What Q Has to Do

[Cheesebeef]

I'm sorry, but you can't call someone our most clutch player because he hit a few big shots in the regular season then vanished in the playoffs. A clutch player plays his best when it's the most important time. I would argue that Nash or Amare are more clutch, or more accurately, that by next year, Amare will likely be the most clutch on the team.

as much as I like Q and what he brought to the table this year as far as emotion, scrappiness and timely regular season shooting, I gotta agree. The monkier of "clutch" comes when the chips are down and when the chips were down the season, Q was nowhere to be found for the most part. Let's hope with some experience he can move his regular season grace under pressure into the playoffs, but as of now - clutch? I don't think so.

That being said, he's a perfectly paid role player for this club.

 

[JPlay]

Q struggled against Dallas and SA to get his points. Marion was basically shutdown against SA.

If you look at Qs numbers he still shot 39% from 3pt range during the playoffs.

His numbers were down against SA and turnovers up, but they shut down a lot of people.

Qs real contribution is that he's very versatile, he can score off the block, shoot three's, but his biggest asset is that he's an above average rebounder for a guard.

He's still very young and will grow as a player. He should not be traded by any means.

 

[JS22]

That might possibly be the worst Shawn Marion deal I've seen yet Yuck!

Joe

I agree! Why not just automatically put 15 more losses into the win / loss column next year and save ourselves the trouble?

 

[coloradosun]

The only way I would do the deal is if the Suns can sign SAR. SAR can balance out the loss of Marion, his career averages are 20 pts, 8 rebs. He is only a year and a half older than Marion. He has completed his big contract and if he could be signed for the MLE that would be the key. He could become our Robert Horry.

Ratliff will probably only need 20-25 minutes per game.

Anderson is a better ball handler than Q, and is just as efficent from 3pt. range. DA is also a career 85% FT that tells me he a pure shooter.

SAR could give quality minutes when Amare is on the bench not just occupy space like Hunter did. A small lineup of Amare, SAR, JJ1, JJ2 or Anderson and Nash could be a lot more effective than the current. SAR and JJ2 are better shooters than Q and Marion.

Again this is a deal than provides more cap flexibility than 5 long term contracts.

 

[Joe Mama]

Ratliff, Anderson, and I believe SAR are all injury prone. Shareef Abdur-Rahim team might be able to replace or even improve on Shawn Marion's numbers scoring and on the boards, but he is a terrible defender. I would probably rather have an undersized Shawn Marion guarding the league's power forwards than SAR.

I know I sound like a broken record, but the Phoenix Suns absolutely, positively will not trade Shawn Marion this summer. The chances they trade any of their starting five are slim to none. In fact if anybody is going to be traded I would say it's far more likely that it is JJ because of his free-agent status.

Joe Mama

 

[Chaplin]

I'm sorry, but you can't call someone our most clutch player because he hit a few big shots in the regular season then vanished in the playoffs. A clutch player plays his best when it's the most important time. I would argue that Nash or Amare are more clutch, or more accurately, that by next year, Amare will likely be the most clutch on the team.

You mean like Robert Horry, who makes a few big shots in the postseason but vanishes in the regular season?

 

[coloradosun]

I know I sound like a broken record, but the Phoenix Suns absolutely, positively will not trade Shawn Marion this summer. The chances they trade any of their starting five are slim to none. In fact if anybody is going to be traded I would say it's far more likely that it is JJ because of his free-agent status.

Joe Mama

I may sound like a broken record as well and say that JJ will not be traded, absolutely, positively.

Marion almost got traded last summer for T-Mac and the deal would have probably been done if JJ was not demanded by Orlando.

Marion is at his peak, JJ is still climbing the mountain.

 

[Joe Mama]

I may sound like a broken record as well and say that JJ will not be traded, absolutely, positively.

Marion almost got traded last summer for T-Mac and the deal would have probably been done if JJ was not demanded by Orlando.

Marion is at his peak, JJ is still climbing the mountain.

Yeah, Marion might have been on the trading block last summer, but the Phoenix Suns weren't coming off a 62 win season. He didn't do well against San Antonio in the playoffs, but he was an integral, important part of the team for the rest of the year. Again, he isn't going anywhere this summer. I'm never going to tell people what they can or can't post or should or shouldn't post, but you guys are just wasting your time with the Shawn Marion trade proposals right now. It's entirely possible he'll be back on the block around the trading deadline next year or next summer. He isn't going anywhere this summer though.

I don't think the Phoenix Suns want to trade JJ. However if he makes it very clear that he would rather go elsewhere they might be willing to make a deal, especially if he signs a max or near max offer. For example what if he signs a big offer sheet with Cleveland, and he and his agent make it very clear that they do not want the Phoenix Suns to match. I suppose the Suns could make a sign and trade deal. I'm not saying it's likely, but it's definitely more possible than Shawn Marion being traded this summer. Frankly it's more likely than Q getting traded also.

Joe Mama

 

[coloradosun]

Joe

Chad Ford reported this morning that some of the changes to the CBA are that the cap may go to 50M and max contracts will only be six years for players signing with their current team. Under that scenerio there is no way that the Suns do not match a max contract.

JJ or his agents have made no overtures that they are unsatisfied with their relations with the Suns. With Marion's role on the Suns being diminished it seems more likely he would be the one that may want to be traded. There has been frustration in his comments lately and even last summer he had to have a sit down meeting with Bryan to get to the bottom of some rumors. As I see it he had his chance to take a leadership role when Marbury and Penny got traded and when Amare went down with an injury, he did not step up and take control.

Q was an experiment that worked well, but I don't think it will again next season. We caught a break with the mess with the Lakers and the retooling of the Kings. Jackson will have an impact in LA and the Kings will probably remain competitive but not a great threat. We already have seen that we could have problems with the Warriors next year, they beat us 2 or 3 times last year. There is no way we duplicate 62 wins even with the current roster, that may come off as pessimistic but I am just trying to be realistic.

 

[fordronken]

Joe

Chad Ford reported this morning that some of the changes to the CBA are that the cap may go to 50M and max contracts will only be six years for players signing with their current team. Under that scenerio there is no way that the Suns do not match a max contract.

JJ or his agents have made no overtures that they are unsatisfied with their relations with the Suns. With Marion's role on the Suns being diminished it seems more likely he would be the one that may want to be traded. There has been frustration in his comments lately and even last summer he had to have a sit down meeting with Bryan to get to the bottom of some rumors. As I see it he had his chance to take a leadership role when Marbury and Penny got traded and when Amare went down with an injury, he did not step up and take control.

Q was an experiment that worked well, but I don't think it will again next season. We caught a break with the mess with the Lakers and the retooling of the Kings. Jackson will have an impact in LA and the Kings will probably remain competitive but not a great threat. We already have seen that we could have problems with the Warriors next year, they beat us 2 or 3 times last year. There is no way we duplicate 62 wins even with the current roster, that may come off as pessimistic but I am just trying to be realistic.

Or, we still are able to be the highest scoring team in the league, Amare and Joe play much better and we start developing some team defense and rebounding. I think that'd be good enough for 62 wins. The thing about a team like this, is it still trounces mediocre teams. That really helps the regular season record a lot.

 

[Chaplin]

Q was an experiment that worked well, but I don't think it will again next season. We caught a break with the mess with the Lakers and the retooling of the Kings. Jackson will have an impact in LA and the Kings will probably remain competitive but not a great threat. We already have seen that we could have problems with the Warriors next year, they beat us 2 or 3 times last year. There is no way we duplicate 62 wins even with the current roster, that may come off as pessimistic but I am just trying to be realistic.

You're reasoning is still flawed. Q was NOT an experiment, he was a BPA acquisition--and even you can't argue with that. My question would be IF we ended up getting a guy like SAR (or some other quality starter) and moved Q to the bench, would you still hate him so much?

The NBA isn't about catching "breaks". The demise of the Lakers and the Kings are not "breaks". It is normal evolution of a professional basketball franchise. Now, if both those teams were decimated by injuries (for the most part they weren't), then maybe you'd have a point. But we didn't catch any breaks from San Antonio, or Dallas, or even Seattle.

 

[Joe Mama]

Joe

Chad Ford reported this morning that some of the changes to the CBA are that the cap may go to 50M and max contracts will only be six years for players signing with their current team. Under that scenerio there is no way that the Suns do not match a max contract.

How does that have anything to do with whether they will match a maximum offer? If the salary cap increases to $50 million that means that a starting maximum salary would be even bigger than under the old CBA. I don't know why you think these changes to the CBA would change anything regarding Joe Johnson.

JJ or his agents have made no overtures that they are unsatisfied with their relations with the Suns. With Marion's role on the Suns being diminished it seems more likely he would be the one that may want to be traded. There has been frustration in his comments lately and even last summer he had to have a sit down meeting with Bryan to get to the bottom of some rumors. As I see it he had his chance to take a leadership role when Marbury and Penny got traded and when Amare went down with an injury, he did not step up and take control.

Of course JJ and/or his agent haven't said anything about the Phoenix Suns and his role at them. That could possibly make his value lower if he is seen as a squeaky wheel. Again, I'm not saying that this is necessarily going to happen. I just see it as a possibility. If he did want to go somewhere else you wouldn't hear anything about it until he and his agent have had a chance to talk to some of the other teams that might be interested.

How has Shawn Marion's role with the team been diminished? Up until the San Antonio series he was one of the most vital pieces to the team's success. He would have to put up quite a fuss to even get mentioned in serious trade talk this summer. I don't see it. Last year was arguably his best so far in his career. It's likely that going to be asked to play out of position less often next year which I'm sure he will like. I don't think he was as frustrated with his place on this team as he was with the recognition or lack thereof from the national media/coaches.

Q was an experiment that worked well, but I don't think it will again next season. We caught a break with the mess with the Lakers and the retooling of the Kings. Jackson will have an impact in LA and the Kings will probably remain competitive but not a great threat. We already have seen that we could have problems with the Warriors next year, they beat us 2 or 3 times last year. There is no way we duplicate 62 wins even with the current roster, that may come off as pessimistic but I am just trying to be realistic.

I'm not sure I would say that Q will be any better/worse or help any more/less next season. I really think they will throw some things into the offense to take advantage of his strengths in the low post. I also think he will work on his game a lot during the summer. I definitely agree with you regarding the win total next year. It's doubtful this team wins 60+ games again. It is going to be more difficult because the Lakers, Golden State, and a couple other teams should be improved. I'm not sure I see why that would affect Q's status on this team.

I just wrote in another post that I'm not shooting down these Q trade proposals because I necessarily disagree with the idea that the team would be better if he was traded. It's because I don't see it happening. They just signed him last summer. He's popular in the locker room, and he really wants to be here. I also don't think his trade value is very high right now.

Joe Mama

 

[fordronken]

You're reasoning is still flawed. Q was NOT an experiment, he was a BPA acquisition--and even you can't argue with that. My question would be IF we ended up getting a guy like SAR (or some other quality starter) and moved Q to the bench, would you still hate him so much?

The NBA isn't about catching "breaks". The demise of the Lakers and the Kings are not "breaks". It is normal evolution of a professional basketball franchise. Now, if both those teams were decimated by injuries (for the most part they weren't), then maybe you'd have a point. But we didn't catch any breaks from San Antonio, or Dallas, or even Seattle.

"Breaks" are a part of the game. Look at the old Pistons championships and this year's team's run to the finals. Look at the Eastern Conference. Look at the Spurs in 2000. I don't think there are many teams that did well without certain things working out in their favor.

And also, even if the Lakers hadn't had their injuries, we still would have beat the crap out of them.

 

[JPlay]

Q was definitely not an experiment. He had a great regular season and first round of the playoffs. He struggled with his shot in the last two series, but still put up descent numbers. He didn't step up his game but SA is a great defensive team. You can't discount all he did for the Suns during the regular season. He did have great numbers and broke the all-time 3 point total record for the Suns. Not to mention he's the reigning 3 point champion of the NBA. When he's hitting and getting key rebounds and charges he can make the Suns virtually impossible to beat. He's a big key to the Sun's turnaround.

It's purely speculation that Marion is dissatisfied with his role on the team because of one series. He made second team all-NBA and the all-star game, not to mention he's probably considered a top 3 SF in the league.

You don't break up the team with the best regular season record in the NBA. Especially one so young. You let them develop and get better while adding key pieces around them. We finally have a solid core of players and everyone wants to break them up. Who knows what kind of chemistry those players will bring. JJ was hurt most of the SA series, lets see what we can do with him at full strength and another year of experience.

 

[coloradosun]

You're reasoning is still flawed. Q was NOT an experiment, he was a BPA acquisition--and even you can't argue with that. My question would be IF we ended up getting a guy like SAR (or some other quality starter) and moved Q to the bench, would you still hate him so much?

The NBA isn't about catching "breaks". The demise of the Lakers and the Kings are not "breaks". It is normal evolution of a professional basketball franchise. Now, if both those teams were decimated by injuries (for the most part they weren't), then maybe you'd have a point. But we didn't catch any breaks from San Antonio, or Dallas, or even Seattle.

Shaq demanding a trade from LA is not a "break". That is one reason we could adjust our roster and become a "running team". It is not often when the MVP asks to be traded.

Again, I don't hate Q, I just think there are better alternatives. I was a fan of Q when he was a Clipper.

I don't remember a whole lot of people who thought Q would become a starter when he was signed, most everyone thought he would be coming off the bench, that's why I see it as an experiment.

We caught a huge break when Dallas let Nash sign with us, they made two trades to get a point guard and wasted a #5 pick on a guy that they thought would be his replacement.

 

[Joe Mama]

Q was definitely not an experiment. He had a great regular season and first round of the playoffs. He struggled with his shot in the last two series, but still put up descent numbers. He didn't step up his game but SA is a great defensive team. You can't discount all he did for the Suns during the regular season. He did have great numbers and broke the all-time 3 point total record for the Suns. Not to mention he's the reigning 3 point champion of the NBA. When he's hitting and getting key rebounds and charges he can make the Suns virtually impossible to beat. He's a big key to the Sun's turnaround.

It's purely speculation that Marion is dissatisfied with his role on the team because of one series. He made second team all-NBA and the all-star game, not to mention he's probably considered a top 3 SF in the league.

You don't break up the team with the best regular season record in the NBA. Especially one so young. You let them develop and get better while adding key pieces around them. We finally have a solid core of players and everyone wants to break them up. Who knows what kind of chemistry those players will bring. JJ was hurt most of the SA series, lets see what we can do with him at full strength and another year of experience.

A-freaking-men!

Joe

 

[F-Dog]

I think Q has room for improvement, if only because he came from the Clippers. Young players usually don't develop much while they're wearing a Clippers uniform.

The thing is, Q had a decent mid-range and post game with L.A., but when he got to Phoenix, he found that that part of his game wasn't strong enough or efficient enough to be incorporated into the Suns' attack. If he can improve those skills, he'll be a much more versatile player for the Suns. I hope he's working on it right now.

 

[coloradosun]

I think Q has room for improvement, if only because he came from the Clippers. Young players usually don't develop much while they're wearing a Clippers uniform.

The thing is, Q had a decent mid-range and post game with L.A., but when he got to Phoenix, he found that that part of his game wasn't strong enough or efficient enough to be incorporated into the Suns' attack. If he can improve those skills, he'll be a much more versatile player for the Suns. I hope he's working on it right now.

Q was posting up SG in LA, he now is posting up SF in Phoenix, that's why he was ineffective in the low post.

 

[elindholm]

I don't remember a whole lot of people who thought Q would become a starter when he was signed, most everyone thought he would be coming off the bench

You're right about that, but my guess is that D'Antoni was sold on the starting lineup as soon as they added Richardson. Almost no one here liked it (until it won 62 games), but I think it was the plan all along.

 

[coloradosun]

I don't remember a whole lot of people who thought Q would become a starter when he was signed, most everyone thought he would be coming off the bench

You're right about that, but my guess is that D'Antoni was sold on the starting lineup as soon as they added Richardson. Almost no one here liked it (until it won 62 games), but I think it was the plan all along.

D'A wanted to have his 5 best players on the court, at the start of the year there was absolutely no bench, even Bo came after the season started.

 

[JPlay]

Bo should have had more PT. He's a quality player in the league. I still don't think D'Antoni know how to use his bench effectively. Bo is a great rebounder and can block some shots..he's a high energy guy that we could have used in the season.

 

[coloradosun]

Not to mention he's the reigning 3 point champion of the NBA.

You don't break up the team with the best regular season record in the NBA. Especially one so young. You let them develop and get better while adding key pieces around them. We finally have a solid core of players and everyone wants to break them up. Who knows what kind of chemistry those players will bring. JJ was hurt most of the SA series, lets see what we can do with him at full strength and another year of experience.

He's the 3pt. champion because no one was guarding him and he did not have to take a dribble to create space.

Let's be realistic, Duncan missed 16 games last season and playing the odds the Spurs should have had the best record. Nash only missed 6 and the team fell apart, the reason was that they were too young.

The Suns will do their due diligence and add players that are compatable. Jim Jackson has always been labeled as a malcontent but he fit in very well.

 

[coloradosun]

Bo should have had more PT. He's a quality player in the league. I still don't think D'Antoni know how to use his bench effectively. Bo is a great rebounder and can block some shots..he's a high energy guy that we could have used in the season.

He was not a faceup player with a jumpshot, that is why he did not get much PT. You are right he is a high energy guy but not with the right skills for the offense.

 

[F-Dog]

Q was posting up SG in LA, he now is posting up SF in Phoenix, that's why he was ineffective in the low post.

Q was posting up Jason Terry in the Dallas series, without much success.

Throughout the year, the Suns didn't post up Q if he didn't have the advantage, but his FG% on two-point shots was still horrid (which is another reason I believe he's got room to improve).

 

[Chaz]

Q was posting up Jason Terry in the Dallas series, without much success.

Throughout the year, the Suns didn't post up Q if he didn't have the advantage, but his FG% on two-point shots was still horrid (which is another reason I believe he's got room to improve).

Suns in general seem to have a problem passing into the post (except maybe for Nash).

We had a hard time getting the ball to Amare guarded by Finley.

Too little practice I guess.