US against England today at Soldier Field

[Stout]

Should be quite a good game, as I think the teams are very well matched. I'm not sure what the lineups are going to look like, but it's the 10th team in the world (US) versus the 6th team in the world (England). Let's get it on!

 

[Stout]

What a tough one. Neither team put out their top-flight lineup, and rightly so, as it's a meaningless game. The US defense looked spotty at times, and England took advantage. The US offense was HUGE, and dominated for long stretches, but couldn't put it away like England could. I mean, Calamity James was AWEFUL in net for England, and we only tallied one against him. England had absolutely no ability to maintain possession, and we had no ability to finish. We had defensive lapses, and they had passing lapses. Overall an entertaining game, because it was so loosely played. Eh, nothing too bad and some positives to carrying into the next qualifying game. Bring on Costa Rica!

 

[ASUCHRIS]

We need some finishers on this team, we should have scored at least 3-4 goals...very sloppy play by the English.

 

[Stout]

We need some finishers on this team, we should have scored at least 3-4 goals...very sloppy play by the English.

We do have some finishers, but Johnson was a precautionary holdout, I don't know where Ching was, McBride wasn't one of the culprits, and Donovan doesn't usually miss like that. Still, we need the team to play up to its level. I think we're one of the best teams in the world, but we need to learn how to play like it still. I don't expect us to win the World Cup this time around, but we'll be ready by 2010.

 

[Zeno]

The midfield wasn't the usual midfield. I think a healthy John O'Brien is our best midfield player, he should be back next weekend for qualifying. Missing players like Reyna, Beasley, Mastroeni, O'Brien etc hurts. Dempsey isn't ready, even though he scored today, he was way too soft and I don't know of one physical challenge he met and won. Ralston was just terrible.

I didn't understand why Bocanegra didn't start on defense from the get go--maybe it was a fitness issue. Cherundulo played well for the most part but his crosses need some serious work. Pope didn't play a good match and Gibbs needs some experience before he can be relied on.

McBride at this point in his career is strictly an off the bench guy. I am assuming had Johnson been 100% McBride wouldn't have played.

For once I would like to see a completely fit and healthy US team take the pitch.

 

[ASUCHRIS]

I really like Bocanegra as well, I think he is also pretty good at knowing when to attack as well...he'll be a good one.

 

[Stout]

I didn't understand why Bocanegra didn't start on defense from the get go--maybe it was a fitness issue. Cherundulo played well for the most part but his crosses need some serious work. Pope didn't play a good match and Gibbs needs some experience before he can be relied on.

Well, it simply would have made no sense to start all of our top guys...this is a useless international friendly, and we have a World Cup qualifying game next Saturday. I could give two shakes if Bocanegra wasn't even on the bench today. Bruce wanted to evaluate certain players, and rest certain players, that's all.

 

[SouthNZoneFan]

We took a beating from their "D" team guys. This was horrible, but I do know that we still have another huge game in a few days...

 

[Stout]

We took a beating from their "D" team guys. This was horrible, but I do know that we still have another huge game in a few days...

Well, a beating? Not quite. Like someone else said, our guys didn't finish. If they do, we win maybe 5-2, because our offense DOMINATED for large stretches of the game.

Oh, and we had quite a few 'D' team guys out there.

 

[English on tour]

and as for 'D team' more like 'F team'

 

[Zeno]

England is a better side period. Their scrubs are better than our scrubs and their starters are better than ours. We just have no world class finishers like Rooney or Owen unfortunately.

In fact that might be the true of all parts of the US in that we have no single player outside of our goalkeepers who is currently considered world class. Donovan couldn't hack it overseas--a huge disappointment, Bocanegra was relegated to the bench for his club team, Beasley doesn't always start(but he does produce for Eindhoven)--he may be our current best chance, McBride is a spot starter/bench player, Reyna plays when healthy(which is rare) but he is far from world class, O'Brien was close as he contributed heavily as a regular in Ajax's lineup before persistent injuries forced them to replace him...being an MLS star does nothing, MLS is likely the equivelant of the first division English club team(isn't it called the Coca Cola Championship league or something?) and that might be generous.

This team will get better as there is a young and promising future but something is obviously missing in American players development. I'd love to see an American start at Striker for one of the super clubs in the world but that doesn't look to be on the horizon.

 

[Stout]

Eddie Johnson is a stud that knows EXACTLY how to finish. Brian Ching seems to have a nose for the goal, but it's far too early to tell. And we have a young man named Adu coming along nicely. Donovan and Beasley will be great leaders and midfielders for us in the years to come. Bocanegra is a stalwart US defender.

Just because players don't do well overseas does not mean we cannot be a great team. As long as they are able to do what the team needs, and play well together, we WILL be great. We're currently #10 in the world, and that's nothing to sneeze at. Are we great yet? No, of course not. I think we'll advance and do well in the next World Cup, but we're not a threat to take it. We WILL take it in 2010. Bank on it.

 

[CaptTurbo]

England is a better side period. Their scrubs are better than our scrubs and their starters are better than ours. We just have no world class finishers like Rooney or Owen unfortunately.

In fact that might be the true of all parts of the US in that we have no single player outside of our goalkeepers who is currently considered world class. Donovan couldn't hack it overseas--a huge disappointment, Bocanegra was relegated to the bench for his club team, Beasley doesn't always start(but he does produce for Eindhoven)--he may be our current best chance, McBride is a spot starter/bench player, Reyna plays when healthy(which is rare) but he is far from world class, O'Brien was close as he contributed heavily as a regular in Ajax's lineup before persistent injuries forced them to replace him...being an MLS star does nothing, MLS is likely the equivelant of the first division English club team(isn't it called the Coca Cola Championship league or something?) and that might be generous.

This team will get better as there is a young and promising future but something is obviously missing in American players development. I'd love to see an American start at Striker for one of the super clubs in the world but that doesn't look to be on the horizon.

What about Freddie? please tell me he will be at the world cup.

 

[Stout]

What about Freddie? please tell me he will be at the world cup.

Not this one. I guarantee he'll be at the next one. He's still only 16 or 17 right now.

 

[Zeno]

Eddie Johnson is a stud that knows EXACTLY how to finish. Brian Ching seems to have a nose for the goal, but it's far too early to tell. And we have a young man named Adu coming along nicely. Donovan and Beasley will be great leaders and midfielders for us in the years to come. Bocanegra is a stalwart US defender.

Just because players don't do well overseas does not mean we cannot be a great team. As long as they are able to do what the team needs, and play well together, we WILL be great. We're currently #10 in the world, and that's nothing to sneeze at. Are we great yet? No, of course not. I think we'll advance and do well in the next World Cup, but we're not a threat to take it. We WILL take it in 2010. Bank on it.

Johnson will get his chance overseas very soon, I agree he may be something special and he looks great against the other teams in our federation but until he proves it against the best competition I just have to wait and see. As for Ching so he can finish in MLS whoopee. Prove it to me against a higher level of competition. We've seen plenty of players score consistently in MLS only to not be a factor in the US national team...Jason Kreis, Ante Razov(and I like Razov) and one player whose name I forget was an All American at Virginia played at DC and Tampa (black guy).

I absolutely believe that if a US field player cannot produce consistently in the best leagues the world has to offer--EPL, Serie A, Bundesliga, Spanish Primera etc etc that we will never be any higher than top 10. The fact that the best leagues are overseas are unfortunate.

Donovan to me is a player who showed he does not have what it takes mentally or physically to get it done, he is a good international player but not as gifted as I once thought he was. MLS is about his appropriate level, he was just awful with Leverkusen...if you saw the game against Liverpool you'd understand.

I like Bocanegra but he still needs to be consistent.

Beasley is another matter, he is probably our best international field player right now. He needs to get a little stronger but I fully expect him to be a regular in Eindhoven next season.

With Adu I will take a wait and see approach. Let him develop in the US until he is 18 and then let him go compete in a real league. I doubt he'll play in WC 2006 at 16 years old. He isn't exactly dominating MLS and as a 15 yr old I really wouldn't expect him to.

The US is taking the right approach to developing young talent, and yes I'd rather see our guys play in MLS than rot on a reserve team in Europe. We still lack that special talent though, I don't see how you can deny that.

 

[Stout]

Johnson will get his chance overseas very soon, I agree he may be something special and he looks great against the other teams in our federation but until he proves it against the best competition I just have to wait and see. As for Ching so he can finish in MLS whoopee. Prove it to me against a higher level of competition. We've seen plenty of players score consistently in MLS only to not be a factor in the US national team...Jason Kreis, Ante Razov(and I like Razov) and one player whose name I forget was an All American at Virginia played at DC and Tampa (black guy).

I absolutely believe that if a US field player cannot produce consistently in the best leagues the world has to offer--EPL, Serie A, Bundesliga, Spanish Primera etc etc that we will never be any higher than top 10. The fact that the best leagues are overseas are unfortunate.

Donovan to me is a player who showed he does not have what it takes mentally or physically to get it done, he is a good international player but not as gifted as I once thought he was. MLS is about his appropriate level, he was just awful with Leverkusen...if you saw the game against Liverpool you'd understand.

I like Bocanegra but he still needs to be consistent.

Beasley is another matter, he is probably our best international field player right now. He needs to get a little stronger but I fully expect him to be a regular in Eindhoven next season.

With Adu I will take a wait and see approach. Let him develop in the US until he is 18 and then let him go compete in a real league. I doubt he'll play in WC 2006 at 16 years old. He isn't exactly dominating MLS and as a 15 yr old I really wouldn't expect him to.

The US is taking the right approach to developing young talent, and yes I'd rather see our guys play in MLS than rot on a reserve team in Europe. We still lack that special talent though, I don't see how you can deny that.

On a lot of the MLS stuff, I agree. You don't see Twellmen out there doing much, do you? As far as Ching, I wasn't talking about in the MLS. I don't follow MLS so I couldn't tell you what he was doing. He's shown a few flashes on the International level, and can at least be a good reserve striker. We'll see how he shapes up.

I have to disagree with you as to the US needing top-talent playing overseas to be a great international soccer club. Look at what Greece did at the Euros, against many of the best countries in the world. How did they do it? Teamwork. Every player doing exactly what the team needed them to do. We're a far, FAR more quality side than the Greeks (and that is a huge understatement). If we can come together well as a team, we'll advance again, and possibly advance deep into WC 2006. With the crop of youngsters developing, we'll compete for the cup in 2010. Bank on it.

I have to vehemently disagree about Donovan. He isn't on the decline. He's a top-notch player for us. Is he a top player in the world? No, of course not. Is he as bad as his stint in Germany? Not even close. He should never have consented to playing in the Bundesliga. The German style of play doesn't match his at all. He'd play fairly well in the EPL, I'd wager, and probably do very well in the Dutch league. He'll be a major factor for the US.

Man, Zeno, you don't have much faith in US soccer, do ya?

 

[Zeno]

I have to vehemently disagree about Donovan. He isn't on the decline. He's a top-notch player for us. Is he a top player in the world? No, of course not. Is he as bad as his stint in Germany? Not even close. He should never have consented to playing in the Bundesliga. The German style of play doesn't match his at all. He'd play fairly well in the EPL, I'd wager, and probably do very well in the Dutch league. He'll be a major factor for the US.

Man, Zeno, you don't have much faith in US soccer, do ya?

Donovan would be a miserable failure in the EPL, he isn't nearly physical enough to hold up to the demands there. In an anonymous poll of MLS coaches I saw at some point during last season Donovan was considered one of the softest players in the league--which foretold his lack of success in Germany. I am willing to concede though that the Dutch or even Italian style is more suited to his play...still in those countries he'd be no more than a role player and likely wouldn't see the field on a top team.

I love US soccer, I buy in to the system(heck I am PART of the system--I have attended and participate in a lot of US Soccer and National Soccer Coaches Association coaching courses--I develop young soccer players) but the quality of top level talent isn't there yet. A lot of that is due to the fact that the top athletic talent in the US doesn't always aspire to be soccer players unlike many other countries across the world.

The reason the Greeks succeeded in Euro 2004 is that they introduced a system of play that hasn't been seen in international soccer in years. They played such a withdrawn defense with very little style or flair in the attack. They were outplayed in the final by Portugal(well at least in the second half) but they made their first corner kick count, they were simply outstanding on set-pieces the entire tournament. The Greeks also have one of the best coaches in international soccer and I think that is often overlooked.

I think 2006 will be a tough road because of the age of the players...some are past their prime(Reyna, McBride, Pope) and others aren't there yet (Beasley, Adu, Gaven, Spector, Johnson).

2010 could be a special year, especially as our players develop and get a chance to play against higher level competition.

I still believe we are the class of our Federation but we'd struggle to qualify out of Europe or South America. We just aren't at that level yet.

 

[Stout]

Donovan would be a miserable failure in the EPL, he isn't nearly physical enough to hold up to the demands there. In an anonymous poll of MLS coaches I saw at some point during last season Donovan was considered one of the softest players in the league--which foretold his lack of success in Germany. I am willing to concede though that the Dutch or even Italian style is more suited to his play...still in those countries he'd be no more than a role player and likely wouldn't see the field on a top team.

I love US soccer, I buy in to the system(heck I am PART of the system--I have attended and participate in a lot of US Soccer and National Soccer Coaches Association coaching courses--I develop young soccer players) but the quality of top level talent isn't there yet. A lot of that is due to the fact that the top athletic talent in the US doesn't always aspire to be soccer players unlike many other countries across the world.

The reason the Greeks succeeded in Euro 2004 is that they introduced a system of play that hasn't been seen in international soccer in years. They played such a withdrawn defense with very little style or flair in the attack. They were outplayed in the final by Portugal(well at least in the second half) but they made their first corner kick count, they were simply outstanding on set-pieces the entire tournament. The Greeks also have one of the best coaches in international soccer and I think that is often overlooked.

I think 2006 will be a tough road because of the age of the players...some are past their prime(Reyna, McBride, Pope) and others aren't there yet (Beasley, Adu, Gaven, Spector, Johnson).

2010 could be a special year, especially as our players develop and get a chance to play against higher level competition.

I still believe we are the class of our Federation but we'd struggle to qualify out of Europe or South America. We just aren't at that level yet.

I can see your point on Donovan possibly being too soft for the EPL, but that doesn't mean he wouldn't succeed. He has the speed to make up for it. Look at how well Craig Bellamy, a notoriously soft player, did in the EPL.

Ah, who knows? Hopefully the new crop will lead us to the Cup, and hopefully we have a good run this time around.