Trouble brewing already for Haley in KC.

Cards Czar

The Bird is the Word
Joined
May 14, 2002
Posts
3,171
Reaction score
370
Location
Alton, Ill
By JASON WHITLOCK
The Kansas City Star

Chiefs Pro Bowl guard Brian Waters asked the organization Thursday to release or trade him this offseason, according to a source with knowledge of the situation.

Waters asked for his release two days after a brief meeting with new head coach Todd Haley and after being told by first-time general manager Scott Pioli that he had no interest in meeting with Waters, the source said.

Waters, according to the source, was offended and shocked by what he perceived to be the arrogance of Haley and Pioli. Waters’ meeting with Haley and follow-up phone conversations confirmed in the nine-year vet’s mind that the negative reports about Haley he heard from Arizona Cardinals players while at the Pro Bowl were accurate, according to the source.

The Cardinals players told Waters and tight end Tony Gonzalez that Haley, Arizona’s offensive coordinator, was aloof, condescending and ignored by veterans, the source said. Anquan Boldin, Kurt Warner and Larry Fitzgerald Jr. — Arizona’s offensive stars — were all members of the NFC Pro Bowl team.

Haley could not be reached for comment Thursday night. Haley bickered with Boldin and Warner during the NFC championship game. And when he was an assistant with the Cowboys, Haley had several run-ins with flamboyant receiver Terrell Owens.

The source said when Waters informed Haley of his desire to relocate, Kansas City’s coach scolded Waters and indicated that the Chiefs would not release Waters from his contract. Waters signed a seven-year contract extension with the Chiefs in 2005. Waters, a four-time Pro Bowler, is 32 and would seemingly have decent trade value.

Waters declined public comment on Thursday.

He is the second high-priced Chiefs offensive star to ask for his release. Running back Larry Johnson has repeatedly asked to be let go. All-pro tight end Tony Gonzalez expressed disappointment when coach Herm Edwards was fired and has stated he will take a wait-and-see approach with the new regime.

Waters’ dissatisfaction is surprising given his reputation as a locker-room leader and his dedication to the organization. Waters is heavily involved in charitable activity in the Kansas City community and was a finalist for the NFL’s 2008 Man of the Year Award.

According to the source, Waters flew to Kansas City specifically to meet with Haley and Pioli and hear their plan for the direction of the organization. Pioli declined to meet with Waters, saying they had nothing to discuss, the source said. And Haley began his hallway conversation with Waters by proclaiming that 22 players off the street could win two games, the source said.

Waters considered his options Wednesday, flew to Dallas and then tried reaching owner Clark Hunt and Pioli before telling Haley on Thursday that he felt their differences were irreconcilable, the source said.

Waters joined the Chiefs in 2000 and became a starter in 2001.
 

DRVNFAST

Homey don't play that!
Supporting Member
Joined
Aug 11, 2002
Posts
1,051
Reaction score
42
Location
Austin TX
Haley began his hallway conversation with Waters by proclaiming that 22 players off the street could win two games, the source said.


Ouch, if true that's harsh.
 

Skkorpion

Grey haired old Bird
LEGACY MEMBER
Supporting Member
Joined
May 9, 2002
Posts
11,026
Reaction score
5
Location
Sun City, AZ
I like Haley more and more. An offensive guard under long term contract figured he deserved a personal meeting and an explanation of the new coach's plans for the future? Very revealing.

Seems Pioli and Haley are exactly what KC needed. Whitlock is one of my favorite writers but when he uses TO and Larry Johnson as crutches to make the point that Haley or Pioli is unreasonable, he destroys his own argument.
 

Stout

Hold onto the ball, Murray!
Joined
Dec 30, 2002
Posts
40,099
Reaction score
24,565
Location
Pittsburgh, PA--Enemy territory!
I like Haley more and more. An offensive guard under long term contract figured he deserved a personal meeting and an explanation of the new coach's plans for the future? Very revealing.

Seems Pioli and Haley are exactly what KC needed. Whitlock is one of my favorite writers but when he uses TO and Larry Johnson as crutches to make the point that Haley or Pioli is unreasonable, he destroys his own argument.

I like him less and less. A vet is curious about where the franchise is going, and not only can't get the time of day from the organization, but is insulted in the HALLWAY before they even make it to the meeting room? Just sounds like Haley's being a douchebag to set a precedence for being a douchebag.
 

Redbird 78

Newbie
Joined
Mar 3, 2009
Posts
26
Reaction score
0
I like Haley more and more. An offensive guard under long term contract figured he deserved a personal meeting and an explanation of the new coach's plans for the future? Very revealing.

Seems Pioli and Haley are exactly what KC needed. Whitlock is one of my favorite writers but when he uses TO and Larry Johnson as crutches to make the point that Haley or Pioli is unreasonable, he destroys his own argument.

DITTO That's like some mid-level manager in a company wanting to meet with the CEO to make sure their visions of the company's direction matched. LOL Waters is either an idiot or he's trying (unsuccessfully) to get canned so he can get a new contract.
 

DakotaCardsFan

Making time travel possible
Joined
Sep 17, 2004
Posts
524
Reaction score
39
Location
A few miles north.
I tend to agree with Skkorp on this one. A new coaching staff and a new GM are going to be more than a little busy this time of year. Sounds like this guy flew in to KC without scheduling a meeting first and then was insulted when the new GM didn't drop everything to meet with him.
 

the_future23

Registered
Joined
Feb 15, 2009
Posts
580
Reaction score
15
DITTO That's like some mid-level manager in a company wanting to meet with the CEO to make sure their visions of the company's direction matched. LOL Waters is either an idiot or he's trying (unsuccessfully) to get canned so he can get a new contract.

Or he is trying to go to a good team that isn't in rebuilding mode because he knows he can get a contract once released.
 

slanidrac16

ASFN Icon
Supporting Member
Joined
Jul 11, 2002
Posts
15,903
Reaction score
16,517
Location
Plainfield, Il.
I don't want to say anything bad about the guy becauseof the success we had with him, but, how hard can it be to say, "Throw it to Larry"? :)
 

splitsecond

ASFN Addict
Joined
Jan 16, 2009
Posts
5,582
Reaction score
1,536
Location
Chandler, AZ
Interesting. Maybe this has something to do with why Boldin became quiet so soon after Haley left...
 

joeshmo

Kangol Hat Aficionado
Joined
Feb 23, 2004
Posts
17,247
Reaction score
1
I like him less and less. A vet is curious about where the franchise is going, and not only can't get the time of day from the organization, but is insulted in the HALLWAY before they even make it to the meeting room? Just sounds like Haley's being a douchebag to set a precedence for being a douchebag.

Yep. Waters and Gonzalez are the heart and soul of that team and a good guy for the city. It would be like if Wiz wouldnt meet with Boldin when he first got here or told him the Cards stunk and Boldin was only one of the 22 that lead to a sucky team. Everyone here would be completely up in arms if that happened. If this was two years ago and we switched Boldins name in with Waters, people would be going nuts about how much of a jerk the coach and GM are. We would get chants of "how can you not give the heart and soul of the team the time of day."
 

DeAnna

Just A Face in The Crowd
Joined
Jun 13, 2002
Posts
7,284
Reaction score
769
Location
Goodyear, AZ
Interesting. Maybe this has something to do with why Boldin became quiet so soon after Haley left...

Yep. Who do you think was bad-mouthing him at the Pro Bowl? Fitz actually thanked Haley for making him a better player, and Warner is too classy to bad mouth anyone. So, by process of elimination ...
 

Ryanwb

ASFN IDOL
BANNED BY MODERATORS
Joined
May 13, 2002
Posts
35,576
Reaction score
6
Location
Mesa
Maybe I'm a little old school... If you want to know where the franchise is headed, you show up for meetings and camp and figure it out. The coach isn't paid to stroke egos, he's there to win football games. There is too much entitlement in sports now-a-days.
 

Mulli

...
Supporting Member
Joined
Jul 16, 2004
Posts
52,529
Reaction score
4,603
Location
Generational
Maybe I'm a little old school... If you want to know where the franchise is headed, you show up for meetings and camp and figure it out. The coach isn't paid to stroke egos, he's there to win football games. There is too much entitlement in sports now-a-days.
I tend to agree. I thank there is a lot of truth to what Haley told him. I am thinking Herm Edwards, and Vermeil before him probably hugged and kissed the players, and that is what got them in the position they are in, maybe.
 

WildBB

Yogi n da Bear
Joined
Mar 20, 2004
Posts
14,295
Reaction score
1,239
Location
The Sonoran Jungle - West
Yep. Who do you think was bad-mouthing him at the Pro Bowl? Fitz actually thanked Haley for making him a better player, and Warner is too classy to bad mouth anyone. So, by process of elimination ...
Bad mouthing?! As far as I heard he just gave his side of the story on why he got so angry on the sidelines.
 

splitsecond

ASFN Addict
Joined
Jan 16, 2009
Posts
5,582
Reaction score
1,536
Location
Chandler, AZ
Yep. Waters and Gonzalez are the heart and soul of that team and a good guy for the city. It would be like if Wiz wouldnt meet with Boldin when he first got here or told him the Cards stunk and Boldin was only one of the 22 that lead to a sucky team. Everyone here would be completely up in arms if that happened. If this was two years ago and we switched Boldins name in with Waters, people would be going nuts about how much of a jerk the coach and GM are. We would get chants of "how can you not give the heart and soul of the team the time of day."

This

Yep. Who do you think was bad-mouthing him at the Pro Bowl? Fitz actually thanked Haley for making him a better player, and Warner is too classy to bad mouth anyone. So, by process of elimination ...

Well, it is possible that everyone handled him differently. Fitz is a pretty low key guy by nature, so if Haley was an arrogant prick, he may have just let it slide, or used it to improve himself. Warner was supposedly great friends with Haley, but I think if in the end Haley did something that rubbed him the wrong way or snubbed his team mates, Warner is going to back his team mates.

Maybe I'm a little old school... If you want to know where the franchise is headed, you show up for meetings and camp and figure it out. The coach isn't paid to stroke egos, he's there to win football games. There is too much entitlement in sports now-a-days.

Who says he was asking for his ego to be stroked? Maybe he was trying to take a proactive role in leading the team in the rebuild?
 

Mulli

...
Supporting Member
Joined
Jul 16, 2004
Posts
52,529
Reaction score
4,603
Location
Generational
Heaven forbid a boss tells an employee something that hurts the employee's feelings.
 

Renz

An Army of One
Joined
May 10, 2003
Posts
13,078
Reaction score
2
Location
lat: 35.231 lon: -111.550
This ain't the Sixties and Haley ain't Lombardi, or even Bill Belichick for that matter. Maybe he should win a game as a head coach before he starts alienating all his players.
 

earthsci

That Rapscallion!!
LEGACY MEMBER
Joined
May 13, 2002
Posts
8,300
Reaction score
1
Location
Phoenix
Heaven forbid a boss tells an employee something that hurts the employee's feelings.

Yeah, I can see where alienating a guy who is a 4 time Pro-Bowler, dedicated to the organization, a locker room leader, committed to charities and a finalist for the NFL’s 2008 Man of the Year Award would be a good move. Who the hell is he to be asking the GM for A MEETING?




Oh yeah - :sarcasm:
 

Mulli

...
Supporting Member
Joined
Jul 16, 2004
Posts
52,529
Reaction score
4,603
Location
Generational
Yeah, I can see where alienating a guy who is a 4 time Pro-Bowler, dedicated to the organization, a locker room leader, committed to charities and a finalist for the NFL’s 2008 Man of the Year Award would be a good move. Who the hell is he to be asking the GM for A MEETING?




Oh yeah - :sarcasm:
2-14 with him. 2-14 without. :)
 

Redbird 78

Newbie
Joined
Mar 3, 2009
Posts
26
Reaction score
0
Yeah, I can see where alienating a guy who is a 4 time Pro-Bowler, dedicated to the organization, a locker room leader, committed to charities and a finalist for the NFL’s 2008 Man of the Year Award would be a good move. Who the hell is he to be asking the GM for A MEETING?




Oh yeah - :sarcasm:

Waters might be great at his job, but his job description doesn't involve setting or consulting on the team's direction. Apparently, he didn't like it when that was explained to him.
 

Skkorpion

Grey haired old Bird
LEGACY MEMBER
Supporting Member
Joined
May 9, 2002
Posts
11,026
Reaction score
5
Location
Sun City, AZ
This ain't the Sixties and Haley ain't Lombardi, or even Bill Belichick for that matter. Maybe he should win a game as a head coach before he starts alienating all his players.

Damn right. Tom Couglan and Chucky were wrong and should give back their SB rings for being too hard on their players. And Whisenhunt is an idiot for alienating Boldin and Edge and Leinart.

I'm not making fun of you, Renz, only pointing out that there are many ways to coach and win. And Haley has not alienated all his players. That's hyperbole. So far, two players are upset.

As far as angering his QB? Ever watched the Andy Reid - McNabb two-step? The Holmgren anger fits at his players, especially his QBs? Parcells vs Simms befor Bill had ever won a game? And so on and so on.
 
Top