The-Edge-Scheme

[MadCardDisease]

I've got a forty-foot trailer and I'll be there for the entire month of August. It doesn't get any better...

You need to get WiFi internet access in that thing so you can keep us up to date on what's happening up in Flag.

I'm expecting daily reports from you now!

 

[DakotaCardsFan]

Thanks H.B.

I enjoyed reading your posts. I hope you'll be kind enough to give us some reports from camp this August.

 

[JeffGollin]

I had no idea he was a Cardinal at one time. That's awesome!

They did a special on Hardy that aired on NFL Network a few days ago. They probably repeat it fairly often. It was pretty inspirational - I wanted to lower a shoulder and cold **** our upright freezer.

 

[Hardy Brown]

I enjoyed reading your posts. I hope you'll be kind enough to give us some reports from camp this August.

My pleasure. I can't wait for the grind...

 

[Hardy Brown]

Good stuff Hardy. Could you clarify the biggest scam part bolded above? How so?

I sincerely apologize for bringing this old thread back, but this question has plagued my sleep for weeks - the veritable scratch you cannot itch!

The Denver Broncos and Atlanta Falcons (Alex Gibbs) have a philosophy as to HOW they're going to run the football. That philosophy is a zone-scheme, a tackle (or 6 & 7-hole) zone-scheme.

Because they have such a clear-cut vision of what they want to do in terms of running the football, they draft offensive-lineman that FIT their scheme, perfectly: smart, tough, quick and have a "motor." They're not looking for "road-graders," they're looking for football players and they do not care what their "measurables" are (height, weight etc.).

With one notable exception (George Foster), take a look at Denver's starting offensive-line and ask yourself, "Why are these guys so good at rushing the football?"

78 Matt Lepsis, Tackle

Height: 6' 4"
Weight: 290 lbs.
College: Colorado
Born: in Conroe, Texas
Acquired: Rookie Free Agent, 1997
Pro Year: 9th
Year with Broncos: 9th

50 Ben Hamilton, Guard/Center

Height: 6' 4"
Weight: 283 lbs.
College: Minnesota
Born: in Minneapolis, Minn.
Acquired: Draft #4a (113th overall), 2001
Pro Year: 5th
Year with Broncos: 5th

66 Tom Nalen, Center

Height: 6' 3"
Weight: 286 lbs.
College: Boston College
Born: in Foxboro, Mass.
Acquired: Draft #7C (218th overall), 1994
Pro Year: 12th
Year with Broncos: 12th

65 Cooper Carlisle, Guard/Tackle

Height: 6' 5"
Weight: 295 lbs.
College: Florida
Born: in Greenville, Miss.
Acquired: Draft #4b (113th overall), 2000
Pro Year: 6th
Year with Broncos: 6th

72 George Foster, Tackle

Height: 6' 5"
Weight: 338 lbs.
College: Georgia
Born: in Macon, Ga.
Acquired: Draft #1 (20th overall), 2003 (The ONLY high pick that starts)
Pro Year: 3rd
Year with Broncos: 3rd


Look at WHERE they drafted offensive-lineman this year:


RdSel#PlayerPos.School5161Chris KuperGNorth DakotaGil Brandt's AnalysisHe played high school football in Alaska, and probably will be a guard or center. He looked very good at the Combine with his athleticism and speed.

RdSel#PlayerPos.School6198Greg EslingerCMinnesotaGil Brandt's AnalysisA young man from Bismarck, N.D. He started 50 consecutive games. He is an exact copy of Tom Nahlen at Denver, under whom he will learn.

When you run the ball as well as Denver does one would think they're loaded with talent on the offensive-line, right? Wrong, they don't have to pick lineman with great measureables they only need to pick football players that fit into their scheme.

THIS IS WHY I SAY THE BRONCOS AND THE FALCONS HAVE A SCAM GOING IN THE NFL! They let other teams "waste" picks on offensive-lineman and use their high-picks (usually) on skill-players, knowing they'll have the pick-of-the-litter when it comes to undersized, underrated, overlooked football players!

Are you starting to see this?

Pure genius, Alex Gibbs...genius.

P.S. Take a look at Atlanta's starting five offensive-lineman. Tell me what you think!

LT: 72 Wayne Gandy

http://www.atlantafalcons.com/team/playerBio.jsp?id=5569http://www.atlantafalcons.com/team/playerBio.jsp?id=10725 http://www.atlantafalcons.com/team/playerBio.jsp?id=-100 LG: 61 Matt Lehr

http://www.atlantafalcons.com/team/playerBio.jsp?id=-100 http://www.atlantafalcons.com/team/playerBio.jsp?id=-100 C: 62 Todd McClure

http://www.atlantafalcons.com/team/playerBio.jsp?id=1633http://www.atlantafalcons.com/team/playerBio.jsp?id=10706http://www.atlantafalcons.com/team/playerBio.jsp?id=11946 RG: 65 Kynan Forney

http://www.atlantafalcons.com/team/playerBio.jsp?id=-100 http://www.atlantafalcons.com/team/playerBio.jsp?id=-100 RT: 74 Todd Weiner

 

[jf-08]

Wow, great breakdown.

Thanks for the info.

 

[blindseyed]

I'm not sure if 'scam' is the right word, that sort of implies they're doing somethng wrong. I would say it's more patience and knowing what ya want and that makes them very smart. But I do get what you're saying.
If you notice also, all the lineman on the Broncos were drafted by the Broncos and have only played for the Broncos which gives them continuity. That's one thing our line doesn't have, they need to gel. Hopefully this happens soon

 

[JeffGollin]

I'm not sure if 'scam' is the right word, that sort of implies they're doing somethng wrong. I would say it's more patience and knowing what ya want and that makes them very smart.

The NFL is famous for its herd mentality when it comes to trends, schemes and personnel.

What's interesting, though, is that some of the consistently successful teams break out of the mold and blaze new trails. Specifically:

- Denver (and now Atlanta) with the way they run the ball.

- New England with its tweener role players.

- The Steelers' use of "slash" skilled players

- Atlanta's employment of the running QB (soon to be followed by Tennessee).

We forget that, before everyone picked up on the West Coast offense, there was a Bill Walsh who is credited with "doing it first."

Moral - Sometimes (but obviously not always) it pays to ask not "What other teams are doing that we need to emulate" but, instead, figure out what we need to do to win and then single-mindedly go out and do it (regardless of what's fashionable right now in the NFL).

Bring back the Single Wing!

 

[devilalum]

Bring back the Single Wing!

Do you really think we have the personnel to run the single wing?!?!

 

[blindseyed]

Do you really think we have the personnel to run the single wing?!?!

No but if it was the Chicken Wing, I bet DG would be running...to the buffet...

 

[JeffGollin]

Do you really think we have the personnel to run the single wing?!?!

Dennis installed a single wing package at Minnesota (with slash guy, David Palmer playing the role triple-threat tailback) and successfully ran it for a series or two against the Cardinals in the playoffs.

Cards could make Q (a former QB) the tailback.

And among our UDFA pickups are 2 or 3 former QB's (i.e. Bilbo, Spurlock and possibly one or two more). So you never know.

 

[BACH]

Dennis installed a single wing package at Minnesota (with slash guy, David Palmer playing the role triple-threat tailback) and successfully ran it for a series or two against the Cardinals in the playoffs.

Cards could make Q (a former QB) the tailback.

And among our UDFA pickups are 2 or 3 former QB's (i.e. Bilbo, Spurlock and possibly one or two more). So you never know.

Was Palmer a QB? I thought Palmer was there because of his speed and receiving ability.

Based on pure speed Robinson could fill that role as well IMO.

 

[JeffGollin]

Was Palmer a QB? I thought Palmer was there because of his speed and receiving ability.

It's irrelevent as to what position Palmer played prior to being used as a single wing tailback in those few series (He could have been a punter for all I care).

The important thing is that he could run, pass the ball (and, although, I kind of doubt it; maybe he could punt too).

Remember that Q came to us as a wideout and for obvious reasons, remained a wideout. But remember too that he played QB in high school and possibly very early in his college career. Here too, the important thing is that he can run with the ball and throw the ball. (Rumor has it that he can also catch pretty good too).

It just seemed to me that DG started to add a cluster of UDFA's with passing skills as part of their resumes - and that possibly he was thinking of adding a slash element (possibly including very limited use of the single wing) to the offense.

 

[BigRedArk]

I sincerely apologize for bringing this old thread back, but this question has plagued my sleep for weeks - the veritable scratch you cannot itch!

The Denver Broncos and Atlanta Falcons (Alex Gibbs) have a philosophy as to HOW they're going to run the football. That philosophy is a zone-scheme, a tackle (or 6 & 7-hole) zone-scheme.

Because they have such a clear-cut vision of what they want to do in terms of running the football, they draft offensive-lineman that FIT their scheme, perfectly: smart, tough, quick and have a "motor." They're not looking for "road-graders," they're looking for football players and they do not care what their "measurables" are (height, weight etc.).

With one notable exception (George Foster), take a look at Denver's starting offensive-line and ask yourself, "Why are these guys so good at rushing the football?"

78 Matt Lepsis, Tackle

Height: 6' 4"
Weight: 290 lbs.
College: Colorado
Born: in Conroe, Texas
Acquired: Rookie Free Agent, 1997
Pro Year: 9th
Year with Broncos: 9th

50 Ben Hamilton, Guard/Center

Height: 6' 4"
Weight: 283 lbs.
College: Minnesota
Born: in Minneapolis, Minn.
Acquired: Draft #4a (113th overall), 2001
Pro Year: 5th
Year with Broncos: 5th

66 Tom Nalen, Center

Height: 6' 3"
Weight: 286 lbs.
College: Boston College
Born: in Foxboro, Mass.
Acquired: Draft #7C (218th overall), 1994
Pro Year: 12th
Year with Broncos: 12th

65 Cooper Carlisle, Guard/Tackle

Height: 6' 5"
Weight: 295 lbs.
College: Florida
Born: in Greenville, Miss.
Acquired: Draft #4b (113th overall), 2000
Pro Year: 6th
Year with Broncos: 6th

72 George Foster, Tackle

Height: 6' 5"
Weight: 338 lbs.
College: Georgia
Born: in Macon, Ga.
Acquired: Draft #1 (20th overall), 2003 (The ONLY high pick that starts)
Pro Year: 3rd
Year with Broncos: 3rd


Look at WHERE they drafted offensive-lineman this year:


RdSel#PlayerPos.School5161Chris KuperGNorth DakotaGil Brandt's AnalysisHe played high school football in Alaska, and probably will be a guard or center. He looked very good at the Combine with his athleticism and speed.

RdSel#PlayerPos.School6198Greg EslingerCMinnesotaGil Brandt's AnalysisA young man from Bismarck, N.D. He started 50 consecutive games. He is an exact copy of Tom Nahlen at Denver, under whom he will learn.

When you run the ball as well as Denver does one would think they're loaded with talent on the offensive-line, right? Wrong, they don't have to pick lineman with great measureables they only need to pick football players that fit into their scheme.

THIS IS WHY I SAY THE BRONCOS AND THE FALCONS HAVE A SCAM GOING IN THE NFL! They let other teams "waste" picks on offensive-lineman and use their high-picks (usually) on skill-players, knowing they'll have the pick-of-the-litter when it comes to undersized, underrated, overlooked football players!

Are you starting to see this?

Pure genius, Alex Gibbs...genius.

P.S. Take a look at Atlanta's starting five offensive-lineman. Tell me what you think!

LT: 72 Wayne Gandy

http://www.atlantafalcons.com/team/playerBio.jsp?id=5569http://www.atlantafalcons.com/team/playerBio.jsp?id=10725 http://www.atlantafalcons.com/team/playerBio.jsp?id=-100 LG: 61 Matt Lehr

http://www.atlantafalcons.com/team/playerBio.jsp?id=-100 http://www.atlantafalcons.com/team/playerBio.jsp?id=-100 C: 62 Todd McClure

http://www.atlantafalcons.com/team/playerBio.jsp?id=1633http://www.atlantafalcons.com/team/playerBio.jsp?id=10706http://www.atlantafalcons.com/team/playerBio.jsp?id=11946 RG: 65 Kynan Forney

http://www.atlantafalcons.com/team/playerBio.jsp?id=-100 http://www.atlantafalcons.com/team/playerBio.jsp?id=-100 RT: 74 Todd Weiner

Thanks for clarifying this Hardy. Man I wish the Cards had this kind of continuity on their OL and the majority of them being day 2 draft picks. I admire what Denver has done with their OL and i'm envious of 'em at the same time.