What happened to Isaiah Simmons?

[BritCard]

Kliff does seem too deferential to Vance.

Ultimately though this is a Keim issue. Vance is Vance and Kliff's never been a winner even in college so he's just learning on the fly. Not a knock against Kliff as I think he can get it done, but 2nd year HC Kliff wont have the command as 6th year HC Kliff.

We're not so loaded defensively for this guy NOT to see the field in a meaningful way.

To be fair, Vance has said a few times that Kliff is the HC and he is the DC. There's no HC of the defense type deal going on.

It seems to be a choice by Kliff not to be involved on that side, although granted it is hard to tell. We don't see behind closed doors and we very rarely see what's happening on the sidelines.

But as far as I'm concerned Kliff is the HC, and he's responsible for both sides.

 

[WisconsinCard]

I've seen an article saying Campbell wants top ILB money and after this year we will let him go rather than overpay him and that we are grooming Simmons to replace Campbell at ILB.

Optimistic view? We've seen Vance drop Simmons back into a safety position before. Maybe hes waiting for Simmons to master the basics of his defense before using him more creatively.
Even I can't believe this. I think Vance trusts the system over players and doesnt recognize individual players strengths and weaknesses.

Ok if all that were true and that is truly the plan then why not get the kid in when winning handedly over the jets. If you have a guy you have no intention of retaining then perfect opportunity for you to get a look at the future and make sure that that is a good plan?

I'm not sure SK looks that far down the road. Not sure he has a two year plan much less a five year plan.

 

[cardsfanmd]

You don’t use the 8th pick on depth.

Lol. You also don’t bank on rookies being immediate contributors. You fill your holes in free agency so you can take BPA in the draft and let the chips fall where they may. You already know this though. Sorry it didn’t fit your narrative on this particular subject.

 

[cardsfanmd]

But that’s kind of my point. If you’re keim and you know you’ve got your two starting ILBs, and you know Vance isn’t creative enough to properly maximize a unique “eraser” then taking that guy is the wrong pick. And I’m still excited about him . . . as long as we don’t keep Vance long enough to ruin him. But even if Vance ruins him, the facts point to keim making a bad decision drafting him with the 8th pick if he had no chance at stardom (combo blocked path at position and poorly matched coach).

I can get behind that.

 

[SoonerLou]

what a joke

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[Snoopdog323]

The answer is simple. Keim drafted another B-U-S-T

 

[SoonerLou]

lol at Keim

Said once getting Hopkins he no longer really considered going offense. Noted how Hopkins is leading the league in receiving.

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I dont care that he went defense. However, lets not use BOB stupidity as a reason to pat yourself on the back and ignore offense.

I'd rather he say Simmons was the best player on his board and thats what he went with.

 

[Chopper0080]

The answer is simple. Keim drafted another B-U-S-T

I think this is extreme, but I don't believe Vance Joseph will ever be the type of DC who gets the most out of a player like Isaiah Simmons.

 

[BritCard]

The answer is simple. Keim drafted another B-U-S-T

Keim drafted yet another square peg for a round hole

One day he'll draft an actual linebacker to play linebacker. (not really)

 

[FB94]

You don’t use the 8th pick on depth.

I liked the Simmons pick, but jump ahead to present circumstances, I am worried just a bit about it. If we knew VJ would slow play this kid, we would have been better off drafting a different player that could actually, you now, get on the field.

 

[TaylorSwift]

I think this is extreme, but I don't believe Vance Joseph will ever be the type of DC who gets the most out of a player like Isaiah Simmons.

Vance Joseph and Kiem are tied at the hip here.

I wouldnt as a GM draft any player that my coaches dont want or cant tell me explicitly how they plan to use him in the scheme.

I dont believe VJ was high on Simmons, because of his versatile. Vance has the mind a dinosaur and believes you need to have a position or play a shoehorned rile.

Ok, I disagree, but its fine.

Kiem should have been aware of this and steer away from those sort of players because he doesnt have the coaches for them.

The fact that they drafted a guy as the 8th highest pick in the NFL draft and they cannot play him consistent minutes in his 5 NFL start is indicative of incompetence straight from the GM.

Especially when they have a pattern of this sort of decision making



Granted, I dont like the idea of hiring coaches who prioritize their scheme over players.

Reads lack of forward thinking and nuance.

 

[WisconsinCard]

Vance Joseph and Kiem are tied at the hip here.

I wouldnt as a GM draft any player that my coaches dont want or cant tell me explicitly how they plan to use him in the scheme.

I dont believe VJ was high on Simmons, because of his versatile. Vance has the mind a dinosaur and believes you need to have a position or play a shoehorned rile.

Ok, I disagree, but its fine.

Kiem should have been aware of this and steer away from those sort of players because he doesnt have the coaches for them.

The fact that they drafted a guy as the 8th highest pick in the NFL draft and they cannot play him consistent minutes in his 5 NFL start is indicative of incompetence straight from the GM.

Especially when they have a pattern of this sort of decision making



Granted, I dont like the idea of hiring coaches who prioritize their scheme over players.

Reads lack of forward thinking and nuance.

I have say I was in the let's give it some time because if the strange off season. But I am coming around to your way of thinking. I mean your making a convincing argument. And I'm not happy about it....

 

[Timm Rosenbach]

Keim drafted yet another square peg for a round hole

One day he'll draft an actual linebacker to play linebacker. (not really)

I was disgusted with the Bucannon and Reddick picks. I still support the Simmons pick. It was the right move. Best player available at a position of need. Either Vance Joseph is unable to coach him or Simmons was a college fluke. I hope it is the former. That can be fixed. I still support the selection

 

[TaylorSwift]

I have say I was in the let's give it some time because if the strange off season. But I am coming around to your way of thinking. I mean your making a convincing argument. And I'm not happy about it....

I wish it wasnt so.

Misses like these can stack up and set a team back.

I feel bad for the kid, sucks being drafted to a situation where your talents cant be fully utilized due to incompetence on both ends.

I think he can play, but he needs to be playing SS(in this 3-4 scheme). Put him in space and allow his athleticism to flourish.

Personally I think he is a 4-3 will lb who could be a lot like lavonte david of the bucs

 

[AZman5103]

Simmons does not have to go down the "bad pick" road. Even if some want to argue that we drafted another tweener type trying to make him into an ILB...it is far too early to call that a done deal. The bottom line is that the kid is a special athlete, with very good production on a winning program. He could be an all pro SS. So if he isn't working out at ILB, then make the change and let him get on the field.

Buccanon could have been a very good safety. Reddick could have been a good OLB....if we just would have put them there and let them improve. Our problem is that we kept them in a position where they were I'll suited for years. If Simmons can't cut it at ILB, then put him a SS and see if we have the next Jamal Adams or Derwin James

 

[cardcrazy]

Simmons is another Deone Buchanan Hassan Reddick Type player.
Another tweener that can’t find a true position.
I would like to see him at Safety!
ala Adrian Wilson. He is similar sized and would compliment Budda nicely!

 

[Timm Rosenbach]

Simmons is another Deone Buchanan Hassan Reddick Type player.
Another tweener that can’t find a true position.
I would like to see him at Safety!
ala Adrian Wilson. He is similar sized and would compliment Budda nicely!

It is going to take a different defensive coordinator to do it but I believe it is possible. I worry about Simmons confidence. This season must be brutal on him: Kylie Fitts is outplaying Simmons. That says it all

 

[AZman5103]

Simmons is another Deone Buchanan Hassan Reddick Type player.
Another tweener that can’t find a true position.
I would like to see him at Safety!
ala Adrian Wilson. He is similar sized and would compliment Budda nicely!

He may be, but he doesnt need to share their fate. He is only 5 games into his career. If we had moved Reddick to OLB after 5 games and left him alone, he is probably be pretty good by now.

Put Simmons at SS...even if its because of injuries at Safety. It will probably be his most natural position.

 

[Rohinaz]

We shouldn't draft tweeners in general. That said, I think Simmons will be a dominant player for us. But if you want a MLB draft a mlb. If you want a 34 mlb, take one from a 34 college system. It's more predictable.
Patrick queen was drafted at the end of the first round, played mlb in a 34 at LSU and same in Baltimore.
He has 43 tackles, 2 sacks, 1 pass defended, 2 forced fumbles and 2 fumblel recoveries.

In fairnes Simmons lack of playing time is likely more related to campbells playing well.



Sent from my SM-G988U using Tapatalk

 

[WindCardinal]

Shaq Thompson from Carolina is a similar player (Simmons is 4 inches taller and about 10 pounds heavier). But it also took him a while to get the hang of it, and he’s been lights out this year. At least trying to find a silver lining to all this

 

[Tacticool Nerd]

At this moment with the limited snaps Simmons have had this season so far I want to place the blame on VJ. With Campbell playing well he should find ways to get them both on the field on the same time.

 

[BritCard]

The truth his Simmons has been bad when he plays, so he isn't playing.

But he's been bad because he's not a linebacker and they are trying to get him to play down at the LOS which isn't his thing. Considering our starting SS has been out for 5 games it would have been a good time to play Simmons at his natural position.

 

[juza76]

At this moment with the limited snaps Simmons have had this season so far I want to place the blame on VJ. With Campbell playing well he should find ways to get them both on the field on the same time.

Right and I want to add, Hicks performances this season put him in the bottom of the nfl

 

[Minski]

The truth his Simmons has been bad when he plays, so he isn't playing.

But he's been bad because he's not a linebacker and they are trying to get him to play down at the LOS which isn't his thing. Considering our starting SS has been out for 5 games it would have been a good time to play Simmons at his natural position.

wow. Dont stray from your narrative. I dont think anyone can call him bad when he plays either, we have hardly seen him play

 

[BritCard]

wow. Dont stray from your narrative. I dont think anyone can call him bad when he plays either, we have hardly seen him play

What narrative? That he's not an inside linebacker? That's not a narrative, that's a fact. He played about a handful of snaps at true ILB down around the LOS in college and they were his worse snaps. All his snaps at linebacker were at weakside in a 4-3, which we don't play and he had a very specific role either covering a TE or slot receiver or spying/rushing the QB.

He gave up 2 touchdowns in his first 12 snaps. He has a PFF grade of 38.2 (Im not saying PFF are right but they aren't 30 points wrong). So yes, he has been bad when he plays but it's not his fault because they are asking him to do things he simply doesn't have the instincts for. It's Reddick all over again. Every snap happens in the blink of an eye and if you have to think about what you should be doing it's already too late.

You can have one of two things. He is a natural linebacker and he's just not playing because Vance/P2 etc are all wrong or he's not a natural linebacker and he's been bad because we are using him wrong.

If you want to say he's a linebacker and he's just this bad then we are really screwed.