The Next Step For Murray

[ASUCHRIS]

The media loves the spectacular.

See Coach Prime!

 

[cardncubfan]

I am sure about Maye. He will be good.

I am sure about Caleb. He is going to struggle.

I am not sure about Kyler but he has several games left to convince me.

Weren't you sure about Sam Darnold as well?

 

[oaken1]

Weren't you sure about Sam Darnold as well?

I think that was me. I was so bummed when the kid got drafted by the QB killers.

 

[Chopper0080]

Weren't you sure about Sam Darnold as well?

I did think he was going to be the best QB out of that class. I didn't expect Josh Allen or Lamar Jackson to become more accurate passers at the NFL level. I feel like I learned two things from that draft. One was that I began downgrading QBs from elite programs more than I was at the time. That being good at Wyoming can project better to the NFL than being really good at USC. Two, starting experience in college matters more than I thought. I feel like I have learned over the past 5 years.

I was more critical on Kyler due to both of these things. Same with Bryce Young and some other QBs.

 

[juza76]

Dobbs Passing yards for game was slightly over 150 yards with the cardinals
With the Vikings Is well above the 220 yards
Murray After two games is around 250
The cardinals are a very bad offense overall
And Murray cant make them look great at now, he never played with a so mediocre cast around before

 

[nashman]

Great rant. Maybe you totally missed or you my last BLATANT OBVIOUS comment where I clearly said “Willing to wait and see what he does the rest of the season before making up my mind.”

Such a snarky cheese you are…

 

[Cheesebeef]

Such a snarky cheese you are…

its okay to just say: yeah… I guess you did say he should be evaluated the rest of the season before a final decision is made.

I swear you won’t explode on site for simply admitting you’re wrong.

 

[Lomax to Green 84]

Is there a situation where the Cards draft Maye or Williams and just keep Kyler for 2024 and then dump him to help with the cap savings?

 

[Stout]

Weren't you sure about Sam Darnold as well?

Oof, I thought for sure he was going to be good after that Penn State-USC rose bowl

 

[Totally_Red]

Is there a situation where the Cards draft Maye or Williams and just keep Kyler for 2024 and then dump him to help with the cap savings?

Yes. If he sustains a serious injury this season. No one wants that to happen.

 

[daves]

Dobbs Passing yards for game was slightly over 150 196 yards with the cardinals
With the Vikings Is well above the 220 216 yards
Murray After two games is around 250 231.5

FTFY. Not quite as supportive of your point as you thought, I'm afraid.

 

[daves]

At worst - he is playing well enough to get at least a #1 pick in trade

Why would someone trade for Kyler? Think about teams that just need a QB to be playoff contenders.
Teams will overpay for that.

So the Cardinals, who know him better than anyone, will be smart enough to recognize that he's not a franchise QB and not worth his remaining contract... but some other team will be dumb enough to give up a #1 pick and pick up the contract?

But the team acquiring him takes on a $37 million guaranteed salary in 2024 and an additional $30 million in guaranteed 2025 salary and roster bonus.

AND $850,000 per game roster bonus through the end of the current contract! Edit: That's another $14.45 million per year, every year. Oof.

I fear that the only way the Cardinals could be rid of him would be via an Osweiler-style trade where the Cardinals give up draft capital to the acquiring team.

 

[kerouac9]

AND $850,000 per game roster bonus through the end of the current contract! That's another $14.45 million per year, every year. Oof

I think that’s the total annual bonus paid over 17 games.

 

[juza76]

FTFY. Not quite as supportive of your point as you thought, I'm afraid.

Thank u, i need the glasses next time
However dobbs missed a quarter in his first game with the Vikings, so he would have been around 230 yards for game
Averaging 35 yards more then with the cardinals (even without Jefferson)
Murray Is averaging 35 yards more then Dobbs
My point was about how mediocre Is the receiving group and the pass blocking offensive line

 

[daves]

I think that’s the total annual bonus paid over 17 games.

Ah, so "only" $50K per game... makes sense!

 

[Harry]

This offense has changed with Murray’s return.
Is it designed to play to his strengths or it designed to limit his deficiencies?

The comment Murray made last week, “ultimately I’m going to do what I do” made me pause.

Look I’ve never been a coach. My “knowledge “ is limited to what I see and what I’ve seen.

Please feel free to correct me and enlighten me. This is what I see.
1. Kyler seems jittery. Too many times his feet are pitty patting and not set to throw on time.
2. Kyler seems to wait for a receiver to come open rather than throwing them open which leads to contested catches.
3. It’s appears obvious Kyler does not like being under center and it appears this staff is going to accommodate.
4. Too often it appears to me he is throwing to the wrong receiver.
5. Kyler is an exceptional athlete. His mobility and athleticism often overrides and makes up for his shortcomings.
6. If my observations are more right than wrong, well it’s hard to win going 3 steps forward and two steps back.
7. (Edit) It appears he is throwing off his back foot way too often.

I know some of you are going to blast me, but quite honestly after 60 years or so of watching this game I’m sincerely looking to learn about the nuances of this stupid game.

1 agree
2 never has, but this can be improved
3 don’t see that, more like it takes time to fully adjust. Better offensive options
4 lousy line even though they played a little better
5 absolutely
6 still transitioning. It takes time
7 see what I just put up and watch tape. He did a couple of time but his motion is odd

 

[Morty]

People really need to calm down and wait and give him time in a real system. 2 games and the stupid Kyler bashing starts lol. Yes he should be perfect already after 2 games… The first TD bomb today was ridiculous when he had a second in the pocket to set his feet. Then when things don’t go perfect people just waiting to jump on him it’s crazy imo. Blah blah your just a Kyler defender they say… Kid deserves some freaking time under a real coaching staff, worked hard to come back to a losing ass team. If he was a quitter could have dogged it and said no reason to push to come back and collect his checks! Instead he busts his ass and rehabs and is out there putting on the line for a 2-9 team, isn’t that what a leader does? Probably should wait until the end of the season to see how this progresses before even considering a QB change. Again to me he is way way down in the list of the problems on this team!

How much time would you give him?

 

[nashman]

How much time would you give him?

Minimum this season, imo. Whole new team and system, and a talent depleted team at that…

 

[Stout]

Minimum this season, imo. Whole new team and system, and a talent depleted team at that…

Agreed. No one can make a final decision on him, IMO, until the end of the season.

 

[Brian in Mesa]

FTFY. Not quite as supportive of your point as you thought, I'm afraid.

Dobbs also had much longer runs, IIRC. He ran with authority and even bowled over a defender for a TD in one game. Murray got clobbered at the goal line trying to score a two-point conversion. Not enough body mass to go through anyone.

 

[slanidrac16]

Agreed. No one can make a final decision on him, IMO, until the end of the season.

Also agree. I don’t think anybody here is writing off Murray at this point. But I don’t think we need to hide our head in the sand and not discuss the shortcomings thus far.

 

[imaCafan]

Give him this year to evaluate him, then put some pieces around him next year, but then you’re still evaluating him with a better supporting cast. So seems he will be with the Cards until the 2025 season.

 

[kerouac9]

Give him this year to evaluate him, then put some pieces around him next year, but then you’re still evaluating him with a better supporting cast. So seems he will be with the Cards until the 2025 season.

Everyone's always being evaluated in the NFL, but Monti built the cap to be able to unload Kyler in 2024. It'll be hard to add pieces around him in 2024 if you also have to plan to clear somewhere in the ballpark of $33 million in dead money for 2025.

Also, we have perhaps the worst defense in the NFL. We're 31st in DVOA, with only Denver below us (but they're improving). At some point you have to add to that side of the ball also.

 

[daves]

Dobbs also had much longer runs, IIRC. He ran with authority and even bowled over a defender for a TD in one game. Murray got clobbered at the goal line trying to score a two-point conversion. Not enough body mass to go through anyone.

Agree that Dobbs is a more physical runner than Murray... but I'm not sure body mass has that much to do with it. Dobbs (220 lbs.) has 6% more body mass than Murray (207 lbs.).

 

[Morty]

Minimum this season, imo. Whole new team and system, and a talent depleted team at that…

It is really tough to assess. I could see keeping him all of next season and draft positions to help him succeed. At least you are still building the offense and if Murray does not work out or is hurt the next quarterback will be easier to assess and have a better chance of winning.