Who would you rather have?

[Cbus cardsfan]

I already know what the answers will be but i'll ask anyway. While most legitimate NFL front offices could get both guys locked up long term,it seems we have a FO that can't/won't be able to do it, who would you rather keep on the team, Dansby or Boldin? Ideally we keep both but,if i had to choose, i'd take Dansby. He's the best playmaker on the defensive side of the ball. He plays when he's dinged up. He plays a position that the Cards are lacking in depth at and,to me, he's more important to the Cards success than Boldin. Boldin is a great WR but he's going to be the #2 WR on a team that wants to become a run oriented team. He wants to be paid like a top WR,and i can't blame him because he is, but the fact remains that Fitz is the premier WR on the Cards. Boldin also has more injury concerns than Dansby. Can the Cards tie up all that money in the WR position? They can,but will they? Boldin is an unquestioned team leader but will he use his clubhouse influence in a negative way if he doesn't get a new deal? On the field, Dansby is a leader but we have no idea what kind of presence he has in the locker room. That could be what the Cards are concerned about. There's no reason the Cards/Graves can't get both guys locked up but we all know the Cards history and shouldn't be surprised if neither are on the team in 2009. Hopefully both are, but enjoy 2008,and give me Dansby in '09.......................... if i have to choose.

 

[DaisyCutter]

I believe it's "Whom would you rather have".

 

[PoolBoy]

oh Boldin without question.

 

[Darth Llama]

Boldin.

 

[black]

Well it's Boldin by process of elimination now.

No way Dansby gets 9 mil next year, he's already stealing 8 mil this year.

Boldin....2 pro bowls

Dansby....0 pro bowls

 

[RugbyMuffin]

Boldin.

You can find another 3-4 ILB.

I like how Whiz and company handled the Pace situation, and if they do the same with Dansby I will be fine with it.

If you look at the 2009 Free agent list there are some good names that will be free agents next year.

 

[cgolden]

As much as I hate to say it, I've gotta go with Boldin as well. I've always been a 'defense wins champoinships' guy and that's probably still true, but the league is moving towards a more wide open style of play. Any team that has aspirations of greatness will need two really good WRs.

 

[Totally_Red]

Boldin.

 

[jaguarpaw81]

Boldin.

You can find another 3-4 ILB.

I like how Whiz and company handled the Pace situation, and if they do the same with Dansby I will be fine with it.

If you look at the 2009 Free agent list there are some good names that will be free agents next year.

You want them to ignore him completely?

 

[RugbyMuffin]

You want them to ignore him completely?

Give him an offer that is generous yet plays to the need for Dansby in respect to OUR TEAM and not his needs.

If he takes it, GREAT. If not find some situational guys to play next to Hayes.

Don't get me wrong. He is MUCH MUCH better than Pace was or ever will be but he is not irreplacable.

As I have said, the Patroits have gotten by with two fossils at the ILB position for the last two seasons.

 

[BigRedRage]

ill take boldin over any player on the team buddy

 

[joeshmo]

Historically speaking decent LB's are much easier to find then decent WR's. Its why even average WR's get paid a lot and get drafted highly in the 1st round (expect this past year), and why LB's dont get paid as much and teams wait to draft them until the 2nd round for the most part. With that in mind I would rather have Boldin.

But at the same time I think spending that much money on two WR's is not good for a team. It is one of the last things I want most of my cap going to and would rather spend it on other things. With that in mind I would rather have Dansby.

In the end it matters who wants to deal with the Cards and who doesnt. Who ever wants to make the best deal for the team.

 

[DaisyCutter]

A note from the 2008 Football Prospectus

One thing that they mention is that offenses are more consistent over time than defenses are. They suggest that Bill Polian is the only GM to really figure this out. Polian in Indy, and Buffalo before that, built long-term dominating offenses and figured that eventually a defense is going to be good enough to win you a championship. He suggests that the Patriots work on the same model, considering that their offense has been much more consistent over the last near-decade than their defenses.

As a guy who grew up liking the Steelers and Dungy's Bucs alongside the Cards, it's hard for me to swallow this. I really like dominating defenses that are going to win games 9-6, 17-14. Mike Alstott was my favorite player for a long time.

But this does make a lot of sense. I'm still chewing it over in my brain, though. In light of that, I'm probably more likely to have Boldin if I have to choose, even though I'm not in the cult that believes that Anquan Boldin is a Top 5 WR in the NFL.

 

[Duckjake]

As much as I hate to say it, I've gotta go with Boldin as well. I've always been a 'defense wins champoinships' guy and that's probably still true, but the league is moving towards a more wide open style of play. Any team that has aspirations of greatness will need two really good WRs.

The Cards have only had three seasons since moving to Arizona where their defense has not ranked in the bottom 10 in either points allowed or yards allowed. Usually they ranked bottom 10 in both.

Meanwhile they have had numerous star Wide Receivers.

Figure it out.

 

[Sandan]

Boldin.

I also have to take issue with you post. The implication there is of incompetence in the FO to get this done, nowhere do I see any thought given to unrealistic expectations of Dansby, but then I guess we know this is all the FOs fault. How about trying a post with the dripping sarcasm

 

[jefftheshark]

I thought that Crayton was going to be playing here when Boldin got traded to the 'Boys, which would make the whole question moot.



JTS

 

[red desert]

I also have to take issue with you post. The implication there is of incompetence in the FO to get this done, nowhere do I see any thought given to unrealistic expectations of Dansby, but then I guess we know this is all the FOs fault. How about trying a post with the dripping sarcasm

 

[RugbyMuffin]

One thing that they mention is that offenses are more consistent over time than defenses are. They suggest that Bill Polian is the only GM to really figure this out. Polian in Indy, and Buffalo before that, built long-term dominating offenses and figured that eventually a defense is going to be good enough to win you a championship. He suggests that the Patriots work on the same model, considering that their offense has been much more consistent over the last near-decade than their defenses.

As a guy who grew up liking the Steelers and Dungy's Bucs alongside the Cards, it's hard for me to swallow this. I really like dominating defenses that are going to win games 9-6, 17-14. Mike Alstott was my favorite player for a long time.

But this does make a lot of sense. I'm still chewing it over in my brain, though. In light of that, I'm probably more likely to have Boldin if I have to choose, even though I'm not in the cult that believes that Anquan Boldin is a Top 5 WR in the NFL.

VERY good points.

Never thought of the whole "it takes longer for an offense to get on the same page thing"

 

[Shane]

Boldin

 

[DaisyCutter]

Historically speaking decent LB's are much easier to find then decent WR's. Its why even average WR's get paid a lot and get drafted highly in the 1st round (expect this past year), and why LB's dont get paid as much and teams wait to draft them until the 2nd round for the most part. With that in mind I would rather have Boldin.

I think this is half-true. I think that it's easier to find decent (starting-caliber) LBs in the draft than it is WRs. But once those players are developed, it's much easier to find star-caliber WRs than star-caliber LBs.

There are probably 10-15 wideouts in the NFL today that have a very good chance of making the Pro Bowl. Can you say the same thing about 4-3 OLBs? Or WILBs in 3-4 defenses? 3-4 OLBs are different because they're mostly pass rush specialists (which is why Dansby--still listed as an OLB for Pro Bowl purposes--probably won't make the Pro Bowl no matter how well he plays; he's not going to be in the position to post 12 sacks per year).

There are more "solid" LBs in the NFL than there are "solid" WRs, and it's much, much easier to find one in the draft (the list of bust first-round WRs is long and embarrassing). But on the second contract, you'd be much better off with the Pro Bowl-caliber LB (which I believe Dansby is becoming) than the Pro Bowl-caliber WR.

If you're making an either/or argument here, I guess this is the point: Are you going to be more able to get another 90+ tackle, 2 INT, 10 PD linebacker, or a wideout who can be a solid #2 (say 70 receptions, 800 yards, 8 TDs per season).

The gap between a good and great linebacker is much larger than that of a WR. The difference (According to FootballOutsiders.com) between Anquan Boldin and a replacement-level WR (like Bryant Johnson or Jerry Porter) is 229 yards per season. That's 14.3 yards per game (or 19 yards per game if the replacement also only plays in 12 games).

Unfortunately, they can't do the same thing for defensive players. I might say, with my defensive-bias, that there's a bigger step down from Karlos Dansby to Kawika Mitchell (a solid but unspectactular starting WLB) than the step down from Anquan Boldin to Justin Gage or Roddy White (as a similar step down). Especially when you consider the strength in each unit.

Boldin

 

[Pariah]

Keep Boldin, trade Fitz and Dansby.

Or, keep Dansby, trade Boldin.

 

[FArting]

Boldin

 

[dreamcastrocks]

Keep Boldin, trade Fitz and Dansby.

Or, keep Dansby, trade Boldin.

I think Boldin has a higher trade value. If we have to trade one of them, you trade Boldin. If the option is just keeping one or the other, you keep Boldin.

 

[vinnymac]

Boldin. I didn't know it was even up for discussion.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

i keep dansby. with just some additional talent around him he becomes a wrecking machine on defense on par with a young wilbur marshall. dansby is so versatile that a good creative defensive coordinator should be able to use him to create havoc on the defensive side of the field.

boldin is a great player. don't get me wrong. but i think he'll always be a 1a rather than a pure #1 receiver. he will never be a moss/owens level receiver whereas i think with just a bit more talent around him, dansby could have the affect of a young wilbur marshall.