Why Suns Fans Don't Like Marion

[Sunsman44]

It isn't his attitude. It isn't his trade request. It isn't any of that.

Why Shawn Marion is not liked upon so much - and I've read this here and there by people - is the fact that he seems to disappear during crucial times when the team is trailing in the 4th quarter of a playoff game.

We've seen it a million times.

We already know Marion cannot create any own shots and relies on Nash. When the team is down, they play kind of like a confused hamster. The ball seems to be a ticking time-bomb and every single player passes anxiously and the shot-clock dwindles down. Then one of two things happen:

A) Nash takes over and begins to nail 3-pts or drive in acrobatically.

B) The ball goes into Marion's hands with about 7 seconds to go on the shot-clock and he just chugs up the ugliest 3-pointer or jumper ever.

Usually it is the latter that happens and hence why Marion is not liked upon so much. I've seen this stinking Suns offense one too many times in the past - when they look fantastic in 3 quarters and simply stink up the place in crucial times. Marion is reason why.

He is indeed a fantasy team's dream come true. He will continue to give you 20pts and 12rebs night in and night out. No question. But he doesn't show up during crucial points on the offense end of the floor during a 4th quarter playoff game when the team is down.

That is what seperates him from the other money making superstars and that is why Marion doesn't deserve an extension or a raise. He is already overpaid.

Enough said.

 

[elindholm]

"Liked upon"?

Everyone has their own reasons for disliking Marion's game. He has a lot more strengths than weaknesses, and his weaknesses can usually be overcome by his teammates. There is hardly a player in the league about whom nothing bad can be said. I think it is more Marion's refusal to acknowledge his weaknesses, and the disconnect between the player he is and the player he thinks he is, that cause the problem.

 

[playstation]

there's other reasons for me

he knows what shots in his range are and what shots are not. we all know that the only 3's he should be taking are corner 3's, yet there he is, firing off more crap from the 3 line.

not only that, but to say anything to him breaks his fragile ego. THAT'S what pisses me off. the guy is making poor decisions out there and you can't say anything for fear of him going into his shell??? that's BS

 

[Sunsman44]

You see, Shawn Marion is used by the Suns for the wrong reasons - at times.

People need to realize that Shawn Marion - and he himself should begin to realize too - that Matrix is not a small forward and he should not hang out by the wing. It totally messes up his game. Even when playing "the four spot" he hangs out by the wing on offense.

I'm sure D'Antoni is smart enough to know this and thus why I love having Marion be a bonified full-time power forward. That is his position. Nothing else.

He needs to be an inside banger getting rebounds and tip-in alongside Amare. Then you will have the wings open for Grant Hill, Raja Bell, Leandro Barbosa, and at times Alando Tucker ----> all with Nash and Strawberry as the QB.

When Marion begins to play full-time power forward is when you will see him excel the most. It is when he hangs out by the wing that his shooting percentage declines.

 

[arwillan]

You see, Shawn Marion is used by the Suns for the wrong reasons - at times.

People need to realize that Shawn Marion - and he himself should begin to realize too - that Matrix is not a small forward and he should not hang out by the wing. It totally messes up his game. Even when playing "the four spot" he hangs out by the wing on offense.

I'm sure D'Antoni is smart enough to know this and thus why I love having Marion be a bonified full-time power forward. That is his position. Nothing else.

He needs to be an inside banger getting rebounds and tip-in alongside Amare. Then you will have the wings open for Grant Hill, Raja Bell, Leandro Barbosa, and at times Alando Tucker ----> all with Nash and Strawberry as the QB.

When Marion begins to play full-time power forward is when you will see him excel the most. It is when he hangs out by the wing that his shooting percentage declines.

too bad most power forwards in the league will eat him for lunch when he trys to guard them (e.g tim duncan). the only one he does all that well on that i can think of is dirk.

btw i think you may have a wrong idea about what "the four spot" is. 4-spot= power forward.
1-pg
2-sg
3-sf
4-pf
5-c

making sure you got that

 

[pokerface]

Oh Marion cant do this or that


Yeah and Nash cant play defense...Amare cant stay on the bench...Diaw cant be consistant....Barbosa cant stop being a tweener...


Where are we going with this? Marion is what he is...they knew what he was when they inked him...he delivered. He's more things than he's not thats why he received a big contract. There are many players out there that will never produce stats like what Marion has. I've never seen a player so productive yet so slammed in my life.

 

[pokerface]

You see, Shawn Marion is used by the Suns for the wrong reasons - at times.

People need to realize that Shawn Marion - and he himself should begin to realize too - that Matrix is not a small forward and he should not hang out by the wing. It totally messes up his game. Even when playing "the four spot" he hangs out by the wing on offense.

I'm sure D'Antoni is smart enough to know this and thus why I love having Marion be a bonified full-time power forward. That is his position. Nothing else.

He needs to be an inside banger getting rebounds and tip-in alongside Amare. Then you will have the wings open for Grant Hill, Raja Bell, Leandro Barbosa, and at times Alando Tucker ----> all with Nash and Strawberry as the QB.

When Marion begins to play full-time power forward is when you will see him excel the most. It is when he hangs out by the wing that his shooting percentage declines.

That is soooooo right on. I like Marion much more as a powerforward than a smallforward.

 

[Sunsman44]

btw i think you may have a wrong idea about what "the four spot" is. 4-spot= power forward.

I know four means power forward.

that's my point. When he plays power forward, he still hangs out by the wing for some reason. Hope D'Antoni fixes this and keeps him in the paint.

 

[YouJustGotSUNSD]

I can forgive his shortcomings and his alleged disappearing in the 4th quarter if his attitude were different. its the attitude with everything a distant second. if a 20/10 player couldn't create his own short or disappeared on the 4th quarter BUT was happy with his role and admitted he was working on his weaknesses I would hold him on a pedestal.

 

[pokerface]

I know four means power forward.

that's my point. When he plays power forward, he still hangs out by the wing for some reason. Hope D'Antoni fixes this and keeps him in the paint.

They should hire you as an assistant coach just to make sure Marion does that...it would be worth the money!

 

[YouJustGotSUNSD]

marion staying out of the paint is the biggest reason why our offense is so effective lol. tell me... how many alley oops would marion get playing paint offense? how effective would the stat nash picknroll be with a power forward not having to shift out to keep tabs on on marion at the 3? how often would nash be able to drive if he had to navigate marion and his defender that much closer to the rim? marion at the 3 is not our problem, coach.

 

[Diawsome]

marion staying out of the paint is the biggest reason why our offense is so effective lol. tell me... how many alley oops would marion get playing paint offense? how effective would the stat nash picknroll be with a power forward not having to shift out to keep tabs on on marion at the 3? how often would nash be able to drive if he had to navigate marion and his defender that much closer to the rim? marion at the 3 is not our problem, coach.

I can't believe it took that long for someone to mention this

 

[Sunsman44]

marion staying out of the paint is the biggest reason why our offense is so effective lol. tell me... how many alley oops would marion get playing paint offense? how effective would the stat nash picknroll be with a power forward not having to shift out to keep tabs on on marion at the 3? how often would nash be able to drive if he had to navigate marion and his defender that much closer to the rim? marion at the 3 is not our problem, coach.

First off, I am not a coach - so you don't need to address me as coach. I, like everyone else, am debating over an issue. Don't try to get cute again and again and again. Lay off and relax. You are the only one who is continuing the stupid childish reponses with me.

Secondly, Marion is not a 400-pound Mike Sweetney. He is a 228 pound athletic, slender body who can shift easily in and out of the paint. What I mean with him "staying in the paint" doesn't mean clog up the space. It simply means stop hanging out by the 3-point line at crucial times. He is not a shooter. The sooner people realize this, the sooner he will become more effective.

If Nash needs to drive in, if Amare needs to do his thing inside, Marion can easily step right out because of his speed and athletic quickness.

It is when he hangs out by the 3 point line 19 out of 24 seconds is what kills him and why D'Antoni always shouts at him.

That is what I am trying to say, coach.

 

[YouJustGotSUNSD]

I can't believe it took that long for someone to mention this

I'm in the hospital on my cell phone reading this stuff. I hoped someone else would state the obvious but I had to take matters into my own hands. YJGS does not approve of this thread.

 

[Sunsman44]

I'm in the hospital on my cell phone reading this stuff. I hoped someone else would state the obvious but I had to take matters into my own hands. YJGS does not approve of this thread.

No. U approve of it greatly. You love every single thing u just read in this thread. Just won't admit it.

The fact that u simply saw the name Sunsman44 as the author you automatically decided to reject and come up with a fake argument for the sake of entertainment.

Otherwise, had the same exact words been written by John Doe 44, you would embrace every word and not get cute with you replies, coach.

Again. Lay off and relax. Click ignore.

 

[pokerface]

Marion has a "Cedric Ceballos " quality about him where he can score quickly in the paint. Not only that but he can get the loose ball because he's so much faster than most players.

 

[Diawsome]

It simply means stop hanging out by the 3-point line at crucial times. He is not a shooter. The sooner people realize this, the sooner he will become more effective.

It seems like your problem has more to do with D'Antoni's coaching style then it does with Marion. Mike's offense calls for 3 guys to float around the perimeter opening up the paint for Nash and Amare. It has been that way for the past 3 years regardless of how good the shooters are (Richardson, Marion, Diaw and the same thing will happen with Grant Hill). The only time I can recall where the Suns went away with this for more then a couple plays is when Boris Diaw would have an huge size advantage and they have him post up i.e. him being guarded by Devin Harris.

If Nash needs to drive in, if Amare needs to do his thing inside, Marion can easily step right out because of his speed and athletic quickness.

It isn't so much about Marion clogging the paint as it is his defender doing so. The Suns run about 75-80% of their plays with either Nash or Amare going inside and at that point it would be useless for Marion to drift out towards the perimeter because his defender would simply ignore him and double up whomever is coming in, where as if Marion were already on the perimeter his defender would not be able to get over in time to help out on Nash/Amare.

 

[Lynx280]

No. U approve of it greatly. You love every single thing u just read in this thread. Just won't admit it.

The fact that u simply saw the name Sunsman44 as the author you automatically decided to reject and come up with a fake argument for the sake of entertainment.

Otherwise, had the same exact words been written by John Doe 44, you would embrace every word and not get cute with you replies, coach.

Again. Lay off and relax. Click ignore.

I never post here, i just like to read all the threads because someone normally expresses my point of view. Reading ur posts over the last few weeks has just made me laugh.

You are a joke. Seriously, if ur not a lakers fan here to just make fun or something you have some real problems.

I dont know where the ignore button is....how do i ignore this strange strange person?

 

[azirish]

It seems like your problem has more to do with D'Antoni's coaching style then it does with Marion. Mike's offense calls for 3 guys to float around the perimeter opening up the paint for Nash and Amare. It has been that way for the past 3 years regardless of how good the shooters are (Richardson, Marion, Diaw and the same thing will happen with Grant Hill). The only time I can recall where the Suns went away with this for more then a couple plays is when Boris Diaw would have an huge size advantage and they have him post up i.e. him being guarded by Devin Harris.

It isn't so much about Marion clogging the paint as it is his defender doing so. The Suns run about 75-80% of their plays with either Nash or Amare going inside and at that point it would be useless for Marion to drift out towards the perimeter because his defender would simply ignore him and double up whomever is coming in, where as if Marion were already on the perimeter his defender would not be able to get over in time to help out on Nash/Amare.

There is another, more subtle element. Ideally, Marion would be in motion most of the time because in the half court he is most effective as a cutter. But he tends to camp on wing and just keep asking for the ball because he's open - but he's open because he's a bad outside shooter.

Unwillingness to move without the ball is the bane of modern NBA players. It doesn't necessarily get the player more shots (staying put means everybody knows where to find the player for a pass), but it forces the opposition to guard him.

 

[Sunsman44]

Reading ur posts over the last few weeks has just made me laugh. You are a joke.

Some evidence - preferably direct quotes and links to these supposed laughable posts - would be great in validating or promoting your argument.

As of now, I think your argument is rubbish with no solid evidence of my "laughable posts." Find them and please prove me wrong. I am begging you...

Everybody in here, with exception to a couple hogwashes like yourself, love my engaging threads. None are offensive and all speak well of the Suns.

 

[BC867]

Marion staying out of the paint is the biggest reason why our offense is so effective.

That was the Suns philosophy for years with 212 lb. "Center" Alvan Adams camped out at the top of the key.

That gimmick got us one Cinderella year in the Finals and never again during his regime.

Our only other Finals appearance at least had West and Barkley in the lineup.

 

[Sunsman44]

That was the Suns philosophy for years with 212 lb. "Center" Alvan Adams camped out at the top of the key.

That gimmick got us one Cinderella year in the Finals and never again during his regime.

Our only other Finals appearance at least had West and Barkley in the lineup.

Exactly.

Keeping Marion outside the paint is the dumbest thing since...........Milli Vanilli lip-synching allegations...

 

[BC867]

Exactly.

Keeping Marion outside the paint is the dumbest thing since...........Milli Vanilli lip-synching allegations...

And, there too, the cover guys were skinnier than the originals. Just like the Suns. Good metaphor.

 

[AZBALLER]

2 reasons, he is respected, and he could have been traded for KG, which would be a steal.

 

[JCSunsfan]

I don't have a problem with Marion's game. I have a problem with his crybaby act.

He has the ability to turn every comment, every event, everything, into an insult. If you try to compliment him, he finds a way to be upset about it. Its really hard to even like someone like that.

Shawn Marion thinks he is worth 60 million over three years, and he is not. He is going to be insulted by it all and blame everyone else but himself that he's not getting the dough he wants.

I am sure the signing of Rashard Lewis in Orlando ruined whatever shred of reality he had left.