Zach Allen Signs with Denver

[BritCard]

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[BritCard]

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[Cbus cardsfan]

10m isn't.

15.25m is.

It’s all about the guaranteed money. Which is just over 10.
The other numbers are just window dressing.

 

[BritCard]

It’s all about the guaranteed money. Which is just over 10.
The other numbers are just window dressing.

Its about the cap hit.

 

[Solar7]

Isn’t retaining your good drafted, home grown players building a team correctly through the draft?

I'd argue it's probably best if you re-sign them before they have the potential to hit the open market, like in their third year. But, you have to be able to actually identify that.

Given that Keim had pretty much drafted nothing but trash in the last decade, was replacing our entire roster every year with "Keim time" deals, overpayment, or traded draft picks, what do you expect? It was literally every year for like the past five that we were in the top five of having to replace rostered players/starters.

Zach Allen is a good, improving player, who got paid like he's gonna be a star. I don't see it.

 

[DVontel]

First, none of us have any idea what the Cards offered Allen or why he chose Denver.

We may have offered more per year but Denver offered more guarantees. $32m a year on 3 years is rich and likely more than the Cards could stomach.

Personally I would have just about paid Allen this money but have huge doubts about his ability to anchor the line. This is primo line anchor money and I'm nor sure Allen has shown he's that. I feel like he's a very good complimentary piece.

This is Calais or Dockett type money. Does anyone really see him as that?

Ultimately I don't think this is the "had to" move some make out. It's a coin flip for me. That's a lot of money for a team that's obviously rebuilding for a guy that's not certainly a premium guy.

I feel like Zach is more a Shelby Harris than a Kenny Clark. And this isn't Shelby money.

Ultimately this money is a gamble and Cards aren't in a gambling position.

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Called it.

 

[Stout]

Seemed inevitable. We are building for the 2024 season. Not only will they not pay their own players top money this offseason, I don't think we'll pay any free agents significant money as well.

What do we have, 11 picks right now in the draft? I see them clearing the way to play all the rookies for development. They'll focus on getting Kyler healthy and then we'll have a ton of cap space to go spend next offseason. Just a prediction.

Unless we hit a home run, and I mean an absolute grand slam, in the draft, we're now building for the 2025 season. There is nothing left on this roster, or soon will be nothing left. It was bare bones before, and we just lost one of those bones.

 

[Stout]

Just stating that I'd like to see this team build correctly through the draft. It's been a long time since we really beefed up the O Line and D Line in the early rds of the draft. In fact, I don't think Keim spent a 1st or 2nd rd pick on those positions over the last 5 years.

Drafting Allen and then signing him to a second contract IS (or would have been) building correctly through the draft. Sheesh! Unless you think, what, you should only keep your top drafted players for a few years then move on? I thought we'd gotten rid of Keim lol

 

[Stout]

Yeah, the excuses are so pathetic at this point. The NFL is a results business, and losing Zach Allen is a big L for Monti.

HUGE L for Monti. Right outta the gate, I'm disappointed in him. Yeah, he inherited a crap situation and a crap roster, but he knew that going in and took on the tough job. So far, so fail.

 

[Stout]

They also have more roster holes than almost any team.

They now have another gaping roster hole. Yay!

 

[BritCard]

Drafting Allen and then signing him to a second contract IS (or would have been) building correctly through the draft. Sheesh! Unless you think, what, you should only keep your top drafted players for a few years then move on? I thought we'd gotten rid of Keim lol

You don't think he got overpaid? A lot of analyst guys think it was an overpay.

I like Allen but I really don't get people talking about him like he's prime Geno Atkins or Calais Campbell. Calais has been better than Allen the last few years at 34 to 36 than Allen has been at 23 to 25.

Allen is far closer to a Nick Fairley or Matthew Ioannidis than he is to the top DT's. In fact Matthew Ioannidis through his first 4 years craps all over Allen statistically. And Ioannidis first vet contract in 2019 was for 3 years and $21.75m. He was also "ascending" for whatever that is worth. In his 4th year he had 8.5 sacks, 16 QB Hits, 11 TFL's and 64 tackles and he got those stats on less than half the snaps Allen plays.

I get why people think this is a big loss, because Allen was an otherwise bright spark on a dog **** roster but stand back and look at him from an NFL perspective and he's an average DT/DE and this is a lot of money for him.

I don't think it's the L people are making out. I can understand why the Cards didn't want to pay that, especially in the situation they are in.

 

[Minski]

HUGE L for Monti. Right outta the gate, I'm disappointed in him. Yeah, he inherited a crap situation and a crap roster, but he knew that going in and took on the tough job. So far, so fail.

Why? Allen was a decent to good player. He isn't a great player and couldn't stay healthy. I would have wanted him back but not at the price he got, Denver way overpaid

 

[Stout]

Why? Allen was a decent to good player. He isn't a great player and couldn't stay healthy. I would have wanted him back but not at the price he got, Denver way overpaid

Ah yes, you and Brit and others with the predictable company response. Way overpaid? lol no. There were reports he could've gotten more. I'd have paid him this; some think we might've offered more and he declined. Either way, losing your good, young, drafted players is a recipe for being a sewage organization with a lousy roster and tons of roster turnover. Yay us!

 

[BritCard]

Ah yes, you and Brit and others with the predictable company response. Way overpaid? lol no. There were reports he could've gotten more. I'd have paid him this; some think we might've offered more and he declined. Either way, losing your good, young, drafted players is a recipe for being a sewage organization with a lousy roster and tons of roster turnover. Yay us!

Pack it in Stout with the "company response" crap just because we see it different to you.

Explain to me the difference between Zach Allen and say, Larry Ogunjobi?

Apart from Ogunjobi starting his career a year older and Ogunjobi never making more than $8m per year (just last year).

Ogunjobi is far closer to Allen's ceiling than any top DT you can name in the last 10 years. I don't see him even being a Malik Jackson.

 

[BritCard]

FWIW had we signed him at this money I would have said "Meh, ok, not great but glad he stays" but I can also see why they would walk away at this price. It's a 50/50 call for me.

 

[Sparky16]

Seemed inevitable. We are building for the 2024 season. Not only will they not pay their own players top money this offseason, I don't think we'll pay any free agents significant money as well.

What do we have, 11 picks right now in the draft? I see them clearing the way to play all the rookies for development. They'll focus on getting Kyler healthy and then we'll have a ton of cap space to go spend next offseason. Just a prediction.

I hope Kyler plays by the trade deadline so they can move him, ship him to Dallas if Prescott fails again. This team is going to be utter trash next year. ZA was one of the only guys i liked to watch play and he is the 1st one out the door.... pathetic

 

[Dayman]

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Rosenthal is a fan of the deal.

 

[BritCard]

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Rosenthal is a fan of the deal.

How does Rosenthal think this is like Hargraves deal?

Hargrave was a monster nose tackle for the Steelers that was a beast vs the run and also got sacks. He was a consistent 80+ PFF guy if I'm allowed to use their name.

Zach Allen is a below average run stopper with 1 year of a PFF grade over 58. Last year when he had 71.

They aren't close at the same age and Allen is getting basically the same money Hargrave did adjusted for cap inflation.

 

[schutd]

Imagine thinking to yourself “maybe we’re trying to emulate the jets” and feeling good about it.

Imagine.

Im officially OUT of choppers and k9s "imagine" club. Y'all need a new shtick.

 

[Stout]

Pack it in Stout with the "company response" crap just because we see it different to you.

Explain to me the difference between Zach Allen and say, Larry Ogunjobi?

Apart from Ogunjobi starting his career a year older and Ogunjobi never making more than $8m per year (just last year).

Ogunjobi is far closer to Allen's ceiling than any top DT you can name in the last 10 years. I don't see him even being a Malik Jackson.

Oh my. Really? That's where you're hanging your hat?

He went for less than what you're predicting, and suddenly you lowered what you think we should have paid for him. Quelle surprise!

 

[PJ1]

Seriously getting difficult to give a crap about supporting the Cardinals organization. Downright pitiful that they didn't retain Allen. As has been stated, the club should have gotten a deal done prior to letting Allen get to free agency!

For those justifying not retaining him by thinking Allen wasn't worth the money he got, because you're focused on sack numbers don't understand what Allen's role was and how significant his play was for the team last season. He was not a rush DE, and yet his sack numbers weren't bad though. Gambo was talking about Allen being 2nd behind Aaron Donald for run stops as an interior DL (or it might have been run stops per snaps played; but something like that).

Exactly. Hard to put this on new regime. Should have been extended a year ago. When they get to FA you likely have lost them.

 

[TJ]

lol. Imagine going directly to excuse-making for Michael’s second choice for the role.


We have top 10 cap space right now. The price will only go up next year. Cap space isn’t going to rush the passer in 2023.

In a 3-4 scheme, Cap Space is good for at least 12 sacks.

 

[PACardsFan]

TBF Monti was just a little bit better QB play from going to the Super Bowl 2 of the last 4 years. He's just going to have a different perspective.

If Keim made the same moves/non moves obviously I would be upset. However, now that we're free of that anchor cant we at least wait till after the draft to judge Monti? If the offseason overall is bad sure he deserves blame. Lets let it play out fully first. Cant let our frustrations with Keim bleed over onto Monti.

Allen was a good player who seemed to be improving each year, but Monti has been clear about what will drive his decisions. Attitude & HEALTH. And Allen, for whatever reasons being, just couldn’t stay on the field. I would have loved to have him, but it’s no surprise to me that Monti wasn’t going to invest half our $$ on a guy with a questionable ability to stay on the field. The same will probably apply to Murphy also, but we’ll see.

 

[PACardsFan]

49ers signed Javon Hargrave for $21 million a year, Seahawks signed Dre'Mont Jones for $17 million a year. We let Zach Allen walk for $15 million. All I can say is that I hope this is part of a plan. It's tough to watch our divisional opponents get better while we get worse.

Our divisional foes are in a much different situation than us, and yes, this is part of a plan.

 

[SoonerLou]

KEIM

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