What happened to Isaiah Simmons?

[AZCrazy]

His career is 120 minutes old. They got lucky with Campbell, so they're not rushing him. Fine.
The hundreds or thousands of practice snaps he'd have had in May, June, July, and August, he had "zero" of.
They had him in the first game and he was a step slow in diagnosing Mostert's catch, and he gave up a five yard pass, that Mostert shot like a missile into 75 yards. They're easing him along and I'm not worried.

As far as what his natural position should be, I hope they create one that simply is "Tight End Destroyer". Have him glued to the TE all game every game and it'll be amazing. Everyone else can be managed by the other ten guys.

 

[CardNots]

nothing happened to Simmons, he’ll play when he is the best option at any position

it could be my comment is inappropriate as the more I read this thread I thought maybe it’s a “Simmons is a bust” or “Our GM sucks at his job” thread. if so, so sorry

 

[FB94]

Can we all calm down about Simmons until we are more than half way through the season. Heck it may take until the last few games of the year to see a comfort factor with him. If we are knee deep into year two and he still struggles, then it’s a combination of VJ, defense scheme, and Simmons all intertwined that his holding him back.

 

[Proximo]

For those who think I am crazy...

Deone Bucannon never demanded to play ILB. He was never reported as not being a hard worker. He never said, draft me in round 1. It's not his fault that he was over-drafted and not put in a position to be successful. That is on the team.

Haason Reddick is the exact same thing. I have never been a Reddick fan, but it has never been an effort issue with him. Everything that has been shared has been that he is doing what he can to fit the role he has been given.

Andy Isabella. Dude couldn't get off press at the Senior Bowl, was an inefficient route runner and has tiny hands. He didn't get asked to move outside. He did what he was told and, shockingly *sarcasm*, he struggled.

Byron Murphy is very similar. They drafted dude to play the slot and instead of getting a vet to play outside and protect him, they moved him outside and fed him to the wolves. That is what happens when you put players in positions to fail.

Someone tell me how the treatment of Isaiah Simmons to date is any different from these situations other than that he is more athletically talented than these other players. This is what a flawed process looks like.

The difference is Simmons legit played 5 positions in college including ILB. He should be fine there - and anyone suggesting otherwise is just being ridiculous because the sample size to judge him is way way to small at this point.

 

[Proximo]

Isabella was a roster construction and scouting mistake. Of course Kliff loved him as a prospect, he does a lot of things Kliff likes. The issue was that if you accurately scouted Isabella, he has to play in the slot. We already have Kirk and Fitz who play in the slot and you aren't going to take established players and put them in situations where they are less impactful, so Isabella didn't have a place to play that used his strengths. As a GM, you need to tell your HC that the prospect is solid, but the role is not. Let's get a guy who plays best outside so Kirk and Fitz can do those great things inside.

With Reddick...sorry coach, I know you love this guy but he is too small to play outside and too inexperienced to play inside. Let's trade back if we really want him or take someone who fits our scheme better.

Murphy...let's sign a free agent to play outside so we can focus on keeping this guy to the role we drafted him for.

Deonne...either I know we need an ILB but this guy is a safety OR I know we need a S but this guy struggles in space so we will need to play him at LB.

We are an absolute crap show at identifying players to fit roles or having plans on how to adjust our scheme to fit what THEY do best.

Isabella does not have to play in the slot. In fact in college he barely ever played in the slot.

PFF had him as about their highest rated receiver but specifically said they weren't sure if he would play outside or the slot. Before the draft they said it would probably take him a little time to learn how to beat jams at the NFL level.

I really don't understand the Isabella hate - he has taken advantage of nearly every opportunity he has been given. It's not like he is out there dropping balls - he just hasn't gotten many thrown to him up to this point.

 

[Chopper0080]

I'm not worried yet. I think they need to find a "joker" role for him. Let him play out in space like a S/LB hybrid that he is.

I'd also like to see him subbing out as a OLB. Give him some of the snaps that Fitts would get.

The problem is that you need to draft him to play the joker role you have in your system. I dont know Vance has that role, and i am not confident he is willing to change his defense and build one into it.

Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk

 

[Chopper0080]

Isabella does not have to play in the slot. In fact in college he barely ever played in the slot.

PFF had him as about their highest rated receiver but specifically said they weren't sure if he would play outside or the slot. Before the draft they said it would probably take him a little time to learn how to beat jams at the NFL level.

I really don't understand the Isabella hate - he has taken advantage of nearly every opportunity he has been given. It's not like he is out there dropping balls - he just hasn't gotten many thrown to him up to this point.

Isabella cant play outside in the NFL. How he won outside in college does not translate to the NFL. It is not hate to say a limited player is limited.

Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk

 

[Chopper0080]

Can we all calm down about Simmons until we are more than half way through the season. Heck it may take until the last few games of the year to see a comfort factor with him. If we are knee deep into year two and he still struggles, then it’s a combination of VJ, defense scheme, and Simmons all intertwined that his holding him back.

People made this same arguement for Reddick and i made it for Rosen. How did those turn out?

Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk

 

[Chopper0080]

His career is 120 minutes old. They got lucky with Campbell, so they're not rushing him. Fine.
The hundreds or thousands of practice snaps he'd have had in May, June, July, and August, he had "zero" of.
They had him in the first game and he was a step slow in diagnosing Mostert's catch, and he gave up a five yard pass, that Mostert shot like a missile into 75 yards. They're easing him along and I'm not worried.

As far as what his natural position should be, I hope they create one that simply is "Tight End Destroyer". Have him glued to the TE all game every game and it'll be amazing. Everyone else can be managed by the other ten guys.

It is amazing that people arent concerned that they drafted a super athlete hyb4id player to fill a role that Devondre Campbell can fill easily. Like getting a Ferrari to win a race that limits max speed to 65 mph.

Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk

 

[FB94]

People made this same arguement for Reddick and i made it for Rosen. How did those turn out?

Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk

Reddick had how many c

People made this same arguement for Reddick and i made it for Rosen. How did those turn


How many coordinators has he had over five years, and I believe a new one three straight years before VJ. Was he played out of position probably, maybe he finally found his way with a simplified roll. Rosen never did anything for me even in college. Not crying over spilled milk with him. As far as Simmons I will be patient and give him this year and a real off season. It’s ludicrous to start bust talk after two games with ZERO preparation that a normal offseason and preseason brings. Move on

 

[TaylorSwift]

For those who think I am crazy...

Deone Bucannon never demanded to play ILB. He was never reported as not being a hard worker. He never said, draft me in round 1. It's not his fault that he was over-drafted and not put in a position to be successful. That is on the team.

Haason Reddick is the exact same thing. I have never been a Reddick fan, but it has never been an effort issue with him. Everything that has been shared has been that he is doing what he can to fit the role he has been given.

Andy Isabella. Dude couldn't get off press at the Senior Bowl, was an inefficient route runner and has tiny hands. He didn't get asked to move outside. He did what he was told and, shockingly *sarcasm*, he struggled.

Byron Murphy is very similar. They drafted dude to play the slot and instead of getting a vet to play outside and protect him, they moved him outside and fed him to the wolves. That is what happens when you put players in positions to fail.

Someone tell me how the treatment of Isaiah Simmons to date is any different from these situations other than that he is more athletically talented than these other players. This is what a flawed process looks like.

/thread

 

[Chopper0080]

Reddick had how many c

Again...where have I called Simmons a bust...stop trying to move the conversation to something I have never said.

 

[FB94]

If this was next year then the Simmons talk may have some merit to it. Very little but some.

 

[Chopper0080]

If this was next year then the Simmons talk may have some merit to it. Very little but some.

You don't need to wait until next year to assert that the Cardinals have botched his integration into the defense either by a lack of a plan or the failure in executing it.

 

[JosiahLee]

Dammit! Simmons will be fine. He's a rook with no camp or preseason at all, and he has the actual benefit of playing behind Devondre Campbell, who's been playing out of his mind the first two weeks. Our best defender right now.

I say if we re-sign Campbell and he keeps dominating, make Simmons and Baker your safeties and with Peterson and Kirkpatrick as your corners, that's a serious secondary.

While I’m no where close to hitting the panic button...The only problem I have with the whole, “he had no preseason” logic is that this is true of every other rookie around the league who is already making an impact. We even have other rookies on our own team like Rashad Lawrence who seem to be ahead of the curve.

 

[gimpy]

Well, I don't know whether you've said it or not (but, apparently you think some people do), but, maybe some think you've implied it, then? Maybe? I don't know, just wondering.

Maybe you've become the new Solar7? With your analysis.

 

[BigRedRage]

There is a reason you never heard about him in camp. He's still learning.

Sent from my motorola edge plus using Tapatalk

 

[Zeno]

Except that no one is...

Umm this is a direct quote from one of the posters on this thread...

"This was one of the worst performances I have seen by a LB in NFL history and I'm pretty confident Simmons' first round status is the only thing keeping him in the team right now."

If that isn't calling someone a bust I don't know what is.

 

[CardsSunsDbacks]

Again...where have I called Simmons a bust...stop trying to move the conversation to something I have never said.

The whole tone of this thread leans in the direction of calling him a bust. It may not be your intent, but that is what it feels like.

I mean you are already lumping him in with guys that were essentially busts and using it to point to an organizational failure.

 

[TruColor]

I just have this feeling that Campbell has been so much better than they anticipated, and it's keeping Simmons on the bench inadvertently. So - let him sit and learn and not rush him in.

 

[Chopper0080]

Umm this is a direct quote from one of the posters on this thread...

"This was one of the worst performances I have seen by a LB in NFL history and I'm pretty confident Simmons' first round status is the only thing keeping him in the team right now."

If that isn't calling someone a bust I don't know what is.

I don't know that I am ready to reference Cards4theBowl and 29 posts as a driving force of opinion on this board or even a thread. If it was BigRedRage, I think that makes a difference.

 

[Chopper0080]

I just have this feeling that Campbell has been so much better than they anticipated, and it's keeping Simmons on the bench inadvertently. So - let him sit and learn and not rush him in.

Again, why did we draft Simmons for a role that DeVondre Campbell can fill so well it keeps Simmons on the bench?

Also, how do we not figure that our "#1 target in free agency" may actually be a good player and then use the #8 pick on a guy to fill that same role?

Furthermore, once we accepted both of these things, how is there not something on our defense that 6'4 238 4.3 40 can do better than Reddick, Vallejo, and Fitts? We were sold all offseason how Simmons was the game changer we needed...and apparently all we needed was a castoff from a bad Falcons defense and an upgraded defensive line.

You all are really reaching for excuses here.

 

[Chopper0080]

The whole tone of this thread leans in the direction of calling him a bust. It may not be your intent, but that is what it feels like.

I mean you are already lumping him in with guys that were essentially busts and using it to point to an organizational failure.

I am not lumping him in, I am identifying similarities between Simmons situations and other rookies who were highly touted and struggled. The end point being our process when taking these types of players appears to be flawed.

 

[Zeno]

I don't know that I am ready to reference Cards4theBowl and 29 posts as a driving force of opinion on this board or even a thread. If it was BigRedRage, I think that makes a difference.

Did I say anything about that being a "driving force'? Did I call out anyone specifically? No on both counts. I said any calls of calling Simmons a bust are nonsense and I just gave you one example of someone calling him a bust (without using the word bust but heavily implying it).

I think you are being sensitive for some reason as I obviously wasn't talking about you or your posts.

 

[Chopper0080]

Well, I don't know whether you've said it or not (but, apparently you think some people do), but, maybe some think you've implied it, then? Maybe? I don't know, just wondering.

Maybe you've become the new Solar7? With your analysis.

25 snaps. Our uber-athletic and defense-changing athletic freak of an athlete who we took at #8 can't GET ON THE FIELD. We can't even discuss his level of play because he doesn't play.