thoughts on substitution patterns?

[playstation]

i'm somewhat bored, thought i'd throw out what i think coach's substitution pattern will be in a standard non-blowout non-foul-plagued game:

start of half:
start:
lineup-nash, raja, grant, shawn, amare

6:00
out-raja, grant
in-barbosa, diaw
lineup-nash, barbosa, shawn, diaw, amare

4:00
out-nash
in-raja
lineup-barbosa, raja, shawn, diaw, amare

2:00
out-amare
in-grant
lineup-barbosa, raja, grant, shawn, diaw

end of quarter (1st & 3rd)
out-shawn
in-skinner
lineup-barbosa, raja, grant, diaw, skinner

10:00 (OPTIONAL depending on if nash is badly needed)
out-skinner
in-nash
lineup-nash, barbosa, raja, grant, diaw

8:00
out-raja, grant, skinner (if he's still on the court)
in-nash, shawn, amare
lineup-nash, barbosa, shawn, diaw, amare

4:00
out-diaw
in-raja
lineup-nash, barbosa, raja, shawn, amare

3:00 (OPTIONAL depending on how game is going)
out-barbosa
in-grant
lineup-nash, raja, grant, shawn, amare

***end of half***

if you repeat this for both halves, you get the following minute breakdown:
nash 32-36
raja 36
grant 27-30
shawn 40
amare 36
barbosa 30-33
diaw 28
skinner 4-8

this makes most sense to me (and yes i went a little overboard here lol).

and remember this is for no foul-trouble, no blow-outs. overall minutes are going to be even fewer for the starters due to those blowouts.

agree/disagree?

 

[fordronken]

From what I could gather from D'Antoni's interview, Banks will get minutes to start the season. I'm guessing he'll play about 15 minutes a game. He'll probably take some of Shawn's and Raja's minutes down a notch. We'll see a lot of Banks/Barbosa in the backcourt. Apparently Banks has been working on playing off the ball and really improved his shooting. If he can be an effective spot up shooter, and slash to the basket without the ball, then play good defense against the opposing team's point guards, he'll be a really helpful addition.

 

[myrondizzo]

well i think we need to work in 11-12 guys or we aren't going to win a championship.

 

[HooverDam]

end of quarter (1st & 3rd)
out-shawn
in-skinner
lineup-barbosa, raja, grant, diaw, skinner

Hm, I don't know for how long of a stretch D'Antoni will want to go w/ out any of the Big 3 on the court. It seems like one of them is always out there.

 

[Mainstreet]

The thing that keeps going through my mind if Hill cannot take starter minutes at SF and Shawn plays primarily at the 4, might the Suns be a player short at SF? I know the Suns can temporarily plug the hole but long term, I'm not sure. I'm always pushing for the Suns to add another big man but I do see a potential depth problem at SF.

 

[Sunsman44]

Very detailed. Rotation looks and sounds about right. Although I'd like to see Brian Skinner get at least 12 minutes and Amare around 38, not 36. You'd have about 2 minutes of Amare and Skinner both in at the same time for defense.

nash 32
raja 36
grant 28
shawn 38
amare 38
barbosa 32
diaw 28
skinner 12

 

[playstation]

Very detailed. Rotation looks and sounds about right. Although I'd like to see Brian Skinner get at least 12 minutes and Amare around 38, not 36. You'd have about 2 minutes of Amare and Skinner both in at the same time for defense.

nash 32
raja 36
grant 28
shawn 38
amare 38
barbosa 32
diaw 28
skinner 12

that's what i would like too, size would really be a plus. what i posted was more what i thought d'antoni will end up doing.

i remember a couple years back we all were shaking the TV screaming at dantoni to put amare and hunter on the floor together, but it never happened. that's just how he is methinks.

and the comment on banks makes sense, but its hard to fathom looking at our backcourt minutes. even if he got better, he'd have to get A LOT better to break into nash, bell, barbosa.

none of them are playing too many minutes, so if banks gets in, he's playing instead of one of the other 3 who don't need the rest. basically, that's not happening unless fouls/garbage time imo. we just don't have room for banks in the regular rotation i don't think.

and the crazy thing is, even with that rotation, i don't think anyone gets run into the ground. everyone can play those type of minutes and be just fine, just gotta watch the peaks so nash doesn't get 3 straight 40+min games

 

[Errntknght]

Personally, I want to see the Suns playing at max tempo the whole game along with hard-nosed defense, so I'd have both Strawberry and Banks shuttling onto the floor and some of Tucker as well at SF. Sheesh, if you're going to play small you might as well do it right for a change - dipping daintily into your bench isn't going to cut it.

 

[YouJustGotSUNSD]

You guys all forgot Sean Secret Weapon Marks!

 

[Maligzar]

I'm going to post what I think we'll see, instead of my opinion on what I think we should see.

First month of the season:

nash 32
raja 36
grant 28
shawn 38
amare 36
barbosa 30
diaw 28
banks 12
skinner 4

Basically I don't see Skinner getting a whole lot of minutes. I don't know how this guy even can be on the floor at the same time as Amare. He has NO jumpshot, NO outside shot. Kurt was able to paly with Amare because he got out of the way and was a threat from outside the paint. That's not going to be the case with Skinner.

 

[Mainstreet]

I'm going to post what I think we'll see, instead of my opinion on what I think we should see.

First month of the season:

nash 32
raja 36
grant 28
shawn 38
amare 36
barbosa 30
diaw 28
banks 12
skinner 4

Basically I don't see Skinner getting a whole lot of minutes. I don't know how this guy even can be on the floor at the same time as Amare. He has NO jumpshot, NO outside shot. Kurt was able to paly with Amare because he got out of the way and was a threat from outside the paint. That's not going to be the case with Skinner.

I can see Skinner letting Amare play outside the cylinder when he is in foul difficulty or has a difficult match-up. Skinner can guard another big, rebound and play defense. He would also allow Amare to stay in the game in such situations and hit the midrange shot when needed. Skinner could also clean up any missed shots not to mention he can run the floor. However, you might be right about Skinner not getting a lot of minutes regularly, but I do see him getting some significant situational minutes.

 

[azirish]

I have no clue as to what will actually happen because we don't know how many minutes Hill can play, whether Banks is improved enough to get on the floor and how Skinner will adapt to the Suns (and vice versa).

One major issue will be whether Skinner backs up Amare or Shawn. My hope is that he backs up Shawn for several reasons:

1. Leaves Diaw at center where he's more effective than at PF. He's pretty good at the pick and roll.

2. Avoids having Skinner and Marion on the floor at the same time, since neither can shoot.

3. Gives Skinner minutes playing with Stoudemire in preparation for playoff type basketball.

 

[dodie53]

imo,
it's better if 1 of the big 3 is always on the court

 

[Sunsman44]

Basically I don't see Skinner getting a whole lot of minutes. I don't know how this guy even can be on the floor at the same time as Amare. He has NO jumpshot, NO outside shot. Kurt was able to paly with Amare because he got out of the way and was a threat from outside the paint. That's not going to be the case with Skinner.

Yeah, it's called: Amare plays power forward and shows off his jump shot (the one better than Kurts) and Skinner does what he does well inside (defend the center).

If I were coach, I'd start Amare at power and Brian at center. A genius I am.

 

[Sunsman44]

1. Leaves Diaw at center where he's more effective than at PF. He's pretty good at the pick and roll.

2. Avoids having Skinner and Marion on the floor at the same time, since neither can shoot.

3. Gives Skinner minutes playing with Stoudemire in preparation for playoff type basketball.

Ah yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Indeed.

I don't know what it is, but I've been agreeing with much of your Skinner comments.

Hard to find people out there who encourage a Skinner for Marion substitution in which either an Amare or Boris are on the floor with him.

 

[Sunsman44]

Minutes:

Nash 34
Barbosa 32
Bell 36
Diaw 34
Skinner 20
Amare 38
Hill 28
Tucker 28
Marion 4

 

[Chaplin]

Minutes:

Nash 34
Barbosa 32
Bell 36
Diaw 34
Skinner 20
Amare 38
Hill 28
Tucker 28
Marion 4

This is getting ridiculous.

 

[Sunsman44]

This is getting ridiculous.

Chaplin don't like jokes? Sorry.

 

[Chaplin]

Chaplin don't like jokes? Sorry.

Jokes are fine, but after awhile and repeating them over and over, they get old.

 

[playstation]

i'm starting to think that while tucker and strawberry (dj specifically) won't get rotation minutes, d'antoni will be a lot more comfortable putting them in while a lead in the 4th. if we have a 15 pt lead in the 4th, coach won't be compelled to keep the guys in 'just in case' because he can trust some of these reserves. this is good i think

 

[jandaman]

Ideal

Nash - 30
Bell - 30
Hill - 28
Marion - 32
Stoudemire - 30
Barbosa - 28
Diaw - 24
Skinner - 8
Banks - 12
Tucker - 12
Strawberry - 6


At the first half of the season anyways and then cut down to about 8 man rotation up those guys minutes, except Nash and Hill. Save them for the playoffs.

 

[Chaplin]

The only way Stoudemire gets 30 minutes a game is if he's in foul trouble. There is NO WAY our superstar gets only 30.

 

[jandaman]

Duncan gets 30 mins avg.

If Suns are up 15+, I'd rest Stoudemire, and give Diaw, Skinner and Tucker the front court to get them to gel.

 

[YouJustGotSUNSD]

Well yeah if theyre up 15 Amare will rest. What Duncan does is completely irrelevant to the suns system