Whispers from around the NFL ( JJ Arrington )

[duckfallas]

A guy with alleged 4.4 speed should not be getting caught from behind in the open field. His 30 yard run should have gone for a TD if he is really that fast.

 

[vince56]

A guy with alleged 4.4 speed should not be getting caught from behind in the open field. His 30 yard run should have gone for a TD if he is really that fast.

Time slows down as you approach the speed of suck.

 

[duckfallas]

Maybe its the grass. He did live close to Ricky Williams for a while.

 

[az jam]

Green was just on with Bickley and MJ. They specifically asked him if he was disappointed with JJ. Green jumped right in and said how can I be disappointed with JJ when he doesn't have any holes to run through. Green said when the O-Line start opening holes for JJ, that JJ has the ability to turn 5 yard gains into 25 to 30 yard ones.

Green also mentioned the same thing for Shipp. Basically that Shipps poor rushing numbers is a reflection of the poor run blocking by the offensive line.

I did also hear the interview. I'm not down on Arrington at all. He is a rookie and will improve with time. The major task that Denny will have to fix in the off season is the offensive line. I would not be surprised to see their number one pick be an offensive lineman. I also think they will add another through free agency. Finally, I (along with everyone else) believe that Mike Tice will be fired and be looking for a job next year. His days of being a head coach are over. He was an outstanding offensive line coach under Denny at Minnesota. I would love to see him here in that capacity.

 

[Pariah]

??

For the past three games Arrington has been improving. Running with more confidence, looking more aware and then he busts a big run. How is he not improving?

Sure, he's improving. So what? He's no where near an NFL starting claiber RB.

My piano playing keeps getting better, too. Doesn't mean I should be playing Carnege Hall.

 

[Russ Smith]

Sure, he's improving. So what? He's no where near an NFL starting claiber RB.

My piano playing keeps getting better, too. Doesn't mean I should be playing Carnege Hall.

But the post of mine that you laughed at didn't say JJ should be in Carnegie Hall, it just said since the rumors started leaking that JJ was a bust, he's been playing better each week.

I jokingly posted it yesterday but it's true, his last 11 carries he has 57 yards, I think we'd all agree 5 YPC is pretty good, especially behind this OL, and considering that 4 of those 11 runs went for negative yardage.

You have to start somewhere and he has started to play much better, while Shipp's performance has dropped off the last 2 games.

 

[Pariah]

But the post of mine that you laughed at didn't say JJ should be in Carnegie Hall, it just said since the rumors started leaking that JJ was a bust, he's been playing better each week.

I laughed because you had a couple of paragraphs citing the coach either making noise about how bad he is, or with his plans to replace him---then you said his "plan" is working.

Talking bad about a player is not going to make him better.

 

[D-Dogg]

I laughed because you had a couple of paragraphs citing the coach either making noise about how bad he is, or with his plans to replace him---then you said his "plan" is working.

Talking bad about a player is not going to make him better.

Au contraire...haven't you paid attention to the madness that is Denny Green? He's a little Phil Jackson-esque in that respect. Can't say I *like* the approach, but it works to an extent. I just don't think it is a longterm positive.

 

[LoyaltyisaCurse]

A guy with alleged 4.4 speed should not be getting caught from behind in the open field. His 30 yard run should have gone for a TD if he is really that fast.

Fast player get caught from all the time, and pursuit angle can help a slower player catch up.


Plus, there is a difference between game speed and raw speed.

 

[Pariah]

Au contraire...haven't you paid attention to the madness that is Denny Green? He's a little Phil Jackson-esque in that respect. Can't say I *like* the approach, but it works to an extent. I just don't think it is a longterm positive.

Who has he made play better (other than Arrington...*giggle, giggle*) with this approach? Obviously it hasn't been met with great success, otherwise we'd be winning more games, right?

 

[conraddobler]

Fast player get caught from all the time, and pursuit angle can help a slower player catch up.


Plus, there is a difference between game speed and raw speed.

The guy chasing him wasn't a slouch but yeah if he really has 4.4 speed he'd have broken that.

I'd say more like 4.5 which is about what I'd guess the other guy runs.

They were stride for stride after the guy ran out of his angle on JJ.

 

[earthsci]

Who has he made play better (other than Arrington...*giggle, giggle*) with this approach?

Calvin Pace
Leonard Davis

 

[D-Dogg]

Who has he made play better (other than Arrington...*giggle, giggle*) with this approach? Obviously it hasn't been met with great success, otherwise we'd be winning more games, right?

Works to an extent. Just not a very meaningful extent. Phil Jackson is a more relevant user of this tactic, and I think it backfires in his face most of the time. Thank God he can ride Tex Winter's coattails into history...but I digress....

 

[Pariah]

Calvin Pace
Leonard Davis

Davis has gotten better because he's been in the position for longer.

Pace got better because he worked harder. By all accounts Arrington isn't working harder.

 

[Russ Smith]

I laughed because you had a couple of paragraphs citing the coach either making noise about how bad he is, or with his plans to replace him---then you said his "plan" is working.

Talking bad about a player is not going to make him better.

I absolutely think that Green is leaking this stuff to people about JJ though because he wants to motivate him.

I don't know if that's why JJ is playing better now or not, but he is.

 

[earthsci]

Davis has gotten better because he's been in the position for longer.

Pace got better because he worked harder. By all accounts Arrington isn't working harder.

Leonard Davis showed up for offseason workouts for the first time this year.

Why did Calvin Pace work harder and show up for offseason workouts, for the first time?

I understand that you don't like the method but it doesn't mean that it doesn't work sometimes.

 

[Russ Smith]

A guy with alleged 4.4 speed should not be getting caught from behind in the open field. His 30 yard run should have gone for a TD if he is really that fast.

True because 93 yard TD runs are commonplace in the NFL?

Someone needs to take a tivo shot and then we can figure out the distances using the pythagorean theorem and see precisely how far JJ ran and how far Lamont Thompson ran. We'll also need to know the wind speed and direction.

Anybody?

 

[Russ Smith]

The guy chasing him wasn't a slouch but yeah if he really has 4.4 speed he'd have broken that.

I'd say more like 4.5 which is about what I'd guess the other guy runs.

They were stride for stride after the guy ran out of his angle on JJ.

Thompson supposedly ran a 4.5 something at the combine, I looked it up yesterday I forget what it was. Every scouting report you find on him talks about range and speed being his biggest asset but that he needed to get stronger and that's why Marvin Lewis didn't keep him.

Since we're speculating how about this, it was the first play of the 2nd quarter, JJ had been standing on the sideline for roughly 45 minutes, to my knowledge it was the first time he'd been in the game at all. Thompson on the other hand was completely loose and had been playing the whole time so he was completely warmed up.

I don't know about you but I've never seen a sprinter prepare for a race by standing for 45 minutes.

 

[earthsci]

Lamont Thompson ran a 4.37 40, his junior year in college. Is that fast?

 

[Russ Smith]

Davis has gotten better because he's been in the position for longer.

Pace got better because he worked harder. By all accounts Arrington isn't working harder.

Huh? What accounts, we have no idea when someone told someone at Insider about this.


Pasch and Wolfley have been saying for weeks now they are being told by the staff he's running harder and having much better practices. They're clearly saying he's been working harder in practice and they get this stuff from the coaches.

 

[conraddobler]

Thompson supposedly ran a 4.5 something at the combine, I looked it up yesterday I forget what it was. Every scouting report you find on him talks about range and speed being his biggest asset but that he needed to get stronger and that's why Marvin Lewis didn't keep him.

Since we're speculating how about this, it was the first play of the 2nd quarter, JJ had been standing on the sideline for roughly 45 minutes, to my knowledge it was the first time he'd been in the game at all. Thompson on the other hand was completely loose and had been playing the whole time so he was completely warmed up.

I don't know about you but I've never seen a sprinter prepare for a race by standing for 45 minutes.

I can see your point.

JJ is fast no doubt about it.

He wasn't running a 4.4 there though, but again like you said I can agree he couldn't have been very loose.

JJ should start and play an entire game, heck we drafted him to play, play him, especially if we loose to Dallas and the Seahawks then we will be officially done.

Now if we win the Dallas and Seahawk game then you can start worrying about playing the best chance to win crew.

 

[MadCardDisease]

When you are carrying a football you can't run as fast as you could without one. It slows you down just enough that most defensive backs should be able to catch a ball carrier assuming they have a good angle.

 

[Russ Smith]

I can see your point.

JJ is fast no doubt about it.

He wasn't running a 4.4 there though, but again like you said I can agree he couldn't have been very loose.

JJ should start and play an entire game, heck we drafted him to play, play him, especially if we loose to Dallas and the Seahawks then we will be officially done.

Now if we win the Dallas and Seahawk game then you can start worrying about playing the best chance to win crew.

I was half joking, Thompson could have been tired, beat up, who knows.

If he really ran a 4.37 40 in college it's not all that embarassing to get caught by him.

Plus I'm really itching to use that pythagorean theorem if someone will just post a screen shot that shows JJ and Thompson.

As I mentioned to Shane on the gameday thread watching the Bronco game, Tatum Bell broke free, untouched, down the left sideline against the Giants and Brent "50 year old ex Card safety" Alexander caught him from behind and he not only had an angle, he was closing rapidly on him at the end. Bell ran a 4.37 at the combine the year before, the fastest RB in that class. And that's the 2nd time in 2 weeks I've seen Bell get caught from behind on a long run. People forget that kids train for months for those 40's at the combine that's what makes 40 times so silly it has almost nothing to do with reality , guys go through speed training, peak at the combines and pro days, and then go back to their normal football training and their normal speeds. The 2nd fastest RB last year behind Bell was Julius Jones who ran a 4.40, anybody comparing Jones to Michael Bennett?

People are saying JJ is slow because they're comparing him to Robert Smith and Michael Bennett, and compared to them he IS slow, but he's not slow compared to most NFL RB's.

 

[PACardsFan]

I did also hear the interview. I'm not down on Arrington at all. He is a rookie and will improve with time. The major task that Denny will have to fix in the off season is the offensive line. I would not be surprised to see their number one pick be an offensive lineman. I also think they will add another through free agency. Finally, I (along with everyone else) believe that Mike Tice will be fired and be looking for a job next year. His days of being a head coach are over. He was an outstanding offensive line coach under Denny at Minnesota. I would love to see him here in that capacity.

I'm afraid that this is how things may play out: Tice gets fired & is immediately hired by DG to be Offensive Line Coach. So far so good. Our OL improves dramatically & JJ runs for 1300 yds in 2006. Again, very good. DG gets us into the playoffs 2 yrs in a row. Awesome baby. A rift starts up between DG & Cardinal management. DG resigns & Tice is named HC. Within 2 years we are back to 4-12. Boy, being a Cardinal fan is tough!!!!

 

[Russ Smith]

I'm afraid that this is how things may play out: Tice gets fired & is immediately hired by DG to be Offensive Line Coach. So far so good. Our OL improves dramatically & JJ runs for 1300 yds in 2006. Again, very good. DG gets us into the playoffs 2 yrs in a row. Awesome baby. A rift starts up between DG & Cardinal management. DG resigns & Tice is named HC. Within 2 years we are back to 4-12. Boy, being a Cardinal fan is tough!!!!

They will never hire Tice to replace Green though, Bidwill isn't that dumb.