The Cardinals are likely to keep 9 OL on the roster, possibly 10---and will dress 7-8 on game day.
If we add 3-4 o-linemen as you suggest---who are they, who starts and who are the 9-10 roster players?
Well I'm open to a wide variety of what's out there. As I've said I'm open to getting a tackle, but only if one falls and even then I'd be more likely to take a safety given that we can be assured to get a prospect (whether they pan out is another question) if we draft one in round 2 or 3. We might be able to get one in round 4, but it's possible they are gone or we'd be down to the bottom of what the
See the difference in our opinions is that you see the potential potential of some of the guys we have down the depth chart that we've picked up. Potential low risk, low to medium reward players that if we're lucky one of the guys might become a bit better than a medium reward and be an average player at their position. Now this is ok, I'm not faulting you on trying to read and gauge these players and what not. I just believe its time for a different strategy and this is the year of any year to use that strategy.
What I know is that we're not in a position really to go this route. We really need to upgrade this line pronto, and I don't feel having 5-6 of these guys to potentially get one decent guy is worth holding all these roster spots in a venerable hostage situation to what we could do with those spots. Given how our starters simply don't match up to NFL standards, and especially not in our division, I know that trying to find some cream to rise to the top will not solve our problem. If anything as I said it might replace one guy when we need many replacements right now and be bracing for the future when we need even more replacements. We need to fast track our fix and not rely on a strategy that works better when you have a solid line and starters in front. This is when it's better to employ that strategy.
Right now we have an opportunity and a warning in that we can try to wait for some cream to rise, or we can go out and purchase in the draft some top notch cream right now while there is a big overstock at the store we haven't seen in a decade or longer. The warning comes to us that if we don't, others with better lines than ours will further the gap between us and them by picking up these players.
So I'm saying rather than these lower rung guys we picked up holding a spot, we should be using those spots on this great OL draft class.
In a perfect world I'd love a great LT. But what we have is Levi, who is great at certain aspects of being a tackle and horrible in others. We also have him signed and at a decent deal so I believe this year isn't the year to bypass great inside players for tackles. Our need is on the inside. I feel even if we add 3-4 guys, we will need to use a 1st or 2nd round on a lineman each of the next two years to round out the line.
Some of it because we still wouldn't have the talent for a great unit. Another reason is because odds are somebody won't pan out. Another reason is the guys get older and/or injuries happen. So how far down we are, we really need to draft enough guys to fix this unit, and if we wait until another year, it might not be possible to get it done so quickly. We can get probably halfway there in this draft, which is amazing given that we could literally use 4-5 new starters on the line. That we can do this and probably pick up a good safety to me is one helluva draft.
As I've said I think for this next year Levi at LT is something we should get used to. If there was one guy I'd want to see what Arians can do for, it's him. In time, if we find a replacement in 2014 or 2015, I say pushing him inside is the way to go. But if we've fixed it like I feel we could, he would make for one helluva backup. Which would be consistent with potentially having a great line. I believe his contract expires after the 2015 season, 4 years right? So by 2016 he could be re-signed, or even 2015 as an extension to a more cap friendly deal.
I think Colledge and Snyder as guards are expendable. I'm ok with cutting both. But I can see us as needing one more year of Colledge at RG if we don't draft as many guys as we want. Snyder imo would be better served as a center. As a center I can see him potentially playing as long as LS there. We should still be looking for an upgrade, and if we can get a guy in the draft, like Schwenke or Jones then we have an option at least for this next season in seeing who is better. The draftee or Snyder. Thus I'd rather have a situation where it's possible that Snyder is a backup over some guy we picked up off the waiver wire.
I'm more partial to our draftees. Massie might eventually need to be replaced in a year or two. But I feel he gets at least this year to improve. Probably two. At this point, I consider him the safest position on the line. I give him the most leeway. He has the most future promise of any OLmen we have on the roster. Potter will make for a good backup, and I'm not opposed to him being a guard either, but I'm not going to stop adding to the position because of that potential. But I definitely want him on the roster over another team's castoff. Same goes with Kelemete.
So right now I'd say our top linemen our Levi, Massie, Snyder (at center), Potter, Kelemete, and the rest are expendable. Doesn't mean I'd get rid of all of them, but these are the guys I would feel assured are locks for a roster spot next year.
Levi either needs to be coached up or replaced, but he gets this year, and potentially more as a backup at guard or tackle. Massie could be our RT of the future, or a guy we need to replace. Snyder our center or backup center and backup guard. Potter and Kelemete are our developmental guys.
Now I'm not for Joeckel/Fisher/Johnson. Would I mind it terribly if they were picked? No, because they are talents. I just don't feel it would impact our line nearly as much as a legit guard would. As I said earlier all we'd be doing is potentially bettering our speed rush capability, and perhaps lessening the run blocking out of the position. If we pushed Levi inside it might work out better, but most people seem to think he'd be a RT, which then would negate Massie. So if that's what happens picking any one of those guys doesn't net much.
If we get Warmack, immediately our LG and at least for the next year our left side will be a powerful side to run behind. We'd have to give Warmack some time like any rookie to get his bearings, but I see that as a winning running combination. At least it would make the drawbacks of the Levi conundrum more palatable to swallow. Such a talented run blocker, but so lacking in his capability of blocking the speed rush. But if properly schemed and chipped and building a running wall, it could be serviceable at pass blocking and great at run blocking. Levi would then be a very palatable stop gap which we could then take a wait and see approach for the future.
Ideally at center we'd have Snyder battling a rookie like Schwenke or Jones. If we get a center, then I'm ready to cut ties to LS. But it doesn't mean we have to. Again I'd rather have Lyle then a castoff from another team. So as you can see the trend here, instead of holding those spots for the castoffs, I'd rather have them for our current starters until we can replace them. But given FA is basically already played out, I'm ok with giving them another year, while allowing them the chance of Arians and the slate of OL coaches a chance to extend their careers. Plus it would give us a chance to have experienced backups that can help bridge the gap with all these youngsters we bring on. Again I'd rather have our draftees around guys who started then guys who were castoffs that usually didn't play much.
Now with Arians we know he has no problem with roster turnover and Keim has already shown he isn't afraid of turnover. So after the draft we might see any or all of the following veteran linemen cut. Colledge, Snyder, and LS. I don't see it as likely that all would go. But I could see 1-2 of them released because we replaced them and then used that money for the wave of free agency after the draft to try to fill something we couldn't draft, and/or June cuts. At the very least given the contracts of Colledge and Snyder it would help set up cap space in 2014. But we still could probably sign one guy to a small 1-1.5 million contract with the space provided this year. I don't know the way they go, but I could see either as a possibility.
1st round
Warmack/Cooper
2nd round
Warford/Thomas/Long (all as guards)
IF a tackle like Fluker dropped my decision would be between Warford/Fluker.
I would consider taking a Schwenke or Jones here if the above are gone and thus a lineman run had occurred.
Note: This is not taking safety into the equation. But I would maybe opt to wait until the third round for a center, and take the safety, as I've been targeting 3rd or 4th round for our center.
3rd round
Dallas Thomas/Schwenke/Jones/Armstead
At this point I'd also consider taking Menelik Watson if he's still on the board.
4th round
Travis Frederick (as a guard, as a center behind Quessenberry)/Quessenberry//Brennan Williams/Justin Pugh.
The 4th linemen I'd potentially draft I'd wait until late and see if anyone drops. We have other needs so if we draft from those above guys and get three of them, I'm ok with not getting any more. Though if any of the above are still there in the 5th I would take them. But at this point if we haven't drafted an OLB, I'd be looking there first, then at RB or TE. A burner WR would be nice. We can skip a QB this year, or look for a Renfree in the 6th. Though others seem to think some of the injured LB's could be had this low as well.
So maybe a Stefan Taylor or Christine Michael in the 5th. If we were to go later than a Gillisee or Stefphon Jefferson. I think we could benefit with a low round RB, since the league seems to have prioritized the position in the draft less. If Kenjon Barner is there in the 6th or definitely 7th, and we haven't taken a back, then I'd consider him.
Marquise Goodwin or Denard Robinson as receivers in the 5th or 6th. Doubtful they are there.
I've been focusing more on the linemen as this should be our 1st, 2nd, and 3rd concern and have had less time to devote to researching due to pressure washing the roof, plugging leaks with about 11 cans of this so far
http://www.lowes.com/pd_139933-29-5...c&pl=1¤tURL=?Ntt=elastomeric&facetInfo=
have another 9 cans, mesh, not to mention installing window air conditioners (cutting 2 inch plastic foam [i guess styrofoam]and sealing it), and all sorts of other crap.
But yeah to return to the question
I'd ideally see
draft pick (from above pool)
draft pick
draft pick
levi
Massie
Snyder
Potter
Kelemete
So that's 8.
Then I'd let the rest of the guys battle it out
I would go into the season looking on paper that Levi is our LT, Warmack/Cooper our LG, Schwenke/Jones/Snyder at center, RG Warford/Thomas/Snyder/Colledge, and Massie as our RT.
I'd obviously like to see how they are in preseason and be prepared to take some licks early in the season as it's the end of the season and 2014 that matter more than the first half of the season. If they look lost then we have last year's starters (or someone who did start) to step in at center and rg.
It's way too early to prognosticate who starts and who goes, because it does all depends on who we actually draft. Maybe Lyle stays, maybe he goes. Maybe Colledge stays, maybe he goes.
As for the lower guys. Again it depends on what we draft. If we don't get a center, then guys like Wedige and Lyle have better shots.
Basically our viewpoints differ in where we start the coaching up process. I think we need to start coaching up some high draft picks out of a loaded ol draft. Again if we don't draft these guys, someone else will, and while we're trying to coach up castoffs, they'll be coaching up talent. Practice squad should be used accordingly to those who are still eligible.
I simply believe we need to make major investments in this draft, and still be prepared to demote or jettison some of the guys that may start even this year by drafting high more again next year. We need to be adding good OL talent faster then we are and have to make sure we stay ahead of the curve for injuries, age, salary, and potential draft busts. That means major investments, roster spots for them instead of cast offs, and utilizing this draft as the catalyst since this is the year to do it and may not come again in Arians or perhaps the next two or three coaches tenure. Maybe it does. But when you see this sort of talent, you grab it. We can draft tackles in the first or 2nd round any year, but this is the year we can get the talent to potentially rebuild all three of our interior line positions and included in that potentially the best guard in the last decade.
Something like that. Overall I'm not trying to predict. I'm trying to focus on what's the best way to get the line better given the situation.
