groves
50- a mean sob OL like Rachal or Carl Nicks and then grab Matt Forte in round 3.If not,you could probably get Charles at 50.

Also, if the Cards take Crable in round 2, i will rip my 60" plasma off the wall.

 

[cardsfanmd]

Will we have the money to sign two first rounders?

I still like the idea of trading down from 16 with Atlanta for #33 and #34. Then we could get 3 studs like Cason, Groves and F. Jones.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

Will we have the money to sign two first rounders?

I still like the idea of trading down from 16 with Atlanta for #33 and #34. Then we could get 3 studs like Cason, Groves and F. Jones.

we'd have the money because they would just increase the rookie pool. But we'd have to worry about 2 1st round holdouts instead of the normal 1.

Maybe in that trade we could get make it abigger deal and get Norwood.They could draft McFadden at 3,their QB(Ryan if he slides,Brohm,Henne,Flacco) at 16 and we could et mutliple picks and a speed RB in Norwood.I like it.

Side note: OSU and Syracuse in a NIT rematch,hopefully the Orangemen make it that far .

 

[cardsfanmd]

we'd have the money because they would just increase the rookie pool. But we'd have to worry about 2 1st round holdouts instead of the normal 1.

Maybe in that trade we could get make it abigger deal and get Norwood.They could draft McFadden at 3,their QB(Ryan if he slides,Brohm,Henne,Flacco) at 16 and we could et mutliple picks and a speed RB in Norwood.I like it.

Side note: OSU and Syracuse in a NIT rematch,hopefully the Orangemen make it that far .

With the way the Cuse squeaked out a W last night, I'll be surprised if they make it through another game. One can hope I guess.

 

[WildBB]

Actually, I might argue this a little bit. The Arizona Cardinals in 2007 were 10th in the NFL in offensive time of possession. We had better TOP than the San Diego Chargers. Better than the Vikings and their run game.

Our WRs are good enough that we can use the passing game to control the clock and keep the chains moving.

To keep ball control with the passing game isn't too smart either, even if we do it better than most everybody. This team besides controlling the ball in the air, gave up too many costly turnovers. That put the onus on the D far too often, as we witnessed this year with Warner time and time again.

 

[DaisyCutter]

The Cards defense was rated higher in the first half of the season because they were playing teams with weak passing games. Once the Cards started playing teams that could pass the d's rating dropped.

I thought I'd check. Pendergast's defenses have been okay in yardage over the years, but the Cards have been a terrible scoring defense.

Say the D was only healthy for the first 9 games of the season. This was how well we contained our opponents:

@SF - 20 pts; Season Average: 13.7 pts/gm
SEA - 20 pts; Season Average: 24.6 pts/gm
@BAL - 26 pts; Season Average: 17.2 pts/gm
PIT - 14 pts; Season Average: 24.6 pts/gm
@STL - 31 pts; Season Average: 16.4 pts/gm
CAR - 25 pts; Season Average: 16.7 pts/gm
@WAS - 21 pts; Season Average: 20.9 pts/gm
@TB - 17 pts; Season Average: 20.9 pts/gm
DET - 21 pts; Season Average: 21.6 pts/gm

So when we were healthy last season, we only kept 4 of our 9 opponent from under their season average point totals. And it got worse as the season wore on. Many will blame this on injuries, but I also think it's partially because Pendergast's defense started to get film circulated on it and he ran out of surprises.

This team has to stop playing to the level of their opponents. If the team gets beaten by squads like the Jets and the Panthers again next season, it's going to be a long year.

 

[JeffGollin]

I don't think there are any can't miss LB's in the draft (like an AJ Hawk a couple of years ago or a Fredrick Willis last year). At the same time, I think really dominant CB's are much harder to come by and that there's a significant drop off in talent after the top 3.

For this reason, I hope we'd pick Rogers-Cromartie, Jenkins or McKelvin in round one and take a chance on a LB like Avril in round 2 or even round 3.

(Note - I sincerely hope that the front office has reviewed the decision-making process that allowed us to screw up badly on Buster Davis'...and that steps have been made to prevent this type of mistake in the future).

 

[Treesquid PhD]

I don't think there are any can't miss LB's in the draft (like an AJ Hawk a couple of years ago or a Fredrick Willis last year). At the same time, I think really dominant CB's are much harder to come by and that there's a significant drop off in talent after the top 3.

For this reason, I hope we'd pick Rogers-Cromartie, Jenkins or McKelvin in round one and take a chance on a LB like Avril in round 2 or even round 3.

(Note - I sincerely hope that the front office has reviewed the decision-making process that allowed us to screw up badly on Buster Davis'...and that steps have been made to prevent this type of mistake in the future).

Even the #3 CB scares me a tad, the cardinals always seem to get the #3 or 4 CBs and they end up being safeties or busts.

 

[lobo]

I don't think there are any can't miss LB's in the draft (like an AJ Hawk a couple of years ago or a Fredrick Willis last year). At the same time, I think really dominant CB's are much harder to come by and that there's a significant drop off in talent after the top 3.

For this reason, I hope we'd pick Rogers-Cromartie, Jenkins or McKelvin in round one and take a chance on a LB like Avril in round 2 or even round 3.

(Note - I sincerely hope that the front office has reviewed the decision-making process that allowed us to screw up badly on Buster Davis'...and that steps have been made to prevent this type of mistake in the future).

e

Why do I think the selection of Davis was not done based on any intel the team had?? I just have a feeling someone "someone" trusted told someone that Davis was the real deal. I have my suspicions who one of the someones was but it is pure conjecture and I might be hallucinating so I will keep it to myself. Would someone like to guess who the somone might be???

 

[Doc Cardinal]

Niether. RB 1st then CB 2nd. Or vice versa.

OLB/DE is far from a glaring need with 4 guys ready for 2 positions.

What he said.....love your sig man.