Suns sign Tyus Jones

[Covert Rain]

I sure hope you're wrong on your last point. I am still convinced that the KD trade was the dumbest move, by far, this organization has ever made. I don't want to re-hash the KD trade but if Ish can't stop from doing crap like that in the future, we're all going to wither and die on the fan vine.

I think Matt has done a great job since the KD trade and I'm impressed with what they brought in last year (even though it largely failed) and I've again been impressed by the additions this season. Maybe the new additions will fail just like last year's edition but I'm okay with that as long as he and his people learn from their mistakes.

It's who Isbia is. It's what his businesses do. He is a win at all costs kind of owner. If the KD trade doesn't work out it has no bearing on other risky moves he might make IMO. That doesn't mean it will lead to a carbon copy move the KD trade. However, it will mean he will take risks. I would rather have an owner with deep pockets pulling out all the stops when he can verses all of the other approaches that have led to 55 years of no title.

 

[Mainstreet]

It's who Isbia is. It's what his businesses do. He is a win at all costs kind of owner. If the KD trade doesn't work out it has no bearing on other risky moves he might make IMO. That doesn't mean it will lead to a carbon copy move the KD trade. However, it will mean he will take risks. I would rather have an owner with deep pockets pulling out all the stops when he can verses all of the other approaches that have led to 55 years of no title.

I think Mat Ishbia has a learning curve. Being an NBA owner is a new experience and he is a good businessman.

My thoughts are he wanted to make a big splash in his first year as an NBA owner, which resulted in the Kevin Durant trade. He already understands the consequences of not getting under the second tax apron when it comes to future draft picks. He wants to run a first class organization.

 

[JCSunsfan]

I

I sure hope you're wrong on your last point. I am still convinced that the KD trade was the dumbest move, by far, this organization has ever made. I don't want to re-hash the KD trade but if Ish can't stop from doing crap like that in the future, we're all going to wither and die on the fan vine.

I think Matt has done a great job since the KD trade and I'm impressed with what they brought in last year (even though it largely failed) and I've again been impressed by the additions this season. Maybe the new additions will fail just like last year's edition but I'm okay with that as long as he and his people learn from their mistakes.

The Durant trade is not even close to the dumbest move the org has made. Dennis Johnson, giving up picks to trade Gugliotta, and so many more would be worse than this. The bottom line is that if the Durant trade produces one championship, it will be worth it. Big IF

 

[AzStevenCal]

I

The Durant trade is not even close to the dumbest move the org has made. Dennis Johnson, giving up picks to trade Gugliotta, and so many more would be worse than this. The bottom line is that if the Durant trade produces one championship, it will be worth it. Big IF

Obviously, I disagree. Yes using picks to trade Googs was a bad call but DJ wasn't happy here. JM never knew how to use him and we were in desperate need of a big man. The DJ trade would have been fine if it had been for Kevin instead of Rick. We got fleeced; for some reason Robey was talked about as interchangable with Kevin, we soon learned how ridiculous that comparison was (something I'm sure everyone in Boston was already well aware of).

And if I were going to nominate a non-KD Suns move for worst one ever, it would be the Kurt Thomas decision or really, any of the Sarver decisions that were solely based on saving a little money. As much as I despise the KD trade, it's almost worth it if you consider Sarver out/Ishbia in as part of the deal.

 

[ASUCHRIS]

Letting Joe Johnson walk over 5M? Trading a pick that could have been Iggy or Deng?

 

[Cheesebeef]

Letting Joe Johnson walk over 5M? Trading a pick that could have been Iggy or Deng?

The freaking Penny Hardaway trade?!?

 

[Mainstreet]

Letting Joe Johnson walk over 5M? Trading a pick that could have been Iggy or Deng?

Using two first round picks to trade Kurt Thomas is still a head shaker, along with not extending Joe Johnson and so much more.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Using two first round picks to trade Kurt Thomas is still a head shaker, along with not extending Joe Johnson and so much more.

The Kurt Thomas decision was one of our worst moments. But as bad as the JJ trade was for us, I think you can make the case that even though it was driven by money, it was also a basketball decision. And you can't really say that with the Kurt trade or the selling of picks - that was just Sarver being Sarver.

 

[ASUCHRIS]

The freaking Penny Hardaway trade?!?

Meh, not signing Joe Johnson was much worse for me. I can see why they took a swing at Penny, and they didn't give up much to get him. Manning was done, and we had Googs/Uncle Spliffy/Rodney Rogers already, and Garrity didn't turn into anything.

 

[Covert Rain]

I

The Durant trade is not even close to the dumbest move the org has made. Dennis Johnson, giving up picks to trade Gugliotta, and so many more would be worse than this. The bottom line is that if the Durant trade produces one championship, it will be worth it. Big IF

I had not thought of this but the Penny trade, letting Joe Walk, breaking apart the Barkley team so fast. I think I could name a number of dumber moves the franchise has made. I have a hard time calling a team that "goes for it all" (even if it doesn't work out) the dumbest move.

 

[Phrazbit]

I

The Durant trade is not even close to the dumbest move the org has made. Dennis Johnson, giving up picks to trade Gugliotta, and so many more would be worse than this. The bottom line is that if the Durant trade produces one championship, it will be worth it. Big IF

The Durant trade has potential to not merely be the Suns worst deal, but it could go down as one of the worst in the history of the league.

If we win a title it won’t be, but that’s a huge “if”.

 

[Covert Rain]

The Durant trade has potential to not merely be the Suns worst deal, but it could go down as one of the worst in the history of the league.

If we win a title it won’t be, but that’s a huge “if”.

No. It has no chance of that. Not of being the worst in the league. If Durant didn't play like he did last season and even has a decent season this year? No chance. For it to be the worst in the league it would have to be one of those deals in sports where you give someone the house and they never play for you for whatever reason or play horribly. KD was one of the best players in the entire league last year even though it didn't result in a title.

 

[Phrazbit]

No. It has no chance of that. Not of being the worst in the league. If Durant didn't play like he did last season and even has a decent season this year? No chance. For it to be the worst in the league it would have to be one of those deals in sports where you give someone the house and they never play for you for whatever reason or play horribly. KD was one of the best players in the entire league last year even though it didn't result in a title.

I’d say that from 27-30 we have very high odds of being a bottom 5 team each season, and in none of those years will we control our own pick.

That would be a historically bad trade. Only the Nets/Boston deal involving Garnett and Pierce would compare.

 

[Chaplin]

The Durant trade has potential to not merely be the Suns worst deal, but it could go down as one of the worst in the history of the league.

If we win a title it won’t be, but that’s a huge “if”.

My god the hyperbole is strong here.

 

[Covert Rain]

I’d say that from 27-30 we have very high odds of being a bottom 5 team each season, and in none of those years will we control our own pick.

That would be a historically bad trade. Only the Nets/Boston deal involving Garnett and Pierce would compare.

That still doesn't make it the worst trade ever. Not even close. Also, I count draft day trades as well. He performed as one of the best players in the league for this team. No trade where that happens can be considered the worst in history.

 

[Phrazbit]

That still doesn't make it the worst trade ever. Not even close. Also, I count draft day trades as well. He performed as one of the best players in the league for this team. No trade where that happens can be considered the worst in history.

The Nets got a couple decent years out of the dudes Boston sent them, made the playoffs a few times... and that trade is, easily, worst trade in the last 30 years.

If we end up sending out 4 years of high lotto picks (along with having sent off Bridges and Cam Johnson), and all we get in return is a few years of Durant putting up stats on a non-contender... then yeah, it would absolutely be an all-time disaster of a trade.

 

[Chaplin]

The Nets got a couple decent years out of the dudes Boston sent them, made the playoffs a few times... and that trade is, easily, worst trade in the last 30 years.

If we end up sending out 4 years of high lotto picks (along with having sent off Bridges and Cam Johnson), and all we get in return is a few years of Durant putting up stats on a non-contender... then yeah, it would absolutely be an all-time disaster of a trade.

Um, if those draft picks all end up end of the round burnouts, then how can you say that? I mean, Mikal isn't even with Brooklyn anymore and he was the centerpiece.

Whatever, I shouldn't be wasting my breath.

 

[Covert Rain]

The Nets got a couple decent years out of the dudes Boston sent them, made the playoffs a few times... and that trade is, easily, worst trade in the last 30 years.

If we end up sending out 4 years of high lotto picks (along with having sent off Bridges and Cam Johnson), and all we get in return is a few years of Durant putting up stats on a non-contender... then yeah, it would absolutely be an all-time disaster of a trade.

None of those picks may turn into anything. After the first 3 picks in the draft statistically it's a major crapshoot. Bridges came down to earth, traded. Cam is toiling. None of those picks or players will produce a Top 5 NBA player in any given season.

Way over the top hyperbole.

 

[AzStevenCal]

That still doesn't make it the worst trade ever. Not even close. Also, I count draft day trades as well. He performed as one of the best players in the league for this team. No trade where that happens can be considered the worst in history.

Get back to me when we know what the damage really is, right now we're still hoping to win it all but that trade could impact this franchise for another decade or so. If KD stays upright and plays out most of his contract, we'll be in decent shape as we go forward but his history suggests that won't happen.

 

[Phrazbit]

Um, if those draft picks all end up end of the round burnouts, then how can you say that? I mean, Mikal isn't even with Brooklyn anymore and he was the centerpiece.

Whatever, I shouldn't be wasting my breath.

None of those picks may turn into anything. After the first 3 picks in the draft statistically it's a major crapshoot. Bridges came down to earth, traded. Cam is toiling. None of those picks or players will produce a Top 5 NBA player in any given season.

Way over the top hyperbole.

Again, this exact scenario already played out with Boston, there is president, this is not hyperbole.

Boston got Tatum and Brown from the picks the nets gave them.

 

[AzStevenCal]

My god the hyperbole is strong here.

I don't believe you're using that word correctly. We're just on the other side of an argument. Maybe we'll turn out to be wrong, maybe it will turn out that we've overreacted but I don't believe any of us have intentionally exaggerated the potential fallout from that trade.

I truly believe it was the dumbest decision this franchise has made since it's onset and could easily become the worst decision made by any NBA franchise. Having Ishbia gives me some hope that we will find a way to make it all work and keep from having to pay too steep a price for that trade but we'll have to see how that pans out.

 

[Chaplin]

I don't believe you're using that word correctly. We're just on the other side of an argument. Maybe we'll turn out to be wrong, maybe it will turn out that we've overreacted but I don't believe any of us have intentionally exaggerated the potential fallout from that trade.

I truly believe it was the dumbest decision this franchise has made since it's onset and could easily become the worst decision made by any NBA franchise. Having Ishbia gives me some hope that we will find a way to make it all work and keep from having to pay too steep a price for that trade but we'll have to see how that pans out.

He said it could be the worst trade in history. How is that not hyperbole? Could be a disappointment, sure, if we don't win a title, but it's not like KD is averaging 10 and 4. He had superstar numbers, and is still a top 10 player in the league.

 

[Covert Rain]

Again, this exact scenario already played out with Boston, there is president, this is not hyperbole.

Boston got Tatum and Brown from the picks the nets gave them.

People win the lottery too. Doesn't mean the scenario is likely or the "norm". Statistically it's extremely unlikely.

 

[Phrazbit]

He said it could be the worst trade in history. How is that not hyperbole? Could be a disappointment, sure, if we don't win a title, but it's not like KD is averaging 10 and 4. He had superstar numbers, and is still a top 10 player in the league.

If we’re in the year 2030, in the middle of our third or fourth straight year as a bottom five team, and we’re sending out yet another top pick the Nets… I don’t think looking back on Durant averaging 27 a game for a couple seasons on a non-contender will cheer us up.

 

[Phrazbit]

People win the lottery too. Doesn't mean the scenario is likely or the "norm". Statistically it's extremely unlikely.

Not remotely comparable.

The odds of us winning a title are very small, the odds of us being really, really bad towards the end of the decade are very high. That is the math here to put this in play for being an all-time disaster trade.