The Suns are at a crossroad of a culture change

[BC867]

Right now, the Suns suck, plain and simple. The good news is there is nowhere to go but up.

The bad news is that, throughout most of our four-and-a-half-decade long history, "up" has meant an entertaining offense and never building a legitimate Championship contender.

I like what Bob Young reported in his AzCentral/AzRepublic article today about the Suns being ready for a "change-up in their culture". That's pretty heavy stuff!

By turning the team over to a new Head Coach (apparently Lindsey Hunter is a lock to change his title from Interim to Permanent next season), the Front Office -- as flaky as they have been in the past -- is committed to rebuilding the team based on what it takes to be legitimately strong (as the fans call out) De/FENCE'.

Not building the team around a scatterbrained scorer who thinks he's a LeBron/Coby (controlling the ball on offense) but with no clue on defense -- I don't expect Michael Beasley to be back next season.

But stressing unrelenting defense at every position with solid team scoring.

I like it! And I congratulate the Front Office for having the gones to make this decision to, once and for all, change the Suns culture.

It won't be easy. But no matter which way they go, it won't be easy.

Here are the details.

http://www.azcentral.com/sports/hea...r-hopeful-change-up-phoenix-suns-culture.html

 

[devilalum]

If this is their is their vision why did they sign Beasley to a multi year deal?

 

[SirStefan32]

If this is their is their vision why did they sign Beasley to a multi year deal?

Exactly what I was thinking. If your vision is to be a defensive team, you don't sign players with no defense. Not only Beasley, but also Scola, and to a lesser degree Marshall and Morris. I think we will see how serious they are about this in the draft. If they draft Bazz, we'll know they are not serious. If they go with Porter/Oladipo, I'll believe it.

Same applies to free agency. If they try to sign Ellis/Evenas/Smith, we'll know they are full of crap.

Don't get me wrong, I think building a defensive team is the way to go, but the evidence just doesn't back up their claim.

 

[elindholm]

There are just as many unsuccessful defensive teams as there are unsuccessful offensive teams. You need talent, not a "culture."

 

[SirStefan32]

There are just as many unsuccessful defensive teams as there are unsuccessful offensive teams. You need talent, not a "culture."

That's a good point. If you look at the current team, other than Dragic and Scola, there isn't a single person on the team who can create their own shot. Even Detroit had Billups and Sheed Wallace. You can add Ibaka and a 25 year old Mutombo to the current Suns team and they would still suck.

This team needs someone who can flat-out score- shoot, penetrate, create their own shot while not being completely useless defensively. Even with a number one pick, not sure who that person would be. Free agency is going to be terrible this year too.

 

[Chaplin]

Defense is great, but if you don't have anyone that can actually, you know, score points, then who cares how good your defense is? Gone are the days of the Detroit Pistons winning championships with 75-69 scorelines.

 

[Phrazbit]

The Suns are among the worst teams in the league on both ends of court. As others have said, we need talent. Playing good team defense, moving the ball on offense, its a start but if the players stink it wont matter. The NBA is more talent driven than any of the other major sports. The cream rises to the top, if you dont have an elite player (or three) then you're just a speed bump for the legit teams.

 

[SirStefan32]

So, what do you guys think is the SINGLE greatest need on this team?
I realize there are 10 things the Suns need, but if you were the Suns GM, what would be your number one priority this offseason?

 

[BC867]

This team needs someone who can flat-out score- shoot, penetrate, create their own shot while not being completely useless defensively. Even with a number one pick, not sure who that person would be. Free agency is going to be terrible this year too.

A culture change, stressing defense, is the first step toward success. A new mission statement, so to speak. Then you fill in the parts. And, yes, it takes time.

Of course, we need a go-to scorer and, stupidly, the Front Office put all of their eggs in the Beasley basket.

But, even worse, they previously put all of their eggs in the D'Antoni basket. His disrespect for all-around team skills led to us being a last place team.

The higher we aim, the higher we go. And if the FO is bull$hitting us, or doesn't have the skill to make us stronger than just sneaking into the playoffs, we'd be no worse than we are right now.

At least this article indicates a new direction. It's about time!

 

[Superbone]

Words are cheap.

 

[devilalum]

Exactly what I was thinking. If your vision is to be a defensive team, you don't sign players with no defense. Not only Beasley, but also Scola, and to a lesser degree Marshall and Morris. I think we will see how serious they are about this in the draft. If they draft Bazz, we'll know they are not serious. If they go with Porter/Oladipo, I'll believe it.

Same applies to free agency. If they try to sign Ellis/Evenas/Smith, we'll know they are full of crap.

Don't get me wrong, I think building a defensive team is the way to go, but the evidence just doesn't back up their claim.

I don't have a problem with Scola. At least he's a nice asset at a good price that can be traded for a better fitting piece. Beasley is horrible and everybody knew he would be horrible.

 

[95pro]

Biggest thing we need is a legit star who can take and make big shots.

 

[AzStevenCal]

I don't have a problem with Scola. At least he's a nice asset at a good price that can be traded for a better fitting piece. Beasley is horrible and everybody knew he would be horrible.

Not quite true. I didn't know. I knew he was a long shot but I also knew he had untapped talent. I think they paid a little more than necessary but I still don't have a problem with the gamble. It failed but we had to spend money somewhere and I'd much rather take a guy with a high ceiling than a guy with a low ceiling but a high floor. We weren't going to become good by signing a decent wing player, we needed a star and none were readily available.

Steve

 

[JCSunsfan]

If this is their is their vision why did they sign Beasley to a multi year deal?

Because they are desperate for talent, just like everyone one else on this thread has been saying. There is no question that Beasley has talent. They could get him without giving up any assets or picks. They took a gamble that someone could get inside his head and unlock all that potential.

It hasnt happened. All that is lost is a bit of cap space for a relatively short period of time. It was a gamble.

 

[JCSunsfan]

That's a good point. If you look at the current team, other than Dragic and Scola, there isn't a single person on the team who can create their own shot. Even Detroit had Billups and Sheed Wallace. You can add Ibaka and a 25 year old Mutombo to the current Suns team and they would still suck.

This team needs someone who can flat-out score- shoot, penetrate, create their own shot while not being completely useless defensively. Even with a number one pick, not sure who that person would be. Free agency is going to be terrible this year too.

I've never thought of Billups as a guy who could create his own shot.

So, if it is so hopeless, how to they pull a rabbit out of a hat. The only thing that I wish they had done was go after James Harden. He turned out to be better than everyone thought.

I am not trying to be an apologist for this management team. There are lots of criticisms of how things are, but very few constructive suggestions about where to go from here.

 

[BC867]

Hey guys. The article is about a change in team culture. Bringing our defense up to the level of our previous good offense to be competitive throughout the playoffs.

But your responses have been about one thing -- a go-to scorer. At this rate of addressing one problem every 44 years, none of us will be around to see a well rounded competitive team.

I've been a Suns fan for a long time, but I don't accept that scoring is all that matters. D'Antoni did and, as the article says, when he was told to incorporate defense, he left. With Hunter following through, you're not all going to leave, are you?

You can add Ibaka and a 25 year old Mutombo to the current Suns team and they would still suck.

That's the point. Hunter is talking about incorporating a positive attitude about defense at all 5 positions all through the game.

 

[SirStefan32]

Hey guys. The article is about a change in team culture. Bringing our defense up to the level of our previous good offense to be competitive throughout the playoffs.

But your responses have been about one thing -- a go-to scorer. At this rate of addressing one problem every 44 years, none of us will be around to see a well rounded competitive team.

I've been a Suns fan for a long time, but I don't accept that scoring is all that matters. D'Antoni did and, as the article says, when he was told to incorporate defense, he left. With Hunter following through, you're not all going to leave, are you?


That's the point. Hunter is talking about incorporating a positive attitude about defense at all 5 positions all through the game.

I guess I don't get your point. You would rather be a defensive team that sucks? I don't think anyone disagrees that defense is a good thing and I am pretty sure we all want the Suns to be a strong defensive team. We are simply pointing out that even if you are the best defensive team in the league, you still need to score some points.

 

[Phrazbit]

I get that, they say they want to make a good defensive team, but just like how the old high scoring Suns had a ton of talented scorers, if you're going to be a stout defensive team you need to have talented defensive players. If their goal is to build a defensive powerhouse then their moves are very confusing.

 

[SirStefan32]

I've never thought of Billups as a guy who could create his own shot.

So, if it is so hopeless, how to they pull a rabbit out of a hat. The only thing that I wish they had done was go after James Harden. He turned out to be better than everyone thought.

I am not trying to be an apologist for this management team. There are lots of criticisms of how things are, but very few constructive suggestions about where to go from here.

Not sure what to say about Billups. He never forced anything, but he could flat out score. If I remember correctly he averaged over 20 points against the Lakers when Detroit won the championship. He could shoot from behind the line, he could penetrate and pull up for that mid-range jumper, and he could take it to the basket. In my book, that's a good who can create his own shot.
Either way, my point was that while the Pistons were an excellent (brilliant, even) defensive team, they had guys who could score- Billups, Hamilton, Sheed Wallace could all create their own shots, and then you had a bunch of other guys who could score- Okur, Williamson, Prince. Hell, even deep bench (Atkins, Campbell, etc) were not as bad as most of the Suns rotation now.
Don't remember if Dice was in Detroit that year, or if he got there the next year- he was a very good scorer as well.

To answer your second question- there is no pulling a rabbit out of a hat. The Suns are terrible and they have no real assets. Dragic is certainly a capable point guard on both ends of the floor, Dudley is a good "D and 3" player- either as a starter or as a sixth man, and Gortat is an average Center. Scola is a decent veteran PF who is past his prime, Tucker is a nice role-player. The rest of the roster is just terrible.
There is no easy fix. The biggest need, in my opinion, is a shooting guard who can flat-out score. I think that once the Suns have a good shooting guard, Dragic will explode. Dragic needs a good shooter/ scorer at 2 to be really effective. Free agency is going to be crappy, and even best scorers in the draft have some major issues with their games, so even the first pick isn't a guarantee.
My plan would be to pursue that shooting guard via trades, but it's really tough when you have no assets.
I think you try to turn Gortat and maybe even Dudley into some pics, don't do stupid things (Sign guys like Beasley, Ellis, Evans), and you just suck for a couple of years while you compile some talent.
There is nobody in this draft or 2013 free agency who will get you out of this crap.

 

[elindholm]

I realize there are 10 things the Suns need, but if you were the Suns GM, what would be your number one priority this offseason?

Keep losing. It's going to take a lot more than one top-five pick to get out of this hole.

 

[ASUCHRIS]

Keep losing. It's going to take a lot more than one top-five pick to get out of this hole.

Sad but true. We need stars, and until we get them, we'll continue to be irrelevant.

 

[Mainstreet]

Words are cheap.

My thoughts exactly. The Suns defense has given up an average of 110.4 points over the past five games per Paul Coro at azcentral.

http://www.azcentral.com/insiders/p...ards-have-similar-records-different-outlooks/

 

[Errntknght]

I certainly like the philosophy of the FO & Hunter - I've been waiting and hoping for it for about 40 years. But the floor isn't the only place we're short of talent - the owner doesn't have the first clue, Blanks and our draft team have demonstrated little ability to evaluate players and at this point I have serious doubts about Hunter as a defensive coach - and thats his strong suit. Babby may be a decent deal maker but he's not about to provide the vision necessary to put a contending team together - defensive minded or otherwise.

When this crew gets done the fans are going to say 'screw this defense crap, we did much better with a strong offense'. Of course they won't have seen any decent defense.

We're pretty thoroughly screwed until Sarver panics and sells the team.

 

[Phrazbit]

Currently on pace to give up 132 to the lowly Wizards... you can really feeel the culture change.

 

[JCSunsfan]

Not sure what to say about Billups. He never forced anything, but he could flat out score. If I remember correctly he averaged over 20 points against the Lakers when Detroit won the championship. He could shoot from behind the line, he could penetrate and pull up for that mid-range jumper, and he could take it to the basket. In my book, that's a good who can create his own shot.
Either way, my point was that while the Pistons were an excellent (brilliant, even) defensive team, they had guys who could score- Billups, Hamilton, Sheed Wallace could all create their own shots, and then you had a bunch of other guys who could score- Okur, Williamson, Prince. Hell, even deep bench (Atkins, Campbell, etc) were not as bad as most of the Suns rotation now.
Don't remember if Dice was in Detroit that year, or if he got there the next year- he was a very good scorer as well.

To answer your second question- there is no pulling a rabbit out of a hat. The Suns are terrible and they have no real assets. Dragic is certainly a capable point guard on both ends of the floor, Dudley is a good "D and 3" player- either as a starter or as a sixth man, and Gortat is an average Center. Scola is a decent veteran PF who is past his prime, Tucker is a nice role-player. The rest of the roster is just terrible.
There is no easy fix. The biggest need, in my opinion, is a shooting guard who can flat-out score. I think that once the Suns have a good shooting guard, Dragic will explode. Dragic needs a good shooter/ scorer at 2 to be really effective. Free agency is going to be crappy, and even best scorers in the draft have some major issues with their games, so even the first pick isn't a guarantee.
My plan would be to pursue that shooting guard via trades, but it's really tough when you have no assets.
I think you try to turn Gortat and maybe even Dudley into some pics, don't do stupid things (Sign guys like Beasley, Ellis, Evans), and you just suck for a couple of years while you compile some talent.
There is nobody in this draft or 2013 free agency who will get you out of this crap.

I do think Shabazz, Oladipo, or McLemore would help.