It All Starts with Murray

[82CardsGrad]

I’m not sure if you know what leadership skills are.

Care to educate me as to the leadership skills I’m somehow blind to in Kyler?

 

[imaCafan]

The Cards have let so many players leave (DHop, Kirk, Campbell and Allen to name a few) that instead of building they are always replacing, usually with inferior talent to those who left. Always “rebuilding” and never just building.

 

[BullheadCardFan]

ima laugh my hippie ass off if kyler balls a out against the lambs and whiners - it would be so us to win these two meaningless games

Cardinalesque

 

[TheCardFan]

To go back to an oldie but goodie, "I'd trade him for a six pack of beer, and it doesn't even have to be cold."

Addition by subtraction.

Need a name(s) - what is the plan?

Who is available that you would want?

 

[WeBlitz]

Care to educate me as to the leadership skills I’m somehow blind to in Kyler?

I don’t think DVontel is saying Kyler has “leadership skills” or whatever, but I do think he’s saying it doesn’t really matter in the thick of things if he’s not producing on the field. You’re way too focused on just Kyler.

You listed Jameis Winston as one of those players with “leadership skills”. Does his leadership skills really matter if he’s going throwing 3 Pick-6s per game? Does it matter if he’s fumbling the ball? It should not. I’m stunned myself you included him in that list. Talk about the world’s greatest PR spin.

We just wanted Kyler to be a consistently good Quarterback first and foremost. He clearly is not. Get the ball from Point A to Point B. You’re too focused on his “leadership skills” and not him being an actual good QB.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

Very good post Harry.
Murray will be Monti's biggest conundrum. Like you said, he's good enough to get you some wins but he's to panicky and can't win from the pocket to get you over the top. The problem is who is out there that can. The frustrating thing is you see guys like Jayden Daniels and Bo Nix come in as rooks at lead their teams, that had very low expectations, to the playoffs. Then you have top drafted retreads like Baker and Donald also taking their teams to playoffs. I think another problem is that the Cards have never brought in a legit QB backup that could push Murray because it seems his ego is too fragile and they didn't want to threaten him. I mean c'mon, Tune, Hundley, Ritter, etc. are not guys that are probably even below average league backups.

Murray definitely has cache and trade value. Sants and Titans come to mind as trade partners. But I agree, we will probably be having this same conversation at this time next year because Murray will be given another year to disappoint.

If I had my druthers, I'd take with my chances with a Winston, at least as a backup option, or see if a change of scenery could work wonders for Trevor Lawrence like it did with the aforementioned retread products.

 

[82CardsGrad]

I don’t think DVontel is saying Kyler has “leadership skills” or whatever, but I do think he’s saying it doesn’t really matter in the thick of things if he’s not producing on the field. You’re way too focused on just Kyler.

You listed Jameis Winston as one of those players with “leadership skills”. Does his leadership skills really matter if he’s going throwing 3 Pick-6s per game? Does it matter if he’s fumbling the ball? It should not. I’m stunned myself you included him in that list. Talk about the world’s greatest PR spin.

We just wanted Kyler to be a consistently good Quarterback first and foremost. He clearly is not. Get the ball from Point A to Point B. You’re too focused on his “leadership skills” and not him being an actual good QB.

Oh, you likely haven’t seen the multitude of other posts of mine… trust me, I have often noted ALL of the other fatal flaws in Kyler’s game.
My perspective is that even if he somehow, miraculously fixed many of the other shortcomings, him being entirely void of any shred of leadership ability will always prevent him from being a top-tier QB.

As for Winston, I have no doubt that if Jameis was just a tick more capable as a QB, because of his leadership qualities he would far surpass Kyler…

 

[Stout]

Need a name(s) - what is the plan?

Who is available that you would want?

Right. We're back to "You're not allowed to want a replacement for X unless you can name the exact replacement" nonsense. I don't need to have a ready-made answer for a replacement for next year BEFORE THE SEASON IS EVEN OVER to know Kyler needs to go. So no, we're not doing that "it's not valid if you can't name a replacement" jackassery.

How about Monti needs to do his damn job, get rid of Kyler, and find an adequate replacement. It's not easy to do, but that's why he has one of 32 NFL GM jobs. The question you should be asking is "Can Monti do his job?"

 

[WeBlitz]

My perspective is that even if he somehow, miraculously fixed many of the other shortcomings, him being entirely void of any shred of leadership ability will always prevent him from being a top-tier QB.

As for Winston, I have no doubt that if Jameis was just a tick more capable as a QB, because of his leadership qualities he would far surpass Kyler…

Again, I don’t believe you know what “leadership skills/qualities” even is because you have yet to explain. It’s like you’re just saying it just to say it like you’re trying to fill a status quo. Jameis will probably be on his 4th team real soon. His so-called leadership qualities have gotten him bounced around the league.

 

[Stout]

Again, I don’t believe you know what “leadership skills/qualities” even is because you have yet to explain. It’s like you’re just saying it just to say it like you’re trying to fill a status quo. Jameis will probably be on his 4th team real soon. His so-called leadership qualities have gotten him bounced around the league.

His pick sixes have gotten him bounced around the league. He's trying to talk about leadership qualities only, not talent/play, and his point is that Kyler has about as much leadership ability on the football field as Eeyore.

 

[WeBlitz]

His pick sixes have gotten him bounced around the league. He's trying to talk about leadership qualities only, not talent/play, and his point is that Kyler has about as much leadership ability on the football field as Eeyore.

I know what he’s talking about. What has been preached to him is that it shouldn’t matter. As a teammate, I wouldn’t care about a QB trying to rally the guys when he is not doing his part by helping the other team score with Pick-6s.

I care about my Quarterback being good on the football field. I personally don’t care about the rah-rahs.

 

[Crimson Warrior]

and his point is that Kyler has about as much leadership ability on the football field as Eeyore.

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In 2025, Kyler Murray is going to prove you dead wrong my friend!

Yes I know I'm crazy for still believing in K1, but it wouldn't be any fun this offseason without one coo coo bird still hyping our QB1 would it?

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

You don't have to be a rah-rah guy to be a team leader.

One of the biggest problems, at least to me, is when things are going great, Murray loves the credit. When things are not working out, like on an INT, he usually pointing fingers at intended target.

 

[Stout]

I know what he’s talking about. What has been preached to him is that it shouldn’t matter. As a teammate, I wouldn’t care about a QB trying to rally the guys when he is not doing his part by helping the other team score with Pick-6s.

I care about my Quarterback being good on the football field. I personally don’t care about the rah-rahs.

How about sucking on the field AND sucking at the rah-rah. That's a deadly combination. At least someone who can lead (which, by the way, doesn't need to be in a 'rah-rah' way) can motivate their teammates to do better. A guy like Kyler saps motivation from his teammates.

 

[Stout]

You don't have to be a rah-rah guy to be a team leader.

Borg (because I was already typing my post when you posted yours).

 

[WeBlitz]

How about sucking on the field AND sucking at the rah-rah. That's a deadly combination. At least someone who can lead (which, by the way, doesn't need to be in a 'rah-rah' way) can motivate their teammates to do better. A guy like Kyler saps motivation from his teammates.

You lead by playing good football. You motivate your teammates by playing good football. Kyler has not been playing good football. That’s really it.

If Kyler played like a Josh Allen or Lamar Jackson on the field, none of the other stuff wouldn’t matter. I’m positive of that.

 

[82CardsGrad]

I know what he’s talking about. What has been preached to him is that it shouldn’t matter. As a teammate, I wouldn’t care about a QB trying to rally the guys when he is not doing his part by helping the other team score with Pick-6s.

I care about my Quarterback being good on the football field. I personally don’t care about the rah-rahs.

You’re more optimistic than I am Harry.
I firmly believe that as long as Kyler remains the QB of this team, they will never have a shot at reaching the “Big Prize,” let alone winning it. Heck, with him at QB I think winning just one playoff game is likely out of reach.
Why? Because, though ridiculously physically gifted, Murray is not a leader of men.
We can all agree the QB position has changed in many ways over the recent years, however, it is the one position that still 100% requires the highest level of leadership skills of any other position on the team. And Kyler is anything but a leader.

A leader inspires others to greatness. He raises the level of play in others above what a player might’ve thought possible.
A leader thinks of himself less. He paves the way when it comes to the “how” and the “why” thru his actions (not just his words).
A leader rallies the team to success, particularly when all the chips are down and when everything suggests failure.
A leader overcomes obstacles and finds a way, tapping into the heart of fellow players, to achieve success.

A leader doesn’t sit alone on the bench, sulking and pouting when a game has turned in unfavorable ways, because a leader instinctively knows that mere non-verbals can impact the mindset of his team.

Kyler lacks the heart and soul and want-to in order to be a leader at the NFL level.
Thus, no matter the changes made by Monti, next season will be yet another up and down but ultimately disappointing season. And this team will have no other choice but to jettison Kyler come 2026.

No… you don’t know what I’m talking about, as my first post in this thread illustrates.

 

[82CardsGrad]

You lead by playing good football. You motivate your teammates by playing good football. Kyler has not been playing good football. That’s really it.

If Kyler played like a Josh Allen or Lamar Jackson on the field, none of the other stuff wouldn’t matter. I’m positive of that.

So merely playing “good football” is what? Leadership?
And you’re preaching to me that I don’t understand leadership? LMAO.

Kyler played “good football” several times in his NFL career. One stretch where it led to a playoff birth. And what happened?
Leadership, among many other attributes, creates the possibility for other players to emerge and contribute. If those other players don’t see a leader at the helm, they are much less likely to follow that leader in ways that raise their level of play and perhaps surpass what even they believed they were capable of doing.
Maybe you don’t see the QB position as the most important leadership position on a football team, as I can’t reconcile your comments any other way…

 

[WeBlitz]

No… you don’t know what I’m talking about, as my first post in this thread illustrates.

My apologies. I did not see your first post. That’s on me.

However, all of those qualities you named, is just a factor of Kyler not being a good QB. Whether it’s physical or mental, he just doesn’t have it. What you said, I just think it’s Friday Night Lights cinema fluff. The only way you can truly be a good leader is playing good football.

 

[WeBlitz]

So merely playing “good football” is what? Leadership?
And you’re preaching to me that I don’t understand leadership? LMAO.

Kyler played “good football” several times in his NFL career. One stretch where it led to a playoff birth. And what happened?
Leadership, among many other attributes, creates the possibility for other players to emerge and contribute. If those other players don’t see a leader at the helm, they are much less likely to follow that leader in ways that raise their level of play and perhaps surpass what even they believed they were capable of doing.
Maybe you don’t see the QB position as the most important leadership position on a football team, as I can’t reconcile your comments any other way…

Stop the Friday Night Lights cinema-fluff.

I doubt you have ever seen, in any sport, a terrible player being a good leader.

Because they don’t exist. That athlete isn’t taken seriously otherwise.

If you play good/great football, your teammates will follow.

 

[Proximo]

You lead by playing good football. You motivate your teammates by playing good football. Kyler has not been playing good football. That’s really it.

If Kyler played like a Josh Allen or Lamar Jackson on the field, none of the other stuff wouldn’t matter. I’m positive of that.

Yeah, but I think at this point we know he isn't going to - at least not in a meaningful game.

 

[DVontel]

82 stopped getting taken seriously when he included Jameis Winston in that list considering Jameis does none of those things he qualified.

 

[WeBlitz]

Yeah, but I think at this point we know he isn't going to - at least not in a meaningful game.

Oh, don’t get me wrong, I’m ready to move off of Kyler and have been for a bit. He’s just an inconsistent/mediocre QB. If we can move off of him during the off-season, I’m all for it.

I’m just saying 82 has been watching too much Friday Night Lights. Kyler isn’t a bad QB because of “leadership qualities” or whatever, Kyler is a bad QB because he can’t produce on the field. That’s on him.

 

[82CardsGrad]

My apologies. I did not see your first post. That’s on me.

However, all of those qualities you named, is just a factor of Kyler not being a good QB. Whether it’s physical or mental, he just doesn’t have it. What you said, I just think it’s Friday Night Lights cinema fluff. The only way you can truly be a good leader is playing good football.

Have you ever played football at a high school or college level?
Have you ever led large teams in a professional setting? Be honest.

 

[82CardsGrad]

Stop the Friday Night Lights cinema-fluff.

I doubt you have ever seen, in any sport, a terrible player being a good leader.

Because they don’t exist. That athlete isn’t taken seriously otherwise.

If you play good/great football, your teammates will follow.

I’ve never stated Kyler is “terrible.” Hell, the dude got a second contract and got seriously PAID. How “terrible” can he be?

In my opinion, given his draft status and his second contract, he clearly isn’t terrible. So why then isn’t he more consistently good? Why can’t he lead his team to more success? And please don’t hit me with the reruns of excuses many others here always trot out to explain away Kyler’s failures…