Vince Young story getting bizarre

[D-Dogg]

I dunno Donald. I think you're being a bit extreme... Like I said, the QB position gets far too much glory and far too much condemnation for wins and losses... More than any other professional sport, football is the ultimate team endeavor.
However, as I also said, no other position actually touches and controls the ball more than the QB. Doesn't mean he is soley responsible for Wins or Losses. We agree there. I'm just not so sure W/L record is the biggest misleading stat in all of football...

Rex Grossman- 19-11 record as a starter.

 

[Rivercard]

Not an NFL caliber QB. PERIOD!

Have you seen some of the stiffs on NFL rosters? Young is more talented with more potential upside than most, but not as good as many.

 

[D-Dogg]

You stated opinion...no facts.

Much more than you did.

Here's a fact for you to chew on. Rex Grossman - 19-11 as a starter.

 

[Russ Smith]

I agree that the QB Win/Loss record can be misleading, however, I'm not sure it's the biggest misleading stat for a QB. Remember, the QB touches the ball on every offensive play.
That said, the QB always gets WAY too much credit for the W's, and WAY too much criticism for the losses...

So does the C though so that's misleading too.

 

[abomb]

 

[82CardsGrad]

So does the C though so that's misleading too.

Touche'!!!!!

You must be registered for see images

 

[cardsfanmd]

Rex Grossman- 19-11 record as a starter.

I can beat that one. Trent Dilfer has a SB ring.

 

[Rivercard]

So does the C though so that's misleading too.

Don't forget about the man who probably has the biggest influence that touches the ball on every play..... the Ref!

 

[dreamcastrocks]

It must be those shirtless tequila & sausage parties.

You must be registered for see images

You must be registered for see images

He is chugging a bottle of Patron?

Hardcore.

 

[Mulli]

The kid next to him loves him tenderly.

 

[Redheart]

The kid next to him loves him tenderly.

LOL! Quite the look, hey?

 

[Duckjake]

Key stat from Sunday. Vince Young one rush for 4 yards. What were the Titans thinking when they drafted him? That he played four years for Texas Tech?

I still wonder a lot at how dumb many NFL coaches are. Let him run you idiots. He's getting hurt more staying in the pocket than he did running. For goodness sake the guy is 6'4" and 245 and runs like the wind and you want him pretending to be Eli Manning? Nuts. No wonder the guy's freaking out.

 

[Russ Smith]

Key stat from Sunday. Vince Young one rush for 4 yards. What were the Titans thinking when they drafted him? That he played four years for Texas Tech?

I still wonder a lot at how dumb many NFL coaches are. Let him run you idiots. He's getting hurt more staying in the pocket than he did running. For goodness sake the guy is 6'4" and 245 and runs like the wind and you want him pretending to be Eli Manning? Nuts. No wonder the guy's freaking out.

I think theyr'e slowly trying to get Vince to play more from the pocket but he's not done well at it.

For the game Sunday both his picks were from the pocket and just horrible, and the injury happened when they rolled him out of the pocket in a run pass option and he got hit throwing on the run.

I hope the guy is ok but I don't think his lack of progress is on the coaches I just don't think he is developing in the pocket, they knew he wasn't a pocket passer when they picked him but they expected he'd get better at that, he really hasn't.

 

[Duckjake]

I think theyr'e slowly trying to get Vince to play more from the pocket but he's not done well at it.

For the game Sunday both his picks were from the pocket and just horrible, and the injury happened when they rolled him out of the pocket in a run pass option and he got hit throwing on the run.

I hope the guy is ok but I don't think his lack of progress is on the coaches I just don't think he is developing in the pocket, they knew he wasn't a pocket passer when they picked him but they expected he'd get better at that, he really hasn't.

That's what really surprised me about the way the Titans have tried to use Young. What made him great was that he was a threat to go 80 for a TD at anytime if you blitzed him. Now they have him sitting in the pocket like he was Vinny Testaverde. To get the most out of VY you had to have an offense where you opened up running lanes for him or forced defenses to use guys to spy him freeing up your receivers and running backs. That hasn't happened and I don't get it.

But considering the dumb draft moves the cards and many others have made over the years I can see the Titans taking him thinking they could turn him into Trent Green.

Amazing that guys can make millions being total goofs like NFL coaches and front office personnel can.

 

[Russ Smith]

That's what really surprised me about the way the Titans have tried to use Young. What made him great was that he was a threat to go 80 for a TD at anytime if you blitzed him. Now they have him sitting in the pocket like he was Vinny Testaverde. To get the most out of VY you had to have an offense where you opened up running lanes for him or forced defenses to use guys to spy him freeing up your receivers. That hasn't happened and I don't get it.

But considering the dumb draft moves the cards and many others have made over the years I can see the Titans taking him thinking they could turn him into Trent Green.

Amazing that guys can make millions being total goofs like NFL coaches and front office personnel can.

Well I'll try to find it for you but there was an article I read about Norm Chow recently talking about the QB situation at UCLA now. Lost the starter and the backup and had to choose between a Juco and a redshirt freshman who was a lot like Young(Forcier) a running QB. Chow was very polite he didn't throw Young under the bus or anything but he basically said that the way we want to play right now really requires very quick reads and the ball coming out really fast(because their OL stinks) and Forcier hasn't learned yet he can't outrun the defense in college like he did in HS. He holds the ball too long.

It was quite clear in the article that he was also talking about Vince Young and the offense he designed around young in the NFL, that Young never got the importance of the ball coming out quickly and the result was often him running around trying to "make plays" when the play had worked, Vince just didn't throw the ball.

Chow was quite polite but it was clear he really struggled with getting Vince to do what he was supposed to do.

 

[Duckjake]

Chow was quite polite but it was clear he really struggled with getting Vince to do what he was supposed to do.

But was what Chow wanted Young to do what Young was good at doing? That's what I'm wondering because after his rookie season VY quit running and his QB play has gone progressively downhill ever since. I still think the Titans strangely enough are trying to fit a square peg in a round hole. If they wanted a pocket passer they should have drafted Leinart or Cutler.

Sadly I think they drafted a guy who could sell jerseys instead.

 

[Russ Smith]

But was what Chow wanted Young to do what Young was good at doing? That's what I'm wondering because after his rookie season VY quit running and his QB play has gone progressively downhill ever since. I still think the Titans strangely enough are trying to fit a square peg in a round hole. If they wanted a pocket passer they should have drafted Leinart or Cutler.

Sadly I think they drafted a guy who could sell jerseys instead.

I don't see them play that much but I would mention that Vince actually ran more last year than his rookie year, in the same amount of games and very similar amount of pass attempts. his completion % went up quite a bit 2nd year but he threw a whole lot more picks and less TD's.

I never did believe that Chow wanted Young though but I do think he tried to put Vince in a system he could run. The problem is you can't function in the NFL with the system they ran at Texas.

FYI Vince's YPC went from 6.7 to 4.2 rookie year to last year! I don't see them much but I have to wonder if the NFL didn't just adjust to Vince as opposed to the Titans making him change?

I hope he is ok and does well I loved him at Texas, I'm just not convinced he'll ever be a productive enough passer in the NFL.

 

[Duckjake]

I don't see them play that much but I would mention that Vince actually ran more last year than his rookie year, in the same amount of games and very similar amount of pass attempts. his completion % went up quite a bit 2nd year but he threw a whole lot more picks and less TD's.

I never did believe that Chow wanted Young though but I do think he tried to put Vince in a system he could run. The problem is you can't function in the NFL with the system they ran at Texas.

FYI Vince's YPC went from 6.7 to 4.2 rookie year to last year! I don't see them much but I have to wonder if the NFL didn't just adjust to Vince as opposed to the Titans making him change?

I hope he is ok and does well I loved him at Texas, I'm just not convinced he'll ever be a productive enough passer in the NFL.

I watch them every week and Vince was hesitating looking for the pass where as during his rookie season he just took off. The hesitation gave the D time to adjust and stop him.

 

[TJ]

This combined with his depressed state in the offseason, saying he couldnt take the pressure and was considering retiring, tells me he has some deep seeded issues. Sounds like mild schizophrenia to me.

 

[Skkorpion]

The NFL is tough. Fisher once nurtured another young, black, underdeveloped QB in Steve McNair, who also was a good runner. Fisher didn't suddenly become clueless.

Vince Young is well along the road of showing he doesn't have the mental and physical toughness to play in this league. Signs Matt Leinart is showing as well. And neither guy was adequately prepared by his college coach.

The Texas playbook probably had about 6 plays in it and Pete Caroll coddles his players.

I liked Young a lot but have changed my mind and am pleased we have Leinart instead. Matt, with far fewer games experience, set back by injuries, at least has a chance to make it. His improved work ethic is real and he's no dummy. Vince Young may be lacking in both respects.

 

[Skkorpion]

This combined with his depressed state in the offseason, saying he couldnt take the pressure and was considering retiring, tells me he has some deep seeded issues. Sounds like mild schizophrenia to me.

Sounds to me like he's incapable of playing in this league and knows it.

 

[Russ Smith]

Sounds to me like he's incapable of playing in this league and knows it.

Certainly possible although you'd think for many of these guys they'd be happy knowing they made a lot of money before they got exposed?

I think Young is a highly competitive guy who as Skorp said may be coming to the realization I'm not going to be able to dominate games in the NFL the way I did USC in that last game of my college career?

That has to be really tough for elite athletes to suddenly realize they might not be good enough for the next level.

I hope the guy is ok we've had enough tragic situations in sports to last my lifetime if Vince is depressed I hope he gets help. If it's all a big misunderstanding I hope he comes back and plays his way into the Pro Bowl.

 

[conraddobler]

I was never caught up in the Vince Young love fest and was terrified we'd end up with him at one point but he did so well his last year he took that out of play.

Matt is orders of magnitude better for the pro game and even that isn't a lock he'll be good.

I hope he will.

 

[cardsfanmd]

Duck and Skorp,

I dont have the drive to quote them all, but your guys posts have been very spot on IMO. Good stuff.

 

[Lorenzo]

I feel for the guy. I think he has a lot of potential if he works hard to improve. the good news is he plays on a team that helps him win games and they work well together. he is still a young QB and needs to keep his head on straight and realize that the NFL is a brutal league. if he keeps his head up he can get back out there. but if he wants to retire that's a whole different issue. I think he might have had retirement in the back of his mind, but I think he wants to play in the NFL. It just isn't coming easy to him like the other levels did. He needs to realize that's the case with most players and not be afraid of the challenge.