USC gets another verbal from an 8th grader

[Russ Smith]

I guess I can't complain too much since both UCLA(Taylor King) and UA(Nic Wise) did it before but for the 2nd straight year USC got a verbal from an 8th grader. Last year it was Dwayne Polee Jr. this year PG Ryan Boatwright from Illinois.

Apparently the kid attended the USC skills camp and to the shock of his dad, Floyd offered him a scholarship and he accepted. Obviously it's not binding it's years before the kid can sign an LOI, but it is interesting.

I never liked it when UCLA did it with King and wasnt' surprised at all he didn't wind up at UCLA. Apparently the guys on PTI were just trashing Tim Floyd over it today and I know Dan Patrick called him on it too, I guess since he's done it twice he's now the poster boy for it.

I don't get it 13-14 year old kids are so tough to project I don't get why schools feel they need to get in so early but it appears this is a trend that's not going to go away.

Ryan Boatwright, class of 2011, just seems like a slippery slope to me but I guess as long as it's not binding it's not necessarily a bad thing?

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

It's all part of the game unfortunately. If a few coaches put their foot down and and stopped then plenty of ther colleagues would gladly take their place. And if all coaches were barred from recruiting pre-HS kids then AAU coaches, HS coaches, or other mentors with close ties to programs would pick up the slack.

I can only think of three players Arizona offered pre-HS: Nic Wise, Jerryd Bayless, and Matt Carlino and two are already Wildcats and the last has a pretty good shot at being one too. It's probably better that college coaches out there influencing kids than the questionable characters that would take their place.

 

[1usctrojan]

I guess I can't complain too much since both UCLA(Taylor King) and UA(Nic Wise) did it before but for the 2nd straight year USC got a verbal from an 8th grader. Last year it was Dwayne Polee Jr. this year PG Ryan Boatwright from Illinois.

Apparently the kid attended the USC skills camp and to the shock of his dad, Floyd offered him a scholarship and he accepted. Obviously it's not binding it's years before the kid can sign an LOI, but it is interesting.

I never liked it when UCLA did it with King and wasnt' surprised at all he didn't wind up at UCLA. Apparently the guys on PTI were just trashing Tim Floyd over it today and I know Dan Patrick called him on it too, I guess since he's done it twice he's now the poster boy for it.

I don't get it 13-14 year old kids are so tough to project I don't get why schools feel they need to get in so early but it appears this is a trend that's not going to go away.

Ryan Boatwright, class of 2011, just seems like a slippery slope to me but I guess as long as it's not binding it's not necessarily a bad thing?

I think you are being kind Russ......I think it is absurd.

 

[Russ Smith]

It's all part of the game unfortunately. If a few coaches put their foot down and and stopped then plenty of ther colleagues would gladly take their place. And if all coaches were barred from recruiting pre-HS kids then AAU coaches, HS coaches, or other mentors with close ties to programs would pick up the slack.

I can only think of three players Arizona offered pre-HS: Nic Wise, Jerryd Bayless, and Matt Carlino and two are already Wildcats and the last has a pretty good shot at being one too. It's probably better that college coaches out there influencing kids than the questionable characters that would take their place.

Yeah I don't think its going to ruin the game or anything I just think it's stricly a PR thing. I think the kids love getting their name out there early, and the coaches see it as a chance to get some press too. I know that was the case with Taylor King, Howland had just taken over, King was the #1 rated player in his class(this years incoming freshmen class), his dad is an egomaniac who wanted his sons name out there so Howland offered and they accepted.

Few years later it became clear King wasn't a Howland style player, wanted the freedom to shoot when he felt like it which was not going to be given to him at UCLA, so he de-committed and wound up at Duke, he's nowhere near a top 25 kid now although still a good player.

As long as both sides realize how far off it is and accept things are probably going to change it's not a big deal, I just see it as a PR move. I just hope the kids understand this, on a Bruin board someone posted the top 50 for the class of 2011(Boatwright not on it) and you've got all these 5'4" kids because you forget these are 13-14 year olds.

Just afraid the obvious escalation will be 7th graders committing.

 

[Gaddabout]

If USC wants to offer 8th graders, I say let them have their pick. I'd rather compete for the real players that start blossoming in their junior and senior years. That 8th grader is more likely to fall off his game while his peers have to work harder to gain interest. I'll take the kid that grows 6 inches between his freshman and junior years and develops a shooting stroke.

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

If USC wants to offer 8th graders, I say let them have their pick. I'd rather compete for the real players that start blossoming in their junior and senior years. That 8th grader is more likely to fall off his game while his peers have to work harder to gain interest. I'll take the kid that grows 6 inches between his freshman and junior years and develops a shooting stroke.

Spoken like a fan of a school who gets laughed out of such recruitments. You're telling me that you wouldn't want LeBron James or Greg Oden because Schea Cotton and Jaron Rush bombed out a few years ago? Like all recruiting, there's hits and misses but the reality of today's college hoops is if you don't recruit middle schoolers you're going to miss out on a few phenoms. Not all impact players wait until late in high school to develop.

 

[Gaddabout]

Spoken like a fan of a school who gets laughed out of such recruitments. You're telling me that you wouldn't want LeBron James or Greg Oden because Schea Cotton and Jaron Rush bombed out a few years ago? Like all recruiting, there's hits and misses but the reality of today's college hoops is if you don't recruit middle schoolers you're going to miss out on a few phenoms. Not all impact players wait until late in high school to develop.

Considering LeBron never went to college, no, I'd regret trying to stick with that commitment. Ohio State got a national championship, good for them, but they're paying the price for all the talent they recruited. Even if they recover, they have to fear taking a hit in scholarships for all the early exits.

If this is the direction of college basketball, the number of recruits that "slip through the cracks" will only increase. Just look at James Harden. No one would have wanted him as an 8th grader.

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

Yeah, Ohio State is in real trouble. I mean how are they ever going to recover from being a national runner-up and landing back-to-back-to back elite classes to the point where a Top 50 player in Luke Babbitt decommitted for fear of lack of playing time? And if Stern had ruled a couple years before on the age limit then Bron would've led whatever school he chose to a Top 10 ranking at the very least.

And feel free to rattle off all the James Harden's, Chase Budinger's, and Darren Collison's you want; but just know that I can name off plenty of Stephon Marbury's, Greg Oden's, and Carmelo Anthony's who have just as much of an impact on collegiate programs. I can also name plenty of late risers like Mustafa Shakur who went on to be terrible collegiate players.

 

[Skkorpion]

I don't care who does what in recruiting. Each school and coach would be allowed to do anything they wanted, if I were king. It doesn't matter.

I'd abolish the NCAA if I could.

 

[Russ Smith]

Kind of ironic given this thread about Floyd recruiting middle schoolers.

On a UCLA board a guy correctly pointed out the following regarding USC.
If we assume their entire recruiting class qualifies, they will have the YOUNGEST team in the Pac 10 in terms of class(number of frosh, sophs, juniors and seniors) and the OLDEST team in the conference in terms of age.

Maybe that's why Floyd is after so many 8th graders, wants to lower the average age?

 

[LVCARDFREAK]

I guess I can't complain too much since both UCLA(Taylor King) and UA(Nic Wise) did it before but for the 2nd straight year USC got a verbal from an 8th grader. Last year it was Dwayne Polee Jr. this year PG Ryan Boatwright from Illinois.

Apparently the kid attended the USC skills camp and to the shock of his dad, Floyd offered him a scholarship and he accepted. Obviously it's not binding it's years before the kid can sign an LOI, but it is interesting.

I never liked it when UCLA did it with King and wasnt' surprised at all he didn't wind up at UCLA. Apparently the guys on PTI were just trashing Tim Floyd over it today and I know Dan Patrick called him on it too, I guess since he's done it twice he's now the poster boy for it.

I don't get it 13-14 year old kids are so tough to project I don't get why schools feel they need to get in so early but it appears this is a trend that's not going to go away.

Ryan Boatwright, class of 2011, just seems like a slippery slope to me but I guess as long as it's not binding it's not necessarily a bad thing?

Wow..classy!

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

If this is the direction of college basketball, the number of recruits that "slip through the cracks" will only increase. Just look at James Harden. No one would have wanted him as an 8th grader.

Care to change that opinion after Sendek just offered two 8th graders?

http://www.eastvalleytribune.com/story/92216#

 

[Russ Smith]

Care to change that opinion after Sendek just offered two 8th graders?

http://www.eastvalleytribune.com/story/92216#

I actually like that article because it seems like both kids parents realize it's too early to be accepting.

Wonder if Johnson has his dads vertical, Joey Johnson couldn't play much but he could jump like you can't believe, one of the best leapers I ever saw.

 

[Russ Smith]

FYI Pat Forde wrote a story on the Boatwright verbal with some interesting stuff. Boatwright himself told Forde he met with Tim Floyd in the hotel across the street from USC and that's where he accepted the offer, his dad says the meeting took place in Floyd's on campus office. Apparently his dad knows the rules better since Forde points out the distinction is very important. It's against NCAA rules to have an off campus meeting with a recruit prior to his senior year of HS. He says in talking to USC's compliance department they dispute that it's off campus since they used the hotel(the radisson) to house players for the USC skills camp, they consider it to be part of campus until it's determined otherwise. So it's conceivable if the NCAA disagrees, they'd be barred from recruiting Boatwright.

Also the mother admitted when they got off the plane after flying home they were stunned to find stories about his commitment all over the internet, they hadnt' told anybody, and they knew it was against NCAA rules for USC to publicize it, so they assumed someone at USC had leaked it to a person who covers recruiting and they broke the story. Forde said it's a very commonly broken rule, everyone does it. I gotta admit I didn't even know it was a rule, these verbal commits break so quickly these days it's the norm.

Given the bad PR this one got I'm guessing there's going to be a rules change proposal in the near future addressing this one, either make it legal since everyone does it, or start enforcing the rule. I always thought it was legal once the kid is a junior in HS but Forde implied it's not legal until it's an actual signed LOI.

 

[Gaddabout]

Given the bad PR this one got I'm guessing there's going to be a rules change proposal in the near future addressing this one, either make it legal since everyone does it, or start enforcing the rule. I always thought it was legal once the kid is a junior in HS but Forde implied it's not legal until it's an actual signed LOI.

What Forde implied is the rule, and the NCAA takes it very seriously. If you're a reporter covering college football and basketball, that rule is the primary reason the reporters that get those kind of scoops are the kinds that have a good rapport with the players. The players usually know as much as the coaches in recruiting (sometimes more, because they're hosting the players and probably get more personal than the coaches) and players aren't prohibited from talking.

An eighth-grader isn't going to have a current player as a host, though, so it was probably an assistant who leaked it.

 

[Mulli]

So instead of University of Spoiled Children, USC stands for University of Secondary school Children?

Sorry, Matt Leinart. Only kidding.

 

[Russ Smith]

What Forde implied is the rule, and the NCAA takes it very seriously. If you're a reporter covering college football and basketball, that rule is the primary reason the reporters that get those kind of scoops are the kinds that have a good rapport with the players. The players usually know as much as the coaches in recruiting (sometimes more, because they're hosting the players and probably get more personal than the coaches) and players aren't prohibited from talking.

An eighth-grader isn't going to have a current player as a host, though, so it was probably an assistant who leaked it.

He was at a skills camp so there weren't any hosts, the players were together at the hotel, he was the only one not in HS. I agree it likely was an assistant, like every other school these days USC has "recruiting analysts" who follow them and have their own website(USChoops is one) that reports on this. So it's easy to tip off that guy and let him run the story. What made this unique is the player and his family contend they told nobody, so it had to be USC since the offer occurred in private.

Boatwrights dad says Ryan will be the 5th member of the family to get a D1 scholarship so he's quite familiar with rules, which I suspect is why Forde pointed out in his article that Boatwright said it was off campus, but his dad said it was in Floyd's office on campus. The dad knows the rule and Forde clearly wanted to point out the kid didn't know the rule and that's why he admitted the possible violation.

The tone of the story is really clear that Forde detests the idea of players that young committing, I think he quite clearly pointed out the possible rules violations because of his personal stance on signing guys that young.