Would our 1st, both 3rd’s, and next years 2nd get us to #3 overall?

[Cheesebeef]

I think the Browns GM wants to keep his job. He brought Alex Smith to KC when he was GM there... with $118mil cap space and the youngest team in the league the smart move for them is to bring in a vet
if they sign Kirk Cousins... they have a 10 year starter surrounded by lots of young players. If they sign Smith they have tested veteran leadership for all those young players... but likely only have a 4 or 5 year starter. The difference between a first round QB and a second round QB really, is how much time they need to develop... Kizer should have never seen the field last season... but if they sign a vet, draft a QB in the second round... they have leadership, mentoring, and time...to go along with the younger guys competing against one another

If they were to draft...say,... Lamar Jackson with the first pick in the second and have him learn behind Smith... in 2 or 3 years Jackson can take over and they never miss a beat with offensive production. Similar to when Rodgers sat behind Favre or young sat behind Montana...on a different scale of course, lol.. but the same concept.

Cleveland has a lot of young talented players but they need a QB to lead them. Veteran leadership will help them to be more competitive faster than a rookie.

If they draft a QB in the top five... there is way too much pressure to get the guy on the field. Because fans want to see the young "superstar" on the field.

and as you have pointed out so many times... picking that QB in the top five has a lot of risk attached to it... when you have $118mil in cap space available you dont have to take that risk if guys like Cousins or Smith can be had.

I really think you’re talking yourself into what you WANT to happen so it benefits us.

The Browns are at the beginning of a total rebuild. To be able to do that with a great young QB AND RB to set your team up for a decade isn’t going to be passed up, IMO.

 

[Solar7]

I think the Browns GM wants to keep his job. He brought Alex Smith to KC when he was GM there... with $118mil cap space and the youngest team in the league the smart move for them is to bring in a vet
if they sign Kirk Cousins... they have a 10 year starter surrounded by lots of young players. If they sign Smith they have tested veteran leadership for all those young players... but likely only have a 4 or 5 year starter. The difference between a first round QB and a second round QB really, is how much time they need to develop... Kizer should have never seen the field last season... but if they sign a vet, draft a QB in the second round... they have leadership, mentoring, and time...to go along with the younger guys competing against one another

If they were to draft...say,... Lamar Jackson with the first pick in the second and have him learn behind Smith... in 2 or 3 years Jackson can take over and they never miss a beat with offensive production. Similar to when Rodgers sat behind Favre or young sat behind Montana...on a different scale of course, lol.. but the same concept.

Cleveland has a lot of young talented players but they need a QB to lead them. Veteran leadership will help them to be more competitive faster than a rookie.

If they draft a QB in the top five... there is way too much pressure to get the guy on the field. Because fans want to see the young "superstar" on the field.

and as you have pointed out so many times... picking that QB in the top five has a lot of risk attached to it... when you have $118mil in cap space available you dont have to take that risk if guys like Cousins or Smith can be had.

Well, it looks like Smith isn't there to be had (check the other thread).

We have a differing feeling about the talent level of the Cleveland Browns. I'm pretty insistent that you can't be a talented team after going 0-16. Why would Cousins want to go there and maybe put an extra 6 wins on their record, short of just losing for the money (and living in Cleveland of all places)?

Honestly, I don't know how you can want to draft a "surefire" QB that the most QB-thirsty franchise since 1999 passes over.

 

[Buckybird]

Last five drafts (first round QBS) which of these would you trade three or even two first round picks for, before the draft and now that, you know what kind of player they are.


2017

Mitch Trubisky

Patrick Mahommes

Deshawn Watson


2016

Jared Goff

Carson Wentz

Paxton Lynch


2015

Jameis Winston

Marcus Mariota


2014

Blake Bortles

Johnny Manzel

Teddy Bridgewater


2013

EJ Manuel

I would have done that for Wentz, Watson & Mahomes without blinking an eye!

 

[Solar7]

I would have done that for Wentz, Watson & Mahomes without blinking an eye!

ACL Tear
2 ACL Tears
0 TDs thrown

 

[Ohcrap75]

Last five drafts (first round QBS) which of these would you trade three or even two first round picks for, before the draft and now that, you know what kind of player they are.


2017

Mitch Trubisky

Patrick Mahommes

Deshawn Watson


2016

Jared Goff

Carson Wentz

Paxton Lynch


2015

Jameis Winston

Marcus Mariota


2014

Blake Bortles

Johnny Manzel

Teddy Bridgewater


2013

EJ Manuel

I would trade Cooper, DBuc and Nkemdiche for quite a few

 

[Buckybird]

ACL Tear
2 ACL Tears
0 TDs thrown

So? It could happen to any player or anytime! Has zero to do with the decision at the time.

Maybe you should change your name to Carnac if you could predict those types of things

 

[Solar7]

So? It could happen to any player or anytime! Has zero to do with the decision at the time.

Maybe you should change your name to Carnac if you could predict those types of things

The point is the risk here. How quickly people forget that RG3 was the Offensive Rookie of the Year, and that the bottom fell out after one injury. And that they still haven't recovered from it.

These guys are easily still on track to be as forgettable as the rest of the list. I wanted both Watson and Mahomes, but a guy whose career is predicated on mobility that has two major ligament tears, and one guy that has never thrown an NFL touchdown, are not surefire guys worthy of giving up multiple first round picks.

 

[Stout]

The point is the risk here. How quickly people forget that RG3 was the Offensive Rookie of the Year, and that the bottom fell out after one injury. And that they still haven't recovered from it.

These guys are easily still on track to be as forgettable as the rest of the list. I wanted both Watson and Mahomes, but a guy whose career is predicated on mobility that has two major ligament tears, and one guy that has never thrown an NFL touchdown, are not surefire guys worthy of giving up multiple first round picks.

Baloney. They've had years to recover from it; they've just been too damned incompetent. I get that this is your go-to example--and it's a good cautionary tale--but you can't lay their current shortcomings on RGIII anymore.

 

[Buckybird]

The point is the risk here. How quickly people forget that RG3 was the Offensive Rookie of the Year, and that the bottom fell out after one injury. And that they still haven't recovered from it.

These guys are easily still on track to be as forgettable as the rest of the list. I wanted both Watson and Mahomes, but a guy whose career is predicated on mobility that has two major ligament tears, and one guy that has never thrown an NFL touchdown, are not surefire guys worthy of giving up multiple first round picks.

Lol

There’s a risk with every pick. No GM goes into a draft or doesn’t pick a particular player saying “oh let’s pass on him because I think he might get hurt”.

Imo it isn’t near as dumb as rewarding your starting safety $40 after he shreds his knee. Not even close!

 

[Solar7]

Baloney. They've had years to recover from it; they've just been too damned incompetent. I get that this is your go-to example--and it's a good cautionary tale--but you can't lay their current shortcomings on RGIII anymore.

I misused it in this thread, but the main reason I've been pushing it is that it's the reason Kirk Cousins isn't a "winner."

But unless the past two years of draft picks have continued success, it hasn't been worth trading up for just about any team.

 

[oaken1]

Baloney. They've had years to recover from it; they've just been too damned incompetent. I get that this is your go-to example--and it's a good cautionary tale--but you can't lay their current shortcomings on RGIII anymore.

folks tend to forget the redskins covered their ass in that draft and also picked Kirk Cousins the same year they drafted RG III

But that aint working out for them either is it....

 

[Solar7]

Lol

There’s a risk with every pick. No GM goes into a draft or doesn’t pick a particular player saying “oh let’s pass on him because I think he might get hurt”.

Imo it isn’t near as dumb as rewarding your starting safety $40 after he shreds his knee. Not even close!

There's a risk, but mostly one you can mitigate. It's a tired analogy, but if I spend my rent money on scratchers hoping I'm going to make enough to triple it, I'm putting myself in a position to be evicted. It's one thing for me to spend a couple of bucks that I can make up with some overtime shifts to give it a try... and another to risk it all knowing I'm coming up on a situation with no safety net.

 

[Solar7]

folks tend to forget the redskins covered their ass in that draft and also picked Kirk Cousins the same year they drafted RG III

But that aint working out for them either is it....

And the Packers drafted Brian Brohm in the second round the year after making Aaron Rodgers their starter. It didn't work out. The Redskins taking a 4th round QB isn't really "covering their ass."

 

[oaken1]

And the Packers drafted Brian Brohm in the second round the year after making Aaron Rodgers their starter. It didn't work out. The Redskins taking a 4th round QB isn't really "covering their ass."

drafting two QB's in the same draft has a bit of ass covering in it. Drafting one every couple of years in case you strike gold is just good business.

 

[Solar7]

drafting two QB's in the same draft has a bit of ass covering in it. Drafting one every couple of years in case you strike gold is just good business.

BPA. If you grade out very high on a guy in the later rounds, you take him instead of reaching for a need. Especially that late.

 

[WisconsinCard]

I would have done that for Wentz, Watson & Mahomes without blinking an eye!

We shall see about Mahomes, I said I would be up for it for Wentz and Watson. So riddle me this, who are you will to give up 3 first round picks for this year? I personally don't see anyone sure fire enough to take that kind of risk on.

 

[WisconsinCard]

I would trade Cooper, DBuc and Nkemdiche for quite a few

Well that crazy, because Cooper and a number 2 brought us Chandler Jones. Buc is unrated by many on the board IMO, and I don't understand why. Is he a pro-bowler...no, but he is a solid tackler and is right up there among our leading tackler every year. Nkemdiche, well...I got nothing...

 

[Buckybird]

We shall see about Mahomes, I said I would be up for it for Wentz and Watson. So riddle me this, who are you will to give up 3 first round picks for this year? I personally don't see anyone sure fire enough to take that kind of risk on.

You know who my guy is

I wouldn’t give up that to climb in the top 5 but if he’s at 7 or 8 I’m pulling the trigger!

 

[WisconsinCard]

You know who my guy is

I wouldn’t give up that to climb in the top 5 but if he’s at 7 or 8 I’m pulling the trigger!

What are you willing to give up to get there? Baker...Baker...the Johnny Football maker...Err TD maker....

And for the record I don't think Baker is Johnny Football. I'll say BM has a much longer career, more like a Jake Plummer Type career.

 

[Buckybird]

What are you willing to give up to get there? Baker...Baker...the Johnny Football maker...Err TD maker....

And for the record I don't think Baker is Johnny Football. I'll say BM has a much longer career, more like a Jake Plummer Type career.

Great Mikey

I’d give up this years #1 & next years 2 to make that deal

 

[Ohcrap75]

Well that crazy, because Cooper and a number 2 brought us Chandler Jones. Buc is unrated by many on the board IMO, and I don't understand why. Is he a pro-bowler...no, but he is a solid tackler and is right up there among our leading tackler every year. Nkemdiche, well...I got nothing...

Crazy, is you thinking that Cooper was a key piece in the trade. He was an add on. The second round pick was 90%. If he wasn't on our team we could've added a late round pick to get the deal done. Buc is an undersized LB that has a hard time getting off blocks. His coverage skills are also limited because he is stiff and doesn't have good lateral mobility. He is an average player that can be easily replaced in FA or in the draft just like Minter.

 

[cardncubfan]

Last five drafts (first round QBS) which of these would you trade three or even two first round picks for, before the draft and now that, you know what kind of player they are.


2017

Mitch Trubisky

Patrick Mahommes

Deshawn Watson


2016

Jared Goff

Carson Wentz

Paxton Lynch


2015

Jameis Winston

Marcus Mariota


2014

Blake Bortles

Johnny Manzel

Teddy Bridgewater


2013

EJ Manuel

Mahomes, Watson, & Goff.

 

[WisconsinCard]

Great Mikey

I’d give up this years #1 & next years 2 to make that deal

You're not even going to be able to move up one spot for that. IMO

 

[WisconsinCard]

Mahomes, Watson, & Goff.

I can't disagree with your choices, but it still early In all of their careers.

 

[WisconsinCard]

Crazy, is you thinking that Cooper was a key piece in the trade. He was an add on. The second round pick was 90%. If he wasn't on our team we could've added a late round pick to get the deal done. Buc is an undersized LB that has a hard time getting off blocks. His coverage skills are also limited because he is stiff and doesn't have good lateral mobility. He is an average player that can be easily replaced in FA or in the draft just like Minter.

That is the point we didn't give up any other picks. I never said he was a key piece of the trade, I just said he was part of it. We shall see about BUC. I think if he were "easily replaced" someone would have done it by now. We'll find out what the card think soon, because they'll either release him or give him anew contract, because I don't see them paying him 8 mil this year.