me too. The lack of intelligence on the board this year is nauseating
suggs will give us a year...cjones maybe three more years...we need a badass pass rusher to carry us beyond that or we will find ourself with bare cupboards yet again.
This year's draft may be the one I have the least interest in
- Thread starter Southpaw
- Start date
suggs will give us a year...cjones maybe three more years...we need a badass pass rusher to carry us beyond that or we will find ourself with bare cupboards yet again.
OP
OP
Reddog
ASFN Lifer
I totally disagree. This is great theatre. Not knowing what the Cards brass think, the mystery surrounding Rosen’s potential availability and what he might draw in trade compensation. The inflation and infatuation with a Murray is a lesson in PR. My personal hope is we keep Rosen, get a King’s ransom for the first pick and load up with players that make us contenders for years to come.
football karma
Michael snuggles the cap space
- Joined
- Jul 22, 2002
- Posts
- 15,245
- Reaction score
- 14,305
im kinda off the draft until we get closer or something happens
there are just so many "Murray is short and will fail" vs "Murray is awesome and will succeed" posts one you can read --- as if posting it over and over will somehow change minds.
We have established the ASFN version of Godwins Law: no matter the thread title, the odds of the thread becoming some version of the Murray / Rosen debate approach 100% with each successive post.
At least we are now in the window pre-draft where in years past teams have made big moves up to #1-- so something may happen any day...……….. or wont until draft day.
there are just so many "Murray is short and will fail" vs "Murray is awesome and will succeed" posts one you can read --- as if posting it over and over will somehow change minds.
We have established the ASFN version of Godwins Law: no matter the thread title, the odds of the thread becoming some version of the Murray / Rosen debate approach 100% with each successive post.
At least we are now in the window pre-draft where in years past teams have made big moves up to #1-- so something may happen any day...……….. or wont until draft day.
I basically just read thread about later picks at this point. I cant handle anymore Murray and Rosen topics.
juza76
ASFN Icon
I very much disagree with that statement.
Risky Biscuit also produced to .500 seasons in a row, to be fair.
and if Murray doesn't work out, it gives us no future.
Does bosa big brother impact drastically the chargers seasons?
Tamba HalI or Justin Houston were able to bring Kansas at conference title before Mahomes ?
With Chandler Jones and his 2 amazing seasons in a row the cardinals went 11-21
Cliff avril and Michael Bennet they had to wait Russel Wilson to win something
Maybe Murray will be a bust but if he show in the next level what he did in college, and his ceiling is very high, we can be very competitive from day 1
BW52
Registered
Simplistic thinking.If you don`t think having a top defensive player helps the team them I don`t know what to tell you.What about the Ravens and Joey Flacco? How many Super Bowls did Mike Vick win? Randall Cunningham?RG3?How many teams won the Super Bowl with poor defenses?
juza76
ASFN Icon
Do u want guys dreaming big or not
This franchise never won a superbowl
We neee to take some risks even for jyst galvanizing the fan base
Last season was painfull to watch
This franchise never won a superbowl
We neee to take some risks even for jyst galvanizing the fan base
Last season was painfull to watch
BW52
Registered
I'm still torn between Rosen and Murray. Tough decision for MB/SK/KK.
But the more I think about it: If they rate Murray higher than Rosen and view him as a better scheme fit, we must pick him! Even if his grade is just slightly higher than Rosen's. QB is by far the most important position.
The Chiefs had a dominant pass rush for many years. Hali and Houston were a deadly duo. Then Dee Ford entered the mix as Hali declined. Chris Jones stepped up as a dominant interior force. However, it wasn't until Pat Mahomes took over that they became serious contenders. Btw out of all these pass rushers, only Chris Jones is still a Chief. Even with Houston, Ford and Jones playing at a high level, their defense wasn't good enough to make some stops while their QB lit up the scoreboard.
So you see, there are no guarantees in the NFL. I still think you can win with defense. But the window of an elite defense is rather small. Being a contender year after year is only possible with a legit franchise QB. I'd rather swing the fences on the latter if Murray grades out better than Rosen. If not, keep developing Rosen and use Bosa/Quinnen to build a dominant defense.
But I wouldn't pass on a QB prospect that's rated better than your current QB, who hasn't proven anything in the NFL yet. Granted, Rosen had miserable circumstances. But it's not like we are the Browns who can say with confidence that Mayfield is their future. In fact, Rosen might have even more question marks right now than he had a year ago.
But the more I think about it: If they rate Murray higher than Rosen and view him as a better scheme fit, we must pick him! Even if his grade is just slightly higher than Rosen's. QB is by far the most important position.
The Chiefs had a dominant pass rush for many years. Hali and Houston were a deadly duo. Then Dee Ford entered the mix as Hali declined. Chris Jones stepped up as a dominant interior force. However, it wasn't until Pat Mahomes took over that they became serious contenders. Btw out of all these pass rushers, only Chris Jones is still a Chief. Even with Houston, Ford and Jones playing at a high level, their defense wasn't good enough to make some stops while their QB lit up the scoreboard.
So you see, there are no guarantees in the NFL. I still think you can win with defense. But the window of an elite defense is rather small. Being a contender year after year is only possible with a legit franchise QB. I'd rather swing the fences on the latter if Murray grades out better than Rosen. If not, keep developing Rosen and use Bosa/Quinnen to build a dominant defense.
But I wouldn't pass on a QB prospect that's rated better than your current QB, who hasn't proven anything in the NFL yet. Granted, Rosen had miserable circumstances. But it's not like we are the Browns who can say with confidence that Mayfield is their future. In fact, Rosen might have even more question marks right now than he had a year ago.
BW52
Registered
Disagree.This team needs to be smart.taking the hyped media driven choice doesn`t mean it would be the best choice.I know this team has never won a superbowl.i have been following this team for 50 plus years.Painful to watch would be a understatement if this team drafted another QB in Round 1 (Murray) and he flops and the Cards have to go QB shopping again next draft.That would be painful.
I think it's a story like nothing we have seen before so I find it fascinating.
There are 3 options (Murray, stay and take D, trade back) and I have no idea which will occur. I can't remember a time when the top of the draft is so uncertain.
There are 3 options (Murray, stay and take D, trade back) and I have no idea which will occur. I can't remember a time when the top of the draft is so uncertain.
PJ1
ASFN Icon
The Murray talk has spoiled it for me and I live where the draft is being held. When they speak of the Cardinals it is the only thing mentioned.
JeffGollin
ASFN Icon
Two problems I have with this draft:
1. Repetitative Murray - Rosen neverending debate.
2. Roster turnover & new regime makes it tough to (a) know what we've got and (b) figure out what we need
Most drafts, I pretty much know what the roster holes are and could put together a pretty good projected mock right down into UDFA territory. This draft, I don't have a clue.
1. Repetitative Murray - Rosen neverending debate.
2. Roster turnover & new regime makes it tough to (a) know what we've got and (b) figure out what we need
Most drafts, I pretty much know what the roster holes are and could put together a pretty good projected mock right down into UDFA territory. This draft, I don't have a clue.
juza76
ASFN Icon
Qb is the most impactfull position by very large margin
Murray and his talent and the ability to do multiple things with his arm talent and feet can make us very competitive and can be a nightmare for defensive coordinators
With Rosen we don't go anywhere, we need an all pro team around him and isnt guarantee we can win
The guy at best can be a game manager
Ucla sucked with him in the same way sucked without him, he isn't the guy that give u hope
Krangodnzr
Captain of Team Conner
The Cardinals don't have a poor defense. Even last year, they were a middle of the pack defense even though they were running a scheme not suited to the personnel.
I expect the Cardinals to be around the top 10 defenses in the league this year with the additions they've already made.
What the Cardinals have is an awful offense. Adding a potential generational talent at QB who could change their fortunes quickly.
GuernseyCard
ASFN Icon
Generational talent!
Please...
KM is not an Andrew Luck in pint size.
Krangodnzr
Captain of Team Conner
I think if WR is addressed and the offensive line improves, the team will be.
I'm not against Williams or Bosa, but QB just has a much bigger impact.
As someone else stated, the best defensive lineman in the league was only 2 WAR (wins above replacement), wins means if you put a league average player in their spot they would only lose 2 more games. That's not as significant as a impact QB.
I would REALLY like if the Cardinals can rob the Raiders. Trade down to #4 and have it play out like this:
#4 Quinnen Williams (Jets likely to take Josh Allen, they need edge rusher bad)
#24 Noah Fant
#32 N'Keal Harry/Deebo Samuel
#35 Chris Lindstrom
That right there makes the Cardinals much better. You get two playmakers for the offense, a potential 10 year starter at guard (which allows the team to cut Pugh at the first convenience and save money), and a defensive cornerstone.
Krangodnzr
Captain of Team Conner
He could be. You can ignore his history of excellence and his elite measureables (4.3 speed) and his arm, but the fact remains he can be that good.
GuernseyCard
ASFN Icon
Well, for one, I wouldn't invest #1 to find out.
And, how can anyone say that he has Mike Vick speed when he refused to run?
This is from WalterFootball
Read more: http://walterfootball.com/draft2019QB.php#ixzz5idkZ81uI
All team sources were in agreement that an offense would have to be changed and built around Murray. They all said that he will have to play out of the shotgun. And at 5-foot-10, he is too short to be under center and do quick passing off of three-step drops. Thus, the offense is going to have to be built around Murray and he is not a quarterback who can be plugged into any NFL offense. That also presents some problems for his pro team in finding a backup quarterback who can execute the same plays. Therefore, it is going to take a team that is willing to commit to Murray and go all-in on building the offense around him.
I would think that being unable to go under center and being unable to execute a 3 step drop pass would put some limitations how much you can do on offense and make it easier for the defense to defend. You certainly will not be able to run play action. The quick out will be slower since the snap will have to travel 5 yards.
Read more: http://walterfootball.com/draft2019QB.php#ixzz5idkZ81uI
All team sources were in agreement that an offense would have to be changed and built around Murray. They all said that he will have to play out of the shotgun. And at 5-foot-10, he is too short to be under center and do quick passing off of three-step drops. Thus, the offense is going to have to be built around Murray and he is not a quarterback who can be plugged into any NFL offense. That also presents some problems for his pro team in finding a backup quarterback who can execute the same plays. Therefore, it is going to take a team that is willing to commit to Murray and go all-in on building the offense around him.
I would think that being unable to go under center and being unable to execute a 3 step drop pass would put some limitations how much you can do on offense and make it easier for the defense to defend. You certainly will not be able to run play action. The quick out will be slower since the snap will have to travel 5 yards.
Draft day will be exciting for Cards fans without a doubt. I don't think the FO will leak any information on who the #1 pick will be. Just like almost nobody expected the Browns to pick Mayfield at #1. Although if we trade down, it would probably leak in the days leading up to the draft. But in this case the speculation on which top prospect slips to us would still be exciting.
If we pick Bosa or Quinnen at #1, the rest of the 1st round would indeed be boring. I don't care which QB goes where if it doesn't concern the Cardinals.
But what would make this whole draft really spicy is picking Murray at #1. This would basically open the bidding for Rosen. Make no mistake, he just turned 22 and would probably be a top 10 pick in this draft, similar to Haskins. I would imagine a mid 1st would be the ultimate price paid for Rosen. At the very least a late 1st round pick. So we would suddenly pick again in the 1st again after taking Murray at #1, either using the deep DL pool, adding an offensive weapon or building the OL.
If we pick Bosa or Quinnen at #1, the rest of the 1st round would indeed be boring. I don't care which QB goes where if it doesn't concern the Cardinals.
But what would make this whole draft really spicy is picking Murray at #1. This would basically open the bidding for Rosen. Make no mistake, he just turned 22 and would probably be a top 10 pick in this draft, similar to Haskins. I would imagine a mid 1st would be the ultimate price paid for Rosen. At the very least a late 1st round pick. So we would suddenly pick again in the 1st again after taking Murray at #1, either using the deep DL pool, adding an offensive weapon or building the OL.
- Joined
- May 13, 2002
- Posts
- 38,511
- Reaction score
- 25,475
It's just another draft. Typical overhype, overspeculation....the real difference is our little team is the center of so much of it this year. It doesn't bother me.
Krangodnzr
Captain of Team Conner
Krangodnzr
Captain of Team Conner
Eyeball test. He easily outran CBs on his long runs.
Murray isnt running the 40 because he doesn't want people to think of him as Vick.
He threw for more yardage in one season than Vick did in two. Even mentioning the two in the same sentence makes no sense. Before I did any research on Murray, I believed he was a "running QB". I learned I was WRONG, he is a QB who can run.
Similar threads
