The real price for failure:

Duckjake

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Leinart had to go when he got beat out. You think having him in the locker room every week would have HELPED this team at that point?

Another irrelevant statement. The issue is that the Cards drafted a QB with the tenth pick in the first round in 2006 and he washed out. It doesn't matter who or why just that it happened. The Cards paid the price for that last season and could be paying for it for years to come. At a minimum, in addition to one horrendous 5-11 last place season, it will most likely cost them future draft picks and more 5-11 seasons.
 

CardsFan88

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Irrelevant. The real point is that the Cards used the #10 pick in the draft on a QB and it didn't work out. That is a team killer.

Now we have nothing other than a very raw kid at QB instead of a first round 6 year veteran and the possibility of no OTAs or any other contact with the coaches for that raw kid, or any QB we draft, to improve. Not a good scenario.

As for the nonsense about the other teams in our division, I heard the same stuff last year and what happened? We finished dead azz last. We've lost 4 straight to the 49ers and they outscored us last year 65-13. Because we have no QB. No matter how you look at it we're in a world of hurt if the NFL doesn't get their labor problems fixed.

duck...it's semantics.
The Qb that left...did indeed leave us....with our next guy....
What we were left with, was a bust QB. who was the next guy.
If he hadn't left, the dropoff wasn't there. Therefore we were really thinking the same way, just depends of how you break it down.

Plus given another year, we probably COULD have replaced ML....since every year you are given an opportunity to fill needs. If KW stayed, ML still gets cut. That's what I'm saying. KW left us holding the bag, and didn't give us another year or two to find a backup to replace OUR AGREED UPON HORRIBLE PICK in ML.

Of course it's not a good scenario to have a raw QB and no one else. But as I said, EVERY team is confronting 'bad scenarios'. That said, a plus is that none of our core is getting ancient besides AW. Hell have a lockout for 3 years, and all our core guys would still be in their prime.

When you look at all the marquee qb's are bascially 30+, with many pushing 35, alot of teams WITH Qb's, could be REALLY screwed, if there is a lockout. They might go into 2012 with a 37 year old qb making 17 mill a year who is over the hill and not know it until game 1, 2012. That's WORSE than having Skelton with some game experience, playing catch with LF for 20 months.

So yes, the cardinals, in that way...which is significant...are sitting pretty.

I never said we were a great team, but there would be so much turnover that it would be VERY possible, that the last place team in every division in 2010, could be the 2012 division winner with 10+ wins. Missing a year, if it happens, would be huge to variability and far exceed in variability anything we've seen from one season to the next. No one knows what will happen.

Nonsense? I was looking at it objectively. I never said it would unfold like that. It could though. Mat H might be over the hill. Niners are rebuilding. Steven Jackson isn't getting any younger.

Just because what happened last year, doesn't mean squat for next year or 2012. Don't always believe one's own sophistry. Lots of teams are in a world of hurt. The cardinals are one of 32 teams in a world of hurt. I'm sure even Packers fans could find something to be glum about regarding 2012 if they thought about it.

We are sitting pretty in many ways. Not perfect, because of OL, and QB experience. But again, there are going to be a TON of no experience players playing if there is a year long lockout. Skelton would have more experience than probably 1/4-1/3 of the players in the league in 2012, if there is no 2011 season. So again, take that in consideration. Not all teams at the QB spot, which is more precious even though it's one man, but every team will have significant holes at multiple OTHER spots. Each coaching staff will have less of a peg on where they are. Each one will make MORE incorrect assumptions, and the ones that assume more than the others in the first place, will be screwed by such idiocy even bigger than normal.

Knowing this, and not having gone out and broke the bank, give our smaller pocket team a better chance to come back strong. When FA starts in 2012, if that is the case, us keeping our powder dry would allow us to be more aggressive (I know...yeah right...graves?).

Peyton may be fine, but he might be missing (or old and crappy) say Jeff Saturday, Joseph Addai (not age, I think contract..could be wrong), Ryan Diem, Dwight Freeney, Reggie Wayne, Ken Hamlin.

Again, Arizona just has AW, besides contracts which we obviously haven't been spending on...so no excuse to re-up or spend on like talent.

I don't need to go around the league to figure it out, and perhaps if there is a lockout, for next year we'll all be bored to do just that...but for now...just looking at the Colts, a reasonable person would say the Colts have more to lose than us by the lockout. Some I'm sure even more than that, others, less.

We won't know how much of a world of hurt for any of the teams, and by it's nature, someone has to win or lose less. Thus we could see all 32 teams playing on the level of the cardinals in 2010 or less, and someone still has to win the dang thing.

Dead last was still good enough to be in the hunt to win the division until the last ~3 weeks. It's not like we have the 1990 Niners, 1999 Rams, and 2005 Seahawks in our division. Again, don't put all your eggs in the sophistry basket.

I personally think the variation will be wide. The year after a lockout would be the best year for someone to break/tie the Dolphins undefeated season..because just about every team is going to be down. So if a couple of these well run teams can hold serve, we just might see it. But like I said, after a lockout, there would be so much variation, we really can't say for certain what decisions now will make/break the 2012 season. Every team having ~14 draft picks and two years worth of fa defections/additions compressed alongside two years of aging, and perhaps lack of physical fitness *fatties* could completely change the course of the league.

I just can't say we are hurting so bad, and think much of it, when EVERYONE is hurting so bad....or worse, and 14 draft picks to go.

Of course this whole post is made given the assumption that we don't have a 2011 season.
 
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DoTheDew

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Another irrelevant statement. The issue is that the Cards drafted a QB with the tenth pick in the first round in 2006 and he washed out. It doesn't matter who or why just that it happened. The Cards paid the price for that last season and could be paying for it for years to come. At a minimum, in addition to one horrendous 5-11 last place season, it will most likely cost them future draft picks and more 5-11 seasons.

Sure it's relevant to the OP saying that Whiz cutting Leinart was the biggest coaching blunder ever. Not disagreeing with you, but it's totally relevant to the OPs comments.
 

Duckjake

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Sure it's relevant to the OP saying that Whiz cutting Leinart was the biggest coaching blunder ever. Not disagreeing with you, but it's totally relevant to the OPs comments.

I am just trying to point out that saying Leinart would have been worse or whatever doesn't matter anymore. What matters is we have just come off a terrible failure of a season, have nothing but raw kids at QB, and the possibility that we won't be able to get a QB in free agency and if we get one in the draft he will be well behind in the usual development for rookies because their will be no OTAs etc. All because our top 10 pick didn't work out.
 

Crazy Canuck

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This lockout hurts the Cardinals in so many ways. I was listening to Horton on Sirius NFL on the way home and he was saying as much. He plans on installing all new terminology. Very hard to do without mini camps and training camp. [/QUOTE said:
Actually, he's planning on marrying his plays to the existing terminology wherever possible, and has been working to create that playbook and get it into player's hands before March 3. See video interview on main site.
 

john h

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This is not the most devastating move in the history of the NFL. This is an over exaggeration if I've ever heard one. The Ditka move you referenced involved mortgaging the future of the Saints to get Ricky Williams. How about the Vikings trading for Hershel Walker while giving the Cowboys several draft picks, which turned into Emmit Smith and other impact players?

As a matter of fact, I would say drafting Matt Leinart in the 1st round of the 2006 draft was a more devastating move. In the 5 years he was here, he didnt prove much except that he could hold a beer bong and act like a fool when things didnt go his way. This is a sign of a mentally weak athlete. I was a big proponent of Leinart until he decided to whine about his QB situation during the preseason to the media and not address his coach first. It seemed as if he entitled to the position based on simply taking a back seat to Kurt for 3 years. Separate the choice of Leinart v. DA and simply focus on Matt himself. Is that the type of player you want leading the offense for years to come? Take into consideration that no one in the organization seemed to stand up for him, including Fitz, Whiz and even Kurt. He lost the locker room. In the grand scheme of things, it may have been the right move based on his attitude and his bonus he would have had in 2011. Is it possible that Leinart would have earned us one or two extra victories last season? Perhaps. But you are making it sound as if we cut Drew Brees in favor of DA

When we drafted Leinart I thought we had made the draft of the century. Was I ever wrong and were the 12 teams that passed on him right. He seemed to have some sort of thought that he was entitled. Coming from a program that was the best in the nation and being a Hollywood hero did not help him what so ever. I still question his toughness. He certainly was no leader and could not convince his teammates or his coach he was a leader. He is water over the dam now and we made a mistake. I must say I think it was an honest mistake because most of the guys like Kiper and other experts in these maters had him rated very high and thought we were very lucky to get him.

These things happen. Waiting to sign a QB after Kurt left is another matter. Whiz had to know that Leinart was not going to make it long before we failed to sign him so should have been on the lookout for a QB. I think we handled that in a stupid manner. We waited to long & I think ownership got involved in that we thought we could get a decent QB on the cheap aka Anderson and failed to sign one early on. Let us not repeat that same mistake this year. Know who you want and go after him with all guns blazing early and often.
 

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