You are Bidwill, What are your options if Cardinals finish between 7 and 9 wins in 2021?

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

The 2018 mess rests ENTIRELY on Wilks’s ineptitude as a HC. Keim gave him enough talent for us to be much better than what we ended up being. Playoff good? No! But significantly better than 3-13. There’s a reason why a HC gets fired after one season. It certainly wasn’t because the GM didn’t do his job. Otherwise, Keim would have been fired with him.

Yeah I couldn’t disagree more. That team had one of the worst collections of players I can remember from a cardinals team and that’s saying something.

 

[Cardsfaninlouky]

I think he said no to an interview after we fired Wilks...

... But Duce Staley is supposed to be a good candidate who could be REALLY interesting.

He did turn us down for the interview but his stance on us may have changed now? The reason I believe this is because he's been passed over by multiple teams ever since & he wants to be a head coach. Maybe we get him this time around if KK is let go?

 

[Solar7]

• Correlation does not imply causation. The phrase "correlation does not imply causation" refers to the inability to legitimately deduce a cause-and-effect relationship between two events or variables solely on the basis of an observed association or correlation between them.

I very specifically chose the word correlation because of this. If I had any further information, I would have said it very clearly that alcohol was the reason.

Man, you just cannot get off my back.

 

[kerouac9]

He did turn us down for the interview but his stance on us may have changed now? The reason I believe this is because he's been passed over by multiple teams ever since & he wants to be a head coach. Maybe we get him this time around if KK is let go?

If he didn’t want to work for/with Keim and Michael before, why would he now?

 

[GatorAZ]

Should have canned Keim and promoted Licht

I remember when Tampa fans wanted him gone lol

 

[kerouac9]

I remember when Tampa fans wanted him gone lol

We could have drafted a kicker in the second round who couldn’t put the ball through the uprights

 

[BritCard]

If Bidwill is truly this stupid, this organization is going nowhere, fast.


We have criminally ignored the CB position and the team seems to be praying that spit and baling wire will do the trick.

Keim is a Bidwill sock puppet. He's there to do the boring daily grind while Mikey gets to get involved with the fun stuff without any complaints.

You have to ask what purpose would firing Keim serve for Bidwill? It potentially upsets his life. Right now he has a GM that lets him get involved where he wants without complaint and ultimately I believe that is more important to Mike than consistently winning.

Look at it from Mike's POV. He makes millions every year no matter what. He doesn't have to work a real job. He get's to run a football team without any of the aggro you see between GM and Owner in other organisations, in fact Keim is his buddy, they get to hang out and talk football all day. 31 teams don't win the superbowl every year so why upset the apple cart?

And if he does want to throw Keim under the bus at some point it will only be because he has a ready made sock puppet to replace him from inside the organisation.

And there isn't a large enough hardcore fan base to put pressure on him to make changes in the same way there would be if this happened at the Steelers or Seahawks.

 

[cardpa]

This. At what point will it stop being the coach and Mike will start looking at the guy hiring the coach.

Then he may need to fire the guy in the mirror.

 

[Stout]

Keim is a Bidwill sock puppet. He's there to do the boring daily grind while Mikey gets to get involved with the fun stuff without any complaints.

You have to ask what purpose would firing Keim serve for Bidwill? It potentially upsets his life. Right now he has a GM that lets him get involved where he wants without complaint and ultimately I believe that is more important to Mike than consistently winning.

Look at it from Mike's POV. He makes millions every year no matter what. He doesn't have to work a real job. He get's to run a football team without any of the aggro you see between GM and Owner in other organisations, in fact Keim is his buddy, they get to hang out and talk football all day. 31 teams don't win the superbowl every year so why upset the apple cart?

And if he does want to throw Keim under the bus at some point it will only be because he has a ready made sock puppet to replace him from inside the organisation.

And there isn't a large enough hardcore fan base to put pressure on him to make changes in the same way there would be if this happened at the Steelers or Seahawks.

Then I reiterate, this organization will go nowhere, fast.

 

[Dr. Jones]

You can't fire KK and keep Keim. You just can't, not and claim to have any kind of competence or football acumen as an organization. How many coaches does one lackluster GM get to hire?

I tend to agree but have zero faith in this organization to make a bold move on the GM front. Bidwill has made it clear that family comes first. Graves to Keim and then Keim to ADub. That's my best guess.

We really need a new perspective. And that's from the top down.

 

[BritCard]

Eric Bieniemy of the Chiefs I would take in a heartbeat if KK is fired.

I'd be wary. He's been for several interviews in every hiring round the last 3 years and I've never heard even a sniff of him being in contention. Something is missing there and before anyone says it it's not White skin, at least not for most owners.

Both Flores and Saleh got HC jobs in their first round of interviews.

 

[BritCard]

The 2018 mess rests ENTIRELY on Wilks’s ineptitude as a HC. Keim gave him enough talent for us to be much better than what we ended up being. Playoff good? No! But significantly better than 3-13. There’s a reason why a HC gets fired after one season. It certainly wasn’t because the GM didn’t do his job. Otherwise, Keim would have been fired with him.

I don't know man. So many of that team were out of the league the season after, or soon after that.

These are guys that all played in Wilkes first game or played significant snaps that year. Most started.

Sam Bradford - Lasted 4 games. Never played again.
Nkhemiche - Done
Josh Bynes - Had 1 season at the Ravens then kicked around camps
Bethea - Retired
Bucannon - Never played again
Jamar Taylor - Never played again
Bene Benwikere - Never played again
Rudy Ford - Done
Derrick Coleman - Remember that deaf fullback? Never played again
Gabe Holmes - Never played again
Andre Smith - no comment required
John Wetzel - Barely played since
Ricky Seals Jones - Had 229 yards in 2019 and hasn't played since
JJ Nelson - Hasn't played since
Jacquies Smith - Never played again
Zach Moore - Never played again
Garrison Smith - Never played again
Chad Williams - Never played again
Jermaine Gresham - Never played again
Colby Gossett - Never played again
Jeremy Vujnovich - Never played again
Joe Barksdale - Never played again
Will Holden - Played 2 games since, neither starting.
John Philips - Never played again
Jalen Tolliver - Never played again
Cameron Malveaux - Played 2 games since and is out of the league
Gerald Hodges - Never played again
David Amerson - Never played again
Leonard Johnson - Never played again

And Josh Rosen - never played again

That 2018 Cardinals team is where careers went to die. Possibly one of the worst rosters ever assembled in football.

Plus we had about 65 starting O line combinations that year. The O like was terrible. At one point the starting O line was Korey Cunningham, Colby Gossett, Mason Cole, Oday Aboushi and Joe Barksdale.

Wilks wasn't a good head coach but really he never stood a chance. Nobody could win with that roster and O line with Sam Bradford, Josh Rosen and Mike Glennon at QB.

 

[BritCard]

Then I reiterate, this organization will go nowhere, fast.

Isn't that the history of the Cardinals under the Bidwills?

Let's face it. The 2 most successful periods in recent Cardinals history came because they lucked out on a single hire. First with Kurt Warner, and then Bruce Arians.

 

[daves]

Let's face it. The 2 most successful periods in recent Cardinals history came because they lucked out on a single hire. First with Kurt Warner, and then Bruce Arians.

That's a preposterous take.

...dbs

 

[kerouac9]

And Josh Rosen - never played again

I was working on a similar take. Obviously, Bradford was a huge miss and I'm surprised that Keim's biggest apologists and defenders have just memory-holed what a catastrophic failure of judgement that was. Rosen did play three games for Miami in his second season; he was just really bad. Sometimes you miss on rookie QB; that's actually not as big a deal for me as everything else.

Honestly, Steve Wilks sucked. There are cascading failures that make up a 3-13 team. The ceiling of a team with 2017 Sam Bradford at QB is probably 7 wins. But Keim isn't 100% responsible for that complete disaster inasmuch as the general manager is accountable for the team. It seems like the arrangement of a young HC/experienced coordinator on the other side of the football is an innovation that Keim likes. If that's the case, then he's probably most responsible for choosing total failure Mike McCoy.

IMO, there was talent on the roster to be the usual Very Bad Cardinals team that many here have become accustomed to over the years. Wilks just brought that special blend of incompetence that made it the Worst Cardinals Team Ever.

 

[DVontel]

Knew it was over with Keim when he hired Mike McCoy, aka, the guy that got fired from the same organization twice.

 

[Krangodnzr]

I'd be wary. He's been for several interviews in every hiring round the last 3 years and I've never heard even a sniff of him being in contention. Something is missing there and before anyone says it it's not White skin, at least not for most owners.

Both Flores and Saleh got HC jobs in their first round of interviews.

The Cardinals interviewed Flores and then signed Wilks...Ugh.

 

[Cheesebeef]

The 2018 mess rests ENTIRELY on Wilks’s ineptitude as a HC. Keim gave him enough talent for us to be much better than what we ended up being. Playoff good? No! But significantly better than 3-13. There’s a reason why a HC gets fired after one season. It certainly wasn’t because the GM didn’t do his job. Otherwise, Keim would have been fired with him.

are you kidding?! SAM BRADFORD WAS THE QB. THE OC KEIM PUT IN WAS ONE OF THE WORST IN FOOTBALL AND HASNT BEEN AN OV SINCE. Our big FA additions outside of our Paper Machete WB were one foot in the grave Suggs/Dawson/Bethea. The single decision to get Sam Bradford’s ass held together by bubble gum and duct tape and then have him protected by ANDRE SMITH, the beyond washed up T from Cindy was a fireable offense just on its own.

Wilks was a terrible hire... but almost EVERY MOVE made around that hire was atrocious as well and those were all Keim. That’s why they were all time bad. They stunk at the top and were built on a house of cards below him.

You’re emotional attachment to Keim is bizarre.

 

[BritCard]

I was working on a similar take. Obviously, Bradford was a huge miss and I'm surprised that Keim's biggest apologists and defenders have just memory-holed what a catastrophic failure of judgement that was. Rosen did play three games for Miami in his second season; he was just really bad. Sometimes you miss on rookie QB; that's actually not as big a deal for me as everything else.

Honestly, Steve Wilks sucked. There are cascading failures that make up a 3-13 team. The ceiling of a team with 2017 Sam Bradford at QB is probably 7 wins. But Keim isn't 100% responsible for that complete disaster inasmuch as the general manager is accountable for the team. It seems like the arrangement of a young HC/experienced coordinator on the other side of the football is an innovation that Keim likes. If that's the case, then he's probably most responsible for choosing total failure Mike McCoy.

IMO, there was talent on the roster to be the usual Very Bad Cardinals team that many here have become accustomed to over the years. Wilks just brought that special blend of incompetence that made it the Worst Cardinals Team Ever.

Absolutely, and as the HC Wilks had a hand in building that roster. Guys like Jamar Taylor and Bene Benwikere were his guys.

Still, a massive failure of Keim to look at that roster and think it had any chance of doing anything. In fact, the more I look at it the more I'm surprised it got 3 wins. Could easily have been 0-16.

 

[ASUCHRIS]

Knew it was over with Keim when he hired Mike McCoy, aka, the guy that got fired from the same organization twice.

The rot starts from the top, as usual. Younger Bidwill isn't locking up the Gatorade, but he's not looking much better than pops these days. The Bidwill/Keim show has been stale for years.

 

[Krangodnzr]

are you kidding?! SAM BRADFORD WAS THE QB. THE OC KEIM PUT IN WAS ONE OF THE WORST IN FOOTBALL AND HASNT BEEN AN OV SINCE. Our big FA additions outside of our Paper Machete WB were one foot in the grave Suggs/Dawson/Bethea. The single decision to get Sam Bradford’s ass held together by bubble gum and duct tape and then have him protected by ANDRE SMITH, the beyond washed up T from Cindy was a fireable offense just on its own.

Wilks was a terrible hire... but almost EVERY MOVE made around that hire was atrocious as well and those were all Keim. That’s why they were all time bad. They stunk at the top and were built on a house of cards below him.

You’re emotional attachment to Keim is bizarre.

Keim is lucky he survived that mess and is lucky he didn't get canned when Arians left.

If the Cardinals don't have a winning season this year, I think he has to go. In fact I think WE need to organize a movement to get him fired if the team doesn't have a winning season.

 

[PACardsFan]

I don't know man. So many of that team were out of the league the season after, or soon after that.

These are guys that all played in Wilkes first game or played significant snaps that year. Most started.

Sam Bradford - Lasted 4 games. Never played again.
Nkhemiche - Done
Josh Bynes - Had 1 season at the Ravens then kicked around camps
Bethea - Retired
Bucannon - Never played again
Jamar Taylor - Never played again
Bene Benwikere - Never played again
Rudy Ford - Done
Derrick Coleman - Remember that deaf fullback? Never played again
Gabe Holmes - Never played again
Andre Smith - no comment required
John Wetzel - Barely played since
Ricky Seals Jones - Had 229 yards in 2019 and hasn't played since
JJ Nelson - Hasn't played since
Jacquies Smith - Never played again
Zach Moore - Never played again
Garrison Smith - Never played again
Chad Williams - Never played again
Jermaine Gresham - Never played again
Colby Gossett - Never played again
Jeremy Vujnovich - Never played again
Joe Barksdale - Never played again
Will Holden - Played 2 games since, neither starting.
John Philips - Never played again
Jalen Tolliver - Never played again
Cameron Malveaux - Played 2 games since and is out of the league
Gerald Hodges - Never played again
David Amerson - Never played again
Leonard Johnson - Never played again

And Josh Rosen - never played again

That 2018 Cardinals team is where careers went to die. Possibly one of the worst rosters ever assembled in football.

Plus we had about 65 starting O line combinations that year. The O like was terrible. At one point the starting O line was Korey Cunningham, Colby Gossett, Mason Cole, Oday Aboushi and Joe Barksdale.

Wilks wasn't a good head coach but really he never stood a chance. Nobody could win with that roster and O line with Sam Bradford, Josh Rosen and Mike Glennon at QB.

I disagree. BA would have win 7-8. BA also has to take some blame here also. God knows he convinced upper management to blow our wad his last 2 years here thinking the window was still cracked open. Some of that approach is why he decided to retire at the time. And that’s a joke for another time. The OL was decimated with injuries which led to their many different combinations. Wilks was beyond horrible, which is why he couldn’t even sniff a job in the NFL.

 

[PACardsFan]

are you kidding?! SAM BRADFORD WAS THE QB. THE OC KEIM PUT IN WAS ONE OF THE WORST IN FOOTBALL AND HASNT BEEN AN OV SINCE. Our big FA additions outside of our Paper Machete WB were one foot in the grave Suggs/Dawson/Bethea. The single decision to get Sam Bradford’s ass held together by bubble gum and duct tape and then have him protected by ANDRE SMITH, the beyond washed up T from Cindy was a fireable offense just on its own.

Wilks was a terrible hire... but almost EVERY MOVE made around that hire was atrocious as well and those were all Keim. That’s why they were all time bad. They stunk at the top and were built on a house of cards below him.

You’re emotional attachment to Keim is bizarre.

Disagree. You can go back in hindsight and dissect every bad team and you can try to put the blame on the GM. Had we stayed with Bradford, this team would have been much better than it was under Rosen. We pulled Bradford in a close loss to the Bears. That was a mistake. Bradford may have been close to the end of his career, but he was significantly better to finish this season out. Keim continues to get crapped on for his bad decisions & gets no credit for his good decisions. There have been both. Let’s see how this season plays out before we kiss his butt goodbye. i don’t completely trash him because I‘ve been around a whole lot longer than you have. Keim brought far more success to this franchise than any GM in Cardinal history. He‘s struggled of late, and the NFL is all about what have you done lately. The Cardinals have improved in each of his last 2 years as GM. Can we continue to improve? Time will tell. But, no. I won’t bash him until it’s obvious it’s time too.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I disagree. BA would have win 7-8. BA also has to take some blame here also. God knows he convinced upper management to blow our wad his last 2 years here thinking the window was still cracked open. Some of that approach is why he decided to retire at the time. And that’s a joke for another time. The OL was decimated with injuries which led to their many different combinations. Wilks was beyond horrible, which is why he couldn’t even sniff a job in the NFL.

this is BS also. We did NOT blow our wad in Arians’ last year. We let Calais walk, our best player player on defense walk and then basically brought back the rest of the team that only won 7 games the season before. They didn’t go for Jack squat in that last season Arians season except a snow job to con fans they still had a chance so they’d keep buying tickets.

that was a major failure of an off-season as well where for some ungodly reason we decided that worthless TE was worth 21 million for 3 years who’s biggest impact was getting personal foul penalties instead of paying Calais what he was worth. We also went for a second straight season doing nothing to get someone opposite PP. the offensive line was terrible and we did nothing to add weapons on offense. They punted on Arians last season. I said it as it was going on and it turned out exactly how I expected.

 

[PACardsFan]

this is BS also. We did NOT blow our wad in Arians’ last year. We let Calais walk, our best player player on defense walk and then basically brought back the rest of the team that only won 7 games the season before. They didn’t go for Jack squat in that last season Arians season except a snow job to con fans they still had a chance so they’d keep buying tickets.

that was a major failure of an off-season as well where for some ungodly reason we decided that worthless TE was worth 21 million for 3 years who’s biggest impact was getting personal foul penalties instead of paying Calais what he was worth. We also went for a second straight season doing nothing to get someone opposite PP. the offensive line was terrible and we did nothing to add weapons on offense. They punted on Arians last season. I said it as it was going on and it turned out exactly how I expected.

Your opinion. Not mine. End of story. We’ll see how this season plays out before we condemn Keim to the ash heap. I’ve been around long enough to know he’s the best GM we’ve ever had. Yes, we have a crappy history & that may not mean anything to you. It means something to me.