Where's Boldin?

[Assface]

I was in a scoring only fanatasy league a few years ago. My WR's would make a ton of catches only to get tackled at the 2, the 6, the 3 and then some fat guy would run for the ensuing TD. I finished next to last.

The next year I drafted all the fat guys and finished second. TD's by WR's might not be such a meaningful stat.

Yup. I'm more concerned about the guys who put the team in scoring position. Last week Edge had 115 yards and Shipp was the one with 3 touchdowns. I think well know which RB K9 would rather have. Hell, in 1998 Barry Sanders had less rushing Tds (3-6) than his backup, Tommy Vardell. I don't think anyone is going to knock Barry for his production.

 

[SECTION 11]

Best Receiver in the NFL!!!!!!!

Dude, you're really losing it.

 

[Duckjake]

Yup. I'm more concerned about the guys who put the team in scoring position. Last week Edge had 115 yards and Shipp was the one with 3 touchdowns. I think well know which RB K9 would rather have. Hell, in 1998 Barry Sanders had less rushing Tds (3-6) than his backup, Tommy Vardell. I don't think anyone is going to knock Barry for his production.

Cedric Benson has 5 Rushing TD's in only 98 carries. Tiki Barber has 1 in 269 carries.

Plaxico Burress has 9 TD receptions to Boldin's 4.

Anybody want to trade?

 

[kerouac9]

I was in a scoring only fanatasy league a few years ago. My WR's would make a ton of catches only to get tackled at the 2, the 6, the 3 and then some fat guy would run for the ensuing TD. I finished next to last.

The next year I drafted all the fat guys and finished second. TD's by WR's might not be such a meaningful stat.

I agree with you, but that's not to say that TDs are a meaningless stat. But I don't think that it should be discounted the way that a lot of people do on this board. It seems that TDs are discounted because Anquan doesn't get a lot of them, and that receptions are over-counted because he gets a ton of them.

Anquan's tied for 35th in the NFL in TDs with 4. That must not be an important statistic. Anquan's tied for 13th in the NFL in catches. That must be an important statistic. That doesn't make a lot of sense to me. Does he need to score 10 TDs every year for me to consider him elite? Of course not. But the other two guys tied for him for receptions both have 8 TDs; hard to say that there might be something amiss here, especially when the Arizona Cardinals don't have any of "the fat guys" that you're talking about.

The other stat that people seem to dismiss when it comes to Anquan is his average YPC. He's 39th in the NFL in catch average. Yes, there are some outliers in that category (Bryant Johnson is in the Top 5), but he's averaging less YPC than Donald Driver. Three less YPC than Roy Williams. Among the top 10 receiving yards leaders in the NFL, only two guys have lower averages than Anquan's 13.8: Andre Johnson (11.5) and Terrell Owens (13.5). And Owens has 9 TDs. Among the Top 10 yardage leaders, Anquan's second to last in terms of 20+ yard plays (14) beind Lee Evans with 9.

Again: I think that Anquan Boldin is a very, very good wide receiver in the NFL, but I don't think that for the elite talents, the real Top 10 guys for whom you have to make an argument to keep out of the Pro Bowl, you have to cherry pick stats and make excuses for why he doesn't find the end zone as much as the other guys.

If I were picking the Pro Bowl right now, I'd take Roy Williams (DET), Steve Smith (CAR), Torry Holt (STL), and Marques Colston (NO). Donald Driver (GB -- the guy has 1100 yards and 7 TDs?! When did this happen???) and Darrell Jackson (10 TDs, will be over 1000 yards before the season's out) are on the outside looking in).

ASIDE: LV, where do you get your YAC stats? I'm not doubting you, but I can never find a site that tracks them...

 

[BigRedRage]

Big Red Rage did. Right here.


EDIT: Anquan's had four big games (more than 100 yards or more than 5 catches) in 13 tries. In the process, he's scored 4 TDs, the same amount as Larry Fitzgerald in 4 fewer games. In the same number of games (or fewer), here's how some of the other WRs in the NFL have fared:

Torry Holt: 9 big games.
Ocho Cinco: 10 big games.
Steve Smith: 8 big games.
Javon Walker: 5 big games.
Marvin Harrison: 9 big games.
Reggie Wayne: 5 big games.
T.J. Houshmandzadeh: 7 big games.
Andre Johnson: 9 big games.
Lee Evans: 8 big games.
Braylon Edwards: 5 big games.
Larry Fitzgerald: 5 big games.

So, I guess that some Supermen take more days off than others? I don't even bust on him for not getting 100 yards every game, but I think I get the chance to bust on his jockers when--as has been the case nearly every time in the past--all of Anquan's big games this season have come in losses (StL, Chi, Min).

Anquan Boldin has fewer touchdowns than Joey Galloway. But I guess every team needs a mascot. sarcasm

I did and I always will say that Q is the best WR in the league. You can write all the Bible responces you want and I will never change my mind. Q is the only receiver in the nfl that no matter where and how he catches the ball i fly out of my seat looking for a touchdown. you can say stat this and stat that but you know what no matter who does what and what stats are achieved opinions will still differ and mine will still say Q is the best there is.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

I did and I always will say that Q is the best WR in the league.

That could be a homeristic view. I am not even certain he is the best WR on this team.

 

[kerouac9]

That could be a homeristic view. I am not even certain he is the best WR on this team.

And that's what my thesis has been all along.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

I agree with you, but that's not to say that TDs are a meaningless stat. But I don't think that it should be discounted the way that a lot of people do on this board. It seems that TDs are discounted because Anquan doesn't get a lot of them, and that receptions are over-counted because he gets a ton of them.

Anquan's tied for 35th in the NFL in TDs with 4. That must not be an important statistic. Anquan's tied for 13th in the NFL in catches. That must be an important statistic. That doesn't make a lot of sense to me. Does he need to score 10 TDs every year for me to consider him elite? Of course not. But the other two guys tied for him for receptions both have 8 TDs; hard to say that there might be something amiss here, especially when the Arizona Cardinals don't have any of "the fat guys" that you're talking about.

The other stat that people seem to dismiss when it comes to Anquan is his average YPC. He's 39th in the NFL in catch average. Yes, there are some outliers in that category (Bryant Johnson is in the Top 5), but he's averaging less YPC than Donald Driver. Three less YPC than Roy Williams. Among the top 10 receiving yards leaders in the NFL, only two guys have lower averages than Anquan's 13.8: Andre Johnson (11.5) and Terrell Owens (13.5). And Owens has 9 TDs. Among the Top 10 yardage leaders, Anquan's second to last in terms of 20+ yard plays (14) beind Lee Evans with 9.

Again: I think that Anquan Boldin is a very, very good wide receiver in the NFL, but I don't think that for the elite talents, the real Top 10 guys for whom you have to make an argument to keep out of the Pro Bowl, you have to cherry pick stats and make excuses for why he doesn't find the end zone as much as the other guys.

If I were picking the Pro Bowl right now, I'd take Roy Williams (DET), Steve Smith (CAR), Torry Holt (STL), and Marques Colston (NO). Donald Driver (GB -- the guy has 1100 yards and 7 TDs?! When did this happen???) and Darrell Jackson (10 TDs, will be over 1000 yards before the season's out) are on the outside looking in).

ASIDE: LV, where do you get your YAC stats? I'm not doubting you, but I can never find a site that tracks them...

And yet Lee Evans is considered one of the best deep threats in the game. Stats can be manipulated to fit almost anyone's point of view. I watch a ton of football games every week and Boldin is a top notch receiver. He's not the best but he's in the upper class. One guy i don't think should make the pro bowl is Colston. The Saints passing game hasn't missed a beat with him out.

 

[kerouac9]

One guy i don't think should make the pro bowl is Colston. The Saints passing game hasn't missed a beat with him out.

Yeah, maybe, but I think that you reward a rookie who put up insane numbers in a situation where it might have been hard to succeed. He's 14th in the league in yardage dispite missing a quarter of the season. He has 11 fewer receptions than the guy behind him on the yardage list (Torry Holt), and 16 fewer than the guy ahead of him by four yards (L. Coles). The kid's had an amazing year. 5th in the NFC in TDs. 7th in reception yards. Probably would have shattered the rookie receiving record had he been able to stay healthy, and he's a 7th round pick.

I'd rather see Colston go than T.O. (4th in yardage, 2nd in TDs) or Darrell Jackson (all he does is catch touchdowns--1 TD every 6.3 catches). I think that a 7th round rookie playing like this deserves to be rewarded. What four would you send?

What I can say on Anquan is that he's a guy that I hold my breath about every time he catches a three-yard hitch, and I'm impressed when he takes that hitch for 11. I just don't think that's enough to make you the best WR in the game.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

Yeah, maybe, but I think that you reward a rookie who put up insane numbers in a situation where it might have been hard to succeed. He's 14th in the league in yardage dispite missing a quarter of the season. He has 11 fewer receptions than the guy behind him on the yardage list (Torry Holt), and 16 fewer than the guy ahead of him by four yards (L. Coles). The kid's had an amazing year. 5th in the NFC in TDs. 7th in reception yards. Probably would have shattered the rookie receiving record had he been able to stay healthy, and he's a 7th round pick.

I'd rather see Colston go than T.O. (4th in yardage, 2nd in TDs) or Darrell Jackson (all he does is catch touchdowns--1 TD every 6.3 catches). I think that a 7th round rookie playing like this deserves to be rewarded. What four would you send?

What I can say on Anquan is that he's a guy that I hold my breath about every time he catches a three-yard hitch, and I'm impressed when he takes that hitch for 11. I just don't think that's enough to make you the best WR in the game.

You could reward Colston with ROY award, rather than pro-bowl.

 

[Pariah]

The pro-bowl isn't the MVP-bowl. Your team can still do well with you out; it doesn't change the fact that you could be having a pro-bowl year.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

I would send Smith(no-brainer), Roy Williams, Driver, and the 4th guy you can make arguments for alot of guys. As much as i don't like the guy, Owens would probably be my choice. He and Romo have teamed together to turn the Cowboys season around when it was about to go in the tank. Boldin and Jackson would be my alternates. Colston is a nice story but i think the other guys are more deserving.

 

[kerouac9]

You could reward Colston with ROY award, rather than pro-bowl.

Yeah, but I'm giving my ROY to Maurice Jones-Drew, who isn't making my AFC Pro Bowl ballot, because he's not pushing aside Larry Johnson or LDT or Willie Parker, who I think is deserving this year.

 

[kerouac9]

I know that no one cares, but my NFC RB Pro Bowl ballot is Frank Gore, Tiki Barber, and Deuce McAllister.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

Yeah, but I'm giving my ROY to Maurice Jones-Drew, who isn't making my AFC Pro Bowl ballot, because he's not pushing aside Larry Johnson or LDT or Willie Parker, who I think is deserving this year.

And to think I dropped Drew Week 2 in my fantasy league. That decision right there is why I missed the playoffs by 1 point.

 

[kerouac9]

I would send Smith(no-brainer), Roy Williams, Driver, and the 4th guy you can make arguments for alot of guys. As much as i don't like the guy, Owens would probably be my choice. He and Romo have teamed together to turn the Cowboys season around when it was about to go in the tank. Boldin and Jackson would be my alternates. Colston is a nice story but i think the other guys are more deserving.

Interesting. You're really going to snub Holt, who is 8th on the yardage list before tonight's game with one fewer TD? That's tough to do, considering the body of work that he's compiled in his career and that he's less protected than T.O., who has Terry Glenn across from him. I'm not even sure that T.O. is the best WR on his team.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

I'm banning any Maurice Jones Drew talk . The guy singlehandedly knocked me out of my fantasy football playoffs yesterday. How would a guy start him in the playoffs. Unbelieveable. I lose by 6 points to that team .

 

[dreamcastrocks]

I'm banning any Maurice Jones Drew talk . The guy singlehandedly knocked me out of my fantasy football playoffs yesterday. How would a guy start him in the playoffs. Unbelieveable. I lose by 6 points to that team .

He has scored about 15 points a week from what I have noticed. One of the best backs of the year, and I freaking drop the guy in week 2, keeping Ron Dayne instead. Yes, I deserve to be out of the playoffs this year.

 

[LVCARDFREAK]

I agree with you, but that's not to say that TDs are a meaningless stat. But I don't think that it should be discounted the way that a lot of people do on this board. It seems that TDs are discounted because Anquan doesn't get a lot of them, and that receptions are over-counted because he gets a ton of them.

Anquan's tied for 35th in the NFL in TDs with 4. That must not be an important statistic. Anquan's tied for 13th in the NFL in catches. That must be an important statistic. That doesn't make a lot of sense to me. Does he need to score 10 TDs every year for me to consider him elite? Of course not. But the other two guys tied for him for receptions both have 8 TDs; hard to say that there might be something amiss here, especially when the Arizona Cardinals don't have any of "the fat guys" that you're talking about.

The other stat that people seem to dismiss when it comes to Anquan is his average YPC. He's 39th in the NFL in catch average. Yes, there are some outliers in that category (Bryant Johnson is in the Top 5), but he's averaging less YPC than Donald Driver. Three less YPC than Roy Williams. Among the top 10 receiving yards leaders in the NFL, only two guys have lower averages than Anquan's 13.8: Andre Johnson (11.5) and Terrell Owens (13.5). And Owens has 9 TDs. Among the Top 10 yardage leaders, Anquan's second to last in terms of 20+ yard plays (14) beind Lee Evans with 9.

Again: I think that Anquan Boldin is a very, very good wide receiver in the NFL, but I don't think that for the elite talents, the real Top 10 guys for whom you have to make an argument to keep out of the Pro Bowl, you have to cherry pick stats and make excuses for why he doesn't find the end zone as much as the other guys.

If I were picking the Pro Bowl right now, I'd take Roy Williams (DET), Steve Smith (CAR), Torry Holt (STL), and Marques Colston (NO). Donald Driver (GB -- the guy has 1100 yards and 7 TDs?! When did this happen???) and Darrell Jackson (10 TDs, will be over 1000 yards before the season's out) are on the outside looking in).

ASIDE: LV, where do you get your YAC stats? I'm not doubting you, but I can never find a site that tracks them...

FWIW, My stats are based solely on WR's. There are RB's that have a much higher YAC, and a higher YPG average, pushing most of the WR's down ( Westbrook, Bush, etc)

Stats inc, let me find the url and post it for you.

edit: My stats are also based on at least 50 catches. There are a ton of guys with 20-25 receptions with greater YAC but they dont get the playing time to be in the same category, imo

 

[kerouac9]

FWIW, My stats are based solely on WR's. There are RB's that have a much higher YAC, and a higher YPG average, pushing most of the WR's down ( Westbrook, Bush, etc)

Stats inc, let me find the url and post it for you.

edit: My stats are also based on at least 50 catches. There are a ton of guys with 20-25 receptions with greater YAC but they dont get the playing time to be in the same category, imo

I have that link. No need to post it. I never looked around at that category. Thanks.

Anquan's 4th among WRs in YAC yards, after Donald Driver, Steve Smith, and Andre Johnson. Interestingly, Marques Colston is 5th behind Anquan. Over 1/3 of Anquan's yards have come after the catch.

 

[kerouac9]

Anquan's tied for 15th in first down receptions, though. Behind basically all the guys that I named on my list, and a couple I forgot, like T.O., Javon Walker, and Crotchery.

EDIT: Also, Anquan's 5th in the league in Targets, behind A. Johnson, D. Driver, T. Holt, and C. Chambers. Tied with T.O. and Ocho Cinco.

The guy gets more catches than almost anyone because he gets more looks than almost anyone, but the chicken and egg argument can be made here, as well.

EDIT (again): Interestingly, Anquan doesn't even make the Top 20 in terms of 1st Down percentage. Looking at these, it makes me appreciate how much better Bryant Johnson is than a lot of us give him credit for. He's in the Top 15 of "big play" WRs (over 25 yards) with 8. He's in the Top 10 in 1st down percentage (80.6% of his catches lead to a first down).

 

[JC_AZ]

I'm banning any Maurice Jones Drew talk . The guy singlehandedly knocked me out of my fantasy football playoffs yesterday. How would a guy start him in the playoffs. Unbelieveable. I lose by 6 points to that team .

I started him yesterday over Warrick Dunn..I would call it a SMART COACHING DECISION

 

[100%CardsFan]

I'm banning any Maurice Jones Drew talk . The guy singlehandedly knocked me out of my fantasy football playoffs yesterday. How would a guy start him in the playoffs. Unbelieveable. I lose by 6 points to that team .

LMFAO, I won yesterday to get into the finals by 6 points... starting Maurice Jones Drew.

 

[Russ Smith]

Anquan's tied for 15th in first down receptions, though. Behind basically all the guys that I named on my list, and a couple I forgot, like T.O., Javon Walker, and Crotchery.

EDIT: Also, Anquan's 5th in the league in Targets, behind A. Johnson, D. Driver, T. Holt, and C. Chambers. Tied with T.O. and Ocho Cinco.

The guy gets more catches than almost anyone because he gets more looks than almost anyone, but the chicken and egg argument can be made here, as well.

EDIT (again): Interestingly, Anquan doesn't even make the Top 20 in terms of 1st Down percentage. Looking at these, it makes me appreciate how much better Bryant Johnson is than a lot of us give him credit for. He's in the Top 15 of "big play" WRs (over 25 yards) with 8. He's in the Top 10 in 1st down percentage (80.6% of his catches lead to a first down).

But that stat is misleading because that's really all we ask Johnson to do. Boldin and Fitz get all the coverages, and Johnson gets single cover. Look at the TD pass yesterday, single coverage no safety around, Boldin and Fitz just don't get that.

Johnson is having a very good year though I'll agree with that, 4 TD's nearly 19 YPC, can't complain about that from a #3 WR.

 

[BigRedArk]

Where is the stat that shows how many TD catches ol' skillethands Johnson has dropped this year? The dude cannot be counted on. One game he looks pretty good the next game he has hands of stone!!!! Seems like there were two different games this year where he dropped a sure TD that might have won the game for us or at least would have made it a much tighter game on scoreboard. If any WR on this team deserves criticism it is skillethands himself.

Y'all have surely heard that old saying...."There are lies, damn lies, and then there are statistics." How much better would Q and Fitz be if we had a deep threat that could be counted on? I am pretty sure this is the last year of his contract. If it is I say let him go and find someone else. He is a 1st round pick remember. Who got the big contract extension after what the second year Q or skillethands?