When does Harold Goodwin get held responsible for this O-Line mess?

[Lomax to Green 84]

When does Harold Goodwin start feeling the wrath from fans? He has been with the team for 5 years and is responsible for working with the o-linemen on technique and to even the casual fan it's obvious that we are terrible. I agree that the talent is subpar, but good coaching staffs find ways to make a unit at least functional.

 

[juza76]

its all about players execution

 

[JeffGollin]

When does Harold Goodwin start feeling the wrath from fans? He has been with the team for 5 years and is responsible for working with the o-linemen on technique and to even the casual fan it's obvious that we are terrible. I agree that the talent is subpar, but good coaching staffs find ways to make a unit at least functional.

Friday.

 

[sr7706]

No coaches take blame here! Hell, If I'm not mistaken BA has said Goodwin is a future HC.

 

[b8rtm8nn]

I'm not a Goodwin fan, but as an OLine coach, I haven't any complaints. It really does seem a personnel issue - as our two biggest acquisitions that we would be building around have declined greatly the last two years (JV and Iupati).

I think keeping backups based heavily on 'versatility' isn't the smartest move - that is what gives us Earl Watford for 4 years who excels at nothing except knowing all the positions = ok for finishing the game, does nothing for having someone capable to start in the wings.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Friday.

Lol... this might be my favorite post of yours ever.

Man, this team is so depressingly boring and bad. We need them to either be good or AWFUL and comically so. Footbalk season without ANY entertainment value, even if it's stuff that drives you hysterically crazy, just sucks.

 

[Finito]

It's not his fault Veldaheer is a shell, DJ is hurt, Iupati is always hurt. I mean you can only do so much with what you got.

 

[LoyaltyisaCurse]

Never, he's on Arians' staff, therefore it's always the players.

 

[oaken1]

I'm not a Goodwin fan, but as an OLine coach, I haven't any complaints. It really does seem a personnel issue - as our two biggest acquisitions that we would be building around have declined greatly the last two years (JV and Iupati).

I think keeping backups based heavily on 'versatility' isn't the smartest move - that is what gives us Earl Watford for 4 years who excels at nothing except knowing all the positions = ok for finishing the game, does nothing for having someone capable to start in the wings.

I dont think it is the players. guys get here,...then they get worse.a couple seasons back our guys looked good..well coached... but the last two seasons every one of the has gotten worse. even our rookies look better in their first game than they do in their third game

 

[Metcalf Rules]

its all about players execution

As John McKay once said about his hapless Tampa Bay Bucs execution, "I'm all for it!"

 

[Cheesebeef]

It's not his fault Veldaheer is a shell, DJ is hurt, Iupati is always hurt. I mean you can only do so much with what you got.

if you can't figure out how to block 3 guys with 5 or even 6 offensive linemen, that's a problem.

 

[Shaggy]

How can Goodwin be blamed for JV's horrible play? I get that they can be at fault because they never decided to help him out, but man, there were some plays were you looked he has never played football before and his arms were flopping all over the place on Lawrence, not once getting a good solid stick on him. Just looked bad.

 

[MadCardDisease]

I have an inside source that said when Cole Toner was picked up by the Bengals, he was really impressed. He basically said "I'm finally getting real coaching instead of just being yelled at" regarding OL coaching.

So it may be as bad as many of us fear regarding Harold Goodwin and his ability to actually coach up players on the OL.

 

[crisper57]

I dunno. 2 declining vets, one of which went to IR. His replacement gets injured.

Our LT was hurt 5 minutes into the season.

Our other Guard is really a Center.

Our Starting Center is really a backup Center.

We cut our depth on OL and are scrambling to pick guys off the trash heap.

This is bad luck and a Keim issue as much as a Goodwin issue, I think.

 

[AZCrazy]

Goodwin is not the GM
Not the HC
Not the OL coach
Not a player
Not responsible for injuries, or roster.

Goodwin is responsible for game plan and play calling to a degree.

 

[JeffGollin]

Dunno why the OL sucks.

Best reason I can come up with is that the front office and coaching staff has tried to short-cut its rebuilding by bringing in guys with fatal flaws in their techniques or chronic injuries they hope will go away.

Instead, Mr. Murphy has taken over the OL room...and anything that could go wrong...did.

Lesson learned: Overpay for quality and keep adding first rate OL personnel until - over time - the OL evolves into a powerhouse.

 

[wit3card]

I have an inside source that said when Cole Toner was picked up by the Bengals, he was really impressed. He basically said "I'm finally getting real coaching instead of just being yelled at" regarding OL coaching.

So it may be as bad as many of us fear regarding Harold Goodwin and his ability to actually coach up players on the OL.

Than it would be worse than we think. If Cole Toner said that ... our O-line can't get better at all. The Bengals O-line isn't the best to begin with ...

 

[Jetstream Green]

Than it would be worse than we think. If Cole Toner said that ... our O-line can't get better at all. The Bengals O-line isn't the best to begin with ...

Yup, he just might be equating being nice to good coaching and is not even considering the content of the tutelage

 

[TJ]

It's a Keim issue. He hasn't been able to bring in offensive linemen with talent and many of them are injury prone. Not only is the execution poor, but there's no chemistry amongst the group. Sometimes, pass rushers are coming in untouched, while a lineman goes to block no one.

 

[Jetstream Green]

It's a Keim issue. He hasn't been able to bring in offensive linemen with talent and many of them are injury prone. Not only is the execution poor, but there's no chemistry amongst the group. Sometimes, pass rushers are coming in untouched, while a lineman goes to block no one.

Well of course there is no chemistry... a collection of often injured guys in revolving slots

 

[wit3card]

Yup, he just might be equating being nice to good coaching and is not even considering the content of the tutelage

Or your coach is a choleric stubborn guy that can't teach or doesn't understand, that yelling at someone is in a sport only the last resort. If you yell at him during the training you will achieve little to nothing. You yell at him if he doesn't performe in the game. Or if you showed him 100 times the fundamentals and he is getting them still wrong, but else, what does yelling accomplish?

Are you learning faster if somone yells at you? Or did you ever see someone get faster learning if you yell at him in ajob for a longer periode of time? I didn't.

These "kids" are coming out of college and don't know the mechanics don't know how to train properly and so on, and yelling when they try to understand how, is really the last thing, you should do.

 

[Jetstream Green]

Or your coach is a choleric stubborn guy that can't teach or doesn't understand, that yelling at someone is in a sport only the last resort. If you yell at him during the training you will achieve little to nothing. You yell at him if he doesn't performe in the game. Or if you showed him 100 times the fundamentals and he is getting them still wrong, but else, what does yelling accomplish?

Are you learning faster if somone yells at you? Or did you ever see someone get faster learning if you yell at him in ajob for a longer periode of time? I didn't.

These "kids" are coming out of college and don't know the mechanics don't know how to train properly and so on, and yelling when they try to understand how, is really the last thing, you should do.

I do not think any coach just yells on the onset, though of course some yell more than others once they get revived up but I am sick and tired of all these fragile egos of young men who do not grow up and then wonder why people from a older generation treat them like little boys. But it really does not matter what we feel concerning Goodwin because we are not there, we have received none of his coaching and what one guy says also does not mean it is the consensus where a guy is looking for justification for moving to another team due to a lack of appreciation by his other employer. We know the problem though, bad OL drafting of often injured players because these guys already had some good coaching before they hit the NFL and technique is technique where the foundation is the same for the NFL as college

 

[Veer]

Boehm, Toner, Dorian Johnson were bust draft picks by Keim. DJ Humphries is a few missed games away from being labeled a bust. Iuapti and Veldher were excellent signings. Can't count on them to perform forever though. Next year we need one big FA OL signing at least and another high draft pick invested in OL.

 

[wit3card]

I do not think any coach just yells on the onset, though of course some yell more than others once they get revived up but I am sick and tired of all these fragile egos of young men who do not grow up and then wonder why people from a older generation treat them like little boys. But it really does not matter what we feel concerning Goodwin because we are not there, we have received none of his coaching and what one guy says also does not mean it is the consensus where a guy is looking for justification for moving to another team due to a lack of appreciation by his other employer. We know the problem though, bad OL drafting of often injured players because these guys already had some good coaching before they hit the NFL and technique is technique where the foundation is the same for the NFL as college

No is not, the technique is different. College today is rarley a 3 stance start, is rarley the same technique and from what I see, 20 years ago 5 star higschool players had better technique and fundamentals than nowadays top college players. Even BA says that the college spread offenses don't prepare O-line players for the NFL.

This is a problem, and if you don't have a great coach ... you will never field a great O-line.

BTW Valdeheer is 30 and Iupati also ... they aren't old, they got worse every year playing in Cardinal red ... that makes me think that this problem is not drafting ...

 

[GuernseyCard]

Boehm, Toner, Dorian Johnson were bust draft picks by Keim. DJ Humphries is a few missed games away from being labeled a bust. Iuapti and Veldher were excellent signings. Can't count on them to perform forever though. Next year we need one big FA OL signing at least and another high draft pick invested in OL.

Veldeer and Iupati are both 30 and in football parlance, hardly one step from the bone yard.