It All Starts with Murray

Harry

ASFN Consultant and Senior Writer
Joined
Jan 7, 2003
Posts
12,406
Reaction score
27,228
Location
Orlando, FL
Any assessment of what needs to happen in anticipation of next season starts with Kyler Murray. Until that puzzle is solved I can’t see the Cards competing for the playoffs, let alone winning any games if they get there. Now 2 regimes have endorsed Murray and had the chance to develop him. I’ll discuss Gannon’s endorsement of Murray in the next post. I believe the idea that getting some phenomenal QB whisperer who will fix this issue is illusionary. That said, 2025 will possibly be Murray’s last chance at QB with the Cards. Cutting Murray in 2025 would save less than $3 mil cap space and cause $40 mil+ in dead money. That would greatly hinder the rebuild. A 6/1 cut in 2026 is manageable. Also a trade, while somewhat cap limiting, is also possible at that point. Murray should be told the reality of his position. Improving in 2025 is not optional.

Before further discussing the future it makes sense to examine how we got here. Kingsbury was anointed coach (no winning history marked him as worthy). He wanted Murray; his dream QB. Murray came in with more accolades than Caesar. He and Kingsbury formed something of a partnership rather than a coach/player relationship. Instead of holding Murray accountable for all the routine things he didn’t do, Kingsbury complimented him on what he could do. I recall it actually being said Murray didn’t need a great Oline because he could just elude the rushers. Of course, when several of those rushers proved to be almost as fast as he was, this plan failed gloriously.

Also Murray’s passing technique was flawed. Keep in mind he is truly a superior athlete. In college could win even with flaws, though the playoffs might have sounded a warning. He constantly threw off his back foot. That was eventually corrected, but it took so long that the process was another warning sign. Murray and Kingsbury loved the shotgun formation so that was virtually all that was used. Rollouts weren’t often planned as Murray was always on the run. Another concern was running out of bounds rather than throwing the ball away, yet another long correction process ensued. Maybe Murray was always contact shy (before the NFL he rarely experienced it). Perhaps under Kingsbury he got beat up so much he just became adverse to contact. In any case he now lacks composure.

As far as 2025 is concerned, some things can be fixed; others can’t. I don’t think you can fix Murray’s mind. As mentioned he has trouble with composure. He simply panics. Then he makes idiotic passing attempts. This cannot, in my opinion, be fixed with an attitude adjustment. The only way to fix this is to minimize the number of times Murray finds himself pressured to the point of panic. This means a better offensive line and using more rollouts, which according to statistics favor Murray’s passing skills anyway. Keeping in an RB more often would help. Nothing will completely stop the crazy throws when he’s overwhelmed by the pressure. Avoidance of pressure is the preferred strategy.

Sadly Murray has still more issues. His panic causes him to almost always throw to the primary receiver, even when that receiver is covered. Whether Murray likes it or not, insistence on using progressions is critical. Plus, there is a possibility that he doesn’t see the entire field. One of the ways to combat this is to run multiple routes on the same side; just at different levels. That way he has at least two options easily visualized. Adding a speedy receiver should create more open receivers and take advantage of Murray’s strong arm. I do not subscribe to the theory that his arm strength has declined.

Murray’s panic also causes him to release balls before the receiver is in their best leverage position. This is a big problem when throwing to Harrison. Closely related, there’s the issue of ball placement. Murray typically doesn’t throw receivers open. He also enables defenders to prevent completions by throwing the ball where the defender can reach it. Additionally one of the things height-challenged Brees mastered was shifting in the pocket to open throwing lanes. Murray continues regularly to get passes knocked down because he seemingly thinks he can throw passes through defender’s arms. Finally, when have you ever seen Murray take a hit to make a completion? If he’s truly that fragile he should have picked baseball. He needs to be tougher. Likewise Cards’ coaches need to stop treating him as marked “fragile.” They don’t need to run him continuously. They do need to run him often enough to make the run threat credible. That will slow the rush and reduce his panic.

Murray might be the best athlete to play QB for the Cards. If somehow he could get fixed from the neck up, he could still be a dominant QB. As it stands they can win with him, but must understand his limitations. The offense must be structured to compensate for these issues. A linemen capable of providing unit leadership is needed. Add a dominant defense and they can contend even for the big prize. Murray needs a top line and a greatly improved WR corps. I don’t see them working on developing Tune, so a veteran backup would make sense, especially if Murray’s going to run. Someone like Justin Fields might also threaten Murray. Part of this dump Kyler concept ignores who replaces him. Drafting mid-round is not ideal for QB acquisition. Fields may be the best FA fit, but is he a sure thing to be better? Getting even a “good” QB is a crapshoot. Getting a Sam Darnold result is rare. Are you willing to spend big money on a previous failed QB or try a never successful guy like Trey Lance?

Overall I’m clearly not excited about the 2025 edition of Murray. Taking pass rushing pressure off him while turning up the pressure to improve his skill set are the objectives I seek.

Going forward I anticipate providing a series of article anticipating how the Cards need to change.
 

BullheadCardFan

Go for it
Supporting Member
Joined
Sep 5, 2005
Posts
64,286
Reaction score
30,549
Location
Bullhead City, AZ
It's sad really that we are where we are

We as fans have invested so much time and loyalty to see our star QB regress with no explanations

As he goes, the team goes

It always seems to be something else like build the line, improve the WR room, etc

Time to look in mirror and see that he has been exposed for who he is and will not be

Time to move on IMO
 

82CardsGrad

7 x 70
Joined
Dec 31, 2004
Posts
36,284
Reaction score
8,309
Location
Scottsdale
You’re more optimistic than I am Harry.
I firmly believe that as long as Kyler remains the QB of this team, they will never have a shot at reaching the “Big Prize,” let alone winning it. Heck, with him at QB I think winning just one playoff game is likely out of reach.
Why? Because, though ridiculously physically gifted, Murray is not a leader of men.
We can all agree the QB position has changed in many ways over the recent years, however, it is the one position that still 100% requires the highest level of leadership skills of any other position on the team. And Kyler is anything but a leader.

A leader inspires others to greatness. He raises the level of play in others above what a player might’ve thought possible.
A leader thinks of himself less. He paves the way when it comes to the “how” and the “why” thru his actions (not just his words).
A leader rallies the team to success, particularly when all the chips are down and when everything suggests failure.
A leader overcomes obstacles and finds a way, tapping into the heart of fellow players, to achieve success.

A leader doesn’t sit alone on the bench, sulking and pouting when a game has turned in unfavorable ways, because a leader instinctively knows that mere non-verbals can impact the mindset of his team.

Kyler lacks the heart and soul and want-to in order to be a leader at the NFL level.
Thus, no matter the changes made by Monti, next season will be yet another up and down but ultimately disappointing season. And this team will have no other choice but to jettison Kyler come 2026.
 

az jam

ASFN Icon
Joined
Mar 6, 2004
Posts
13,006
Reaction score
5,266
Location
Scottsdale, AZ
Whew, lots of stuff there to think about. We have had Kyler for 6 years now and at best we have had minimum success and just one playoff which was a disaster. Teams have won Super Bowls with average qbs but those teams had outstanding defenses and in most cases very good running attacks. It is hard to be optimistic on our future. I think that Monti, Gannon and Kyler will all be on the hot seat in 2025. If there is another collapse, Bidwill will blow it up again and I would agree with him.
 

Stout

Hold onto the ball, Murray!
Joined
Dec 30, 2002
Posts
40,152
Reaction score
24,647
Location
Pittsburgh, PA--Enemy territory!
That's a damning (and accurate) indictment of KM. Maybe if he didn't keep daddy as his QB coach and dedicated himself to actually getting better at the mental aspect of the game in full and fixing his mechanics in full--like what Josh Allen did--he could've fixed his issues. He's never done that and, I'm sorry, but he's out of chances. There's no "Year 7 will be his last year" BS with this guy. He's cooked. I'd be a lot more sympathetic to him if he tried everything he could do but just didn't have it in him, but it is crystal clear that this has not been the case. I want him gone.
 

krazy2k

All Star
Joined
Jun 22, 2023
Posts
559
Reaction score
598
Location
Tucson, AZ
For everyone who wants K1 gone...who will be the 2025 Cardinals QB?
Does it really matter? Unless the defense is shored up via the draft (and just getting healthy) and the running game can stay healthy and potent for a whole season (which requires OL and RB health), basically any quarterback the Cards send out there will get a similar result to this year or last year. KM is old news and getting older by the day. For contract reasons only, he may be the QB in 2025, but that will be his last season as a Cardinal before he shrinks to obscurity as a backup somewhere.
 

BurqueCardFan

Hall of Famer
Joined
Aug 17, 2006
Posts
1,874
Reaction score
1,919
Location
Albuquerque, NM
You’re more optimistic than I am Harry.
I firmly believe that as long as Kyler remains the QB of this team, they will never have a shot at reaching the “Big Prize,” let alone winning it. Heck, with him at QB I think winning just one playoff game is likely out of reach.
Why? Because, though ridiculously physically gifted, Murray is not a leader of men.
We can all agree the QB position has changed in many ways over the recent years, however, it is the one position that still 100% requires the highest level of leadership skills of any other position on the team. And Kyler is anything but a leader.

A leader inspires others to greatness. He raises the level of play in others above what a player might’ve thought possible.
A leader thinks of himself less. He paves the way when it comes to the “how” and the “why” thru his actions (not just his words).
A leader rallies the team to success, particularly when all the chips are down and when everything suggests failure.
A leader overcomes obstacles and finds a way, tapping into the heart of fellow players, to achieve success.

A leader doesn’t sit alone on the bench, sulking and pouting when a game has turned in unfavorable ways, because a leader instinctively knows that mere non-verbals can impact the mindset of his team.

Kyler lacks the heart and soul and want-to in order to be a leader at the NFL level.
Thus, no matter the changes made by Monti, next season will be yet another up and down but ultimately disappointing season. And this team will have no other choice but to jettison Kyler come 2026.
I agree. I have come to this same conclusion. Watching the Panthers game solidified this for me. Towards the end of regulation, all we saw was a pouty Kyler at the end of the bench hiding under his helmet. Even when we tied the game to go to overtime, no emotion or hyping up his teammates. Guys like Burrow, Mahomes and Allen (even Russel Wilson) are usually hyping guys up, encouraging the OL. Not sure I’ve seen that with Kyler.
 

BritCard

ASFN Icon
Joined
Jan 10, 2020
Posts
22,843
Reaction score
41,752
Location
UK
We often talk about Kyler's pocket issues. These can never be fixed IMO, they are a feature of his size.

If a pocket collapses on a 6' 4" QB that guy can still see field until they are on his toes. If it collapses on Kyler he's done if it gets within 3 yards and so he has to bail.

Remember being a kid in a crowd? You can't see crap, while your parents are fine.
 

82CardsGrad

7 x 70
Joined
Dec 31, 2004
Posts
36,284
Reaction score
8,309
Location
Scottsdale
Guys like Burrow, Mahomes and Allen (even Russel Wilson) are usually hyping guys up, encouraging the OL. Not sure I’ve seen that with Kyler.
Add Purdy, Goff, Geno, Winston, Mayfield, Hurts, Stroud, Darnold, Love, Daniels… they all demonstrate leadership traits Kyler never even thinks about, let alone puts on display.
 
OP
OP
Harry

Harry

ASFN Consultant and Senior Writer
Joined
Jan 7, 2003
Posts
12,406
Reaction score
27,228
Location
Orlando, FL
That's a damning (and accurate) indictment of KM. Maybe if he didn't keep daddy as his QB coach and dedicated himself to actually getting better at the mental aspect of the game in full and fixing his mechanics in full--like what Josh Allen did--he could've fixed his issues. He's never done that and, I'm sorry, but he's out of chances. There's no "Year 7 will be his last year" BS with this guy. He's cooked. I'd be a lot more sympathetic to him if he tried everything he could do but just didn't have it in him, but it is crystal clear that this has not been the case. I want him gone.
Taking on a loss $40 mil in cap space would dramatically comprise potential 2024-25 free agent signings.
 

DVontel

ASFN Icon
Joined
Jan 28, 2015
Posts
13,315
Reaction score
23,945
I’ll also add Russ and Herbert… all of these QB’s demonstrate leadership skills that far - FAR exceed anything Kyler has ever shown.
All those guys you named sans maybe two of them are outright better QBs than Kyler because they show it on the field with their quality of play. Aaron Rodgers was/is a known jackass, but that didn’t stop him from being the best QB in the league for a long time at one point. I don’t care about the “rallying the troops” rah rah. I care about you producing on the field, which Kyler isn’t & hasn’t consistently for a long time. It has nothing to do with leadership traits. It has all of it do with quality of play on the field.
 

82CardsGrad

7 x 70
Joined
Dec 31, 2004
Posts
36,284
Reaction score
8,309
Location
Scottsdale
All those guys you named sans maybe two of them are outright better QBs than Kyler because they show it on the field with their quality of play. Aaron Rodgers was/is a known jackass, but that didn’t stop him from being the best QB in the league for a long time at one point. I don’t care about the “rallying the troops” rah rah. I care about you producing on the field, which Kyler isn’t & hasn’t consistently for a long time. It has nothing to do with leadership traits. It has all of it do with quality of play on the field.
I have no more words for you… :oops:
 

Proximo

ASFN Icon
Joined
Mar 8, 2015
Posts
12,833
Reaction score
10,803
Taking on a loss $40 mil in cap space would dramatically comprise potential 2024-25 free agent signings.
If it means we can tank next year and have a shot at a top QB in the next draft that might actually be a good strategy. A good QB prospect is worth at least 80 million in cap space.

But I know the franchise will not intentionally tank.
 

Latest posts

Members online

Forum statistics

Threads
556,466
Posts
5,436,038
Members
6,330
Latest member
Trainwreck20
Top