2011 NBA FINALS: Dallas Mavericks Vs Miami Heat

Arizona's Finest

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Yeah, maybe after these Finals the stupid James-Jordan comparisons will finally taper off. It's obvious that LBJ is the 2nd best player on his own team. It speaks volumes that in the biggest game of the year the ball was taken out of his hands and put into Wade's down the stretch.

Uck so frustrating. IT IS ONE SERIES. Lebron literally carried them through the playoffs against much better teams in Boston and Chicago and now "its obvious he is the second best player on his team" Yeah real f***** obvious.

Jeff Van Gundy - who knows more about basketball combined then everyone who has posted in this thread - said in Game 2 "Lebron is the best player in the league" then Wade started to go off and said "this is ridiculous, Wade is amazing and hes the 2ND BEST PLAYER ON HIS TEAM" Its not even debatable that individually Lebron is viewed by people who actually watch basketball day in and day out as the best player in the league or the first guy you would take if you were building a team. Thats GMs, Thats announcers, thats players. Thats everyone.

Who has won the League MVP twice? Lebron. Who has more first team NBA's? Thats Lebron too. And in fact Wade didn't even make FIRST TEAM NBA this year. Who was the most coveted FA in basketball this past offseason? Oh that was Lebron too. And Wade was also a free agent. But who was the big prize team fell over themselves for? Thats Lebron.

Yes Wade has a title. Yes he has a Finals MVP. He also played with 2006 Shaq who took all the attention of Dallas and allowed a relatively unheralded at the time Wade to become who he is.

If you thinks it OBVIOUS that Lebron is the second best player on his team, then thats you and the rest of the bias Lebron detractors in this thread or nation waide. Anyone who actually, you know, gets paid to make basketball decisions or analyze basketball, or plays basketball doesn't agree with you. Those guys aren't fan boys and get emotional and make judgements based on who they think a players are in their free time or because "i just don't like him" or make up a bunch of convuluted excuses to devalue LBJ as a ball player.

And this isn't to devalue Wade as a player. IMO he is the 2nd or 3rd best player in the entire league. Thats why this Heat team is so devastating.

On any given night no matter who is playing, he is capapable of being the best player on the floor. Like tonight. He could have played against Jordan's Bulls tonight and had a better game then MJ too. Does that make him OBVIOUSLY the better player? Nope.

But making comments like that just removes all doubt about either a) your bias against Lebron or b) your knowledge of the NBA as a whole.

Its okay to have a dissenting opinion. Its not okay to back it up on the basis of 1 or 2 games and make all encompassing comments that as i just broke down, make no sense at all.

Damn - I don't even like Lebron THAT much - but the ignorance of this thread is just to over the top for me not to go to bat for him.
 

O

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Aizona's Finest, LBJ may be the best BB player on the planet.
As a human being, he's a punk!
 
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Arizona's Finest

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Exactly. A much better argument is Wade v. James. Yet, Wade is never compared to Jordan, but James is. LBJ is so overrated, it's not even funny.

Lebron is actually a more physcially imposing and better scoring Magic Johnson IMO. And that will be his legacy.

Fans and media manufacture this "Next MJ" crap. Lebron has a long way to go before achieving Micheals greatness. So does everyother player that has suited up in the NBA.

Not sure Lebron is looking to be the next Jordan. Thats in your head and maybe some fans and media's head. Otherwise he wouldn't have gone to Miami. He just wants to win titles.

And if he wins 5 or 6 rings, even with Wade playing a big part in every single ring, I'm sure he'll be just fine with that.

And I'm not sure he'll care if you think he was as good as Michael.
 

Arizona's Finest

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Aizona's Finest, LBJ may be the best BB player on the planet.
As a human being, he's a punk!

LOL O I just don't agree man. But its all good. At least you recognize how good he is.
 

Arizona's Finest

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I like lebron james. He is a likeable guy at the end of the day the way I see it. he just made some dumb choices and has to deal with the aftermath like a man and I think he will.

THIS

You are the most sensible person in this thread and ironically you are the only true Mavs fan. Props to you and your takes throughout this thread.

No wheres Greensboro Hill and what does he think? :)
 

O

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LOL O I just don't agree man. But its all good. At least you recognize how good he is.

Good with the bad brother.

You should recognize it also.

Which out weighs the other?

Human being or BB player?

Personally, I'll go with human being. The rest will follow.
 

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ROFL because I need to be one of those to be able to tell. Maybe YOU do, but not me...but fwiw I did take a high school, and a couple of college classes, as well as a full minor in human communications. I don't want to float my own boat, but NOTHING IN THIS WORLD fazes me mentally. NOTHING. I can learn anything. Do I know everything, hell no, but alot, and anything I don't, I can learn NO PROBLEM. Back to psychology, since I learned so much in those classes (A's), I've been able to branch off and watch what they mean for the past decade and a half, pick other stuff along the way, I'm a big reader of stuff, and can spot out many things. It also helps when you ACTUALLY LEARN and RETAIN what the A grade corresponds to. Doesn't mean I know everything in psych, hell no, but it doesn't take a rocket scientist, to see a nero, especially with how EASY LeNERO makes it with HIS actions, put on FULL DISPLAY, to the world. He has a nero complex, it's sad you do not see it. Blaming me because YOU can't see it, does not mean I'm wrong because I'm not a professional at it. That's called sophistry, look it up. (also don't forget...everything is psychology now...the markets, business, it's theories, etc)

So you're saying you want a cookie for using big terms, big phrases, and dragged out responses? Or that you got A's in your psych/comm courses?

Envy? ROFL. You couldn't give me 100 million dollars to live his life. It's pathetic, any poor man is richer than him in almost every conceivable way. I can't believe you'd project envy...rofl like I envy to be ANYBODY but MYSELF. Go play 'insert idiot comment' with somebody else because those words/ideals would never come out of my mouth/be thought in my head.

Let's see who the one with the envy is. Would it be the one who uses calm, collected, factually based arguments? Or the one who cannot stop slandering and falsely psychoanalyzing someone he's never met in his/her entire life? If I did "word count" on how many times you've said, "LeNero," it probably exceeds 15. That's a conservative estimate.


What I say does describes to a degree most athletes, but LeNero is in a ****** class by himself. Seriously. A type personality? That has NOTHING, absolutely NOTHING to do with it. Does he really have A type when he needs to go to SOMEONE ELSE'S TEAM..where THAT PERSON IS THE LEADER. It's sad that on 'his team', he isn't even the leader. He defers to Wade EVERY CHANCE HE GETS. I see it every time I watch him. A REAL 'a' type would want to work and get it themselves. I think I even lip read him like, 'you all can stay in and finish this game' during this series. Yeah.

Now he's a ******?? Your Lebron analysis is very mature :sarcasm:

And for as many times I've seen LeBron defer to Wade, I've seen Wade defer to LeBron. See, that's the great thing about basketball, it's a team sport. The problem Miami had at the beginning was developing chemistry seeing as not only did LeBron and Bosh come, but the entire roster was virtually turned over.

You have some very weird projection issues, maybe YOU'D step into his shoes, but I sure in the hell wouldn't. Fame, glory, and money, don't mean much to me, because they are all worthless in the grand scheme of things...and NO ONE 'needs' a million dollars. Maybe a business needs it. But a person? No. You need food, shelter, clothes, and a few more things, and you can get all of that for under a million.

I'd have to think about that one. I live a very good life, but I'd be curious to see what goes through the mind first-hand of a person of elite status. And who wouldn't want more money than they already have? If you've ever a) asked for a raise at your work b) gambled or c) invested money, then you've made a conscious effort to enhance your self-worth. Food, water and shelter are the bare necessities, but being that you feel the need to respond to my post with what appears to be a dissertation, self-gratification is on that short list of necessities for you.

He didn't step on my toes, I actually liked him as a player, always thought he was a dip small brained idiot, but I didn't 'hate' him UNTIL, and this is many years since I was watching him in high school on tv, UNTIL, it all came to a head and I couldn't ignore the fact that he is a complete scumbag Nero with the way he left clevelend, his whole 'take his talents to south beach' episodes, etc, etc. He forced that issue upon me, and I made a correct judgement.

He forced it upon you? So, he called you and said, "listen [insert your name], I am 'taking my talents to South Beach,' and I blame you even though you really have no vested interest?"

Sorry boss, you made the conscious decision to hate him yourself. And you are on an unfortunately long list of people who hate him simply "because." (one word that sums up your entire post).

Best for his career? Because anything one chooses is the best for their career, if they choose it? Only AFTER THE FACT can you say that...and we aren't there yet. He took the scumbag, easy route, and his career was FINE in Cleveland. A better opportunity in Miami? No, the appearance of grass is greener, 'wall-street' style 'fixed', easier time from his perspective, where he can club all night and lay around on 'south beach' all day opportunity (he's rich and there is a long offseason so....he doesn't need to live there, to club there or anywhere) . Then on top of that, he did it in such a scumbag fashion....holding meetings, doing it on an espn special. You can't lead a horse to water, and people blinded by idiocy, cannot be lead to the truth. Don't apologize for the *******, by defending him, by saying I'm being unreasonable, because it simply doesn't hold water.

Miami was a better opportunity. And I can sum it up in two words: Pat Riley. This man has orchestrated multiple championship and finals teams with the Lakers, Knicks and Heat. The slicked hair, Armani suit wearing genius has a knack for bringing in talent and creating competitive teams, even when he hands the reigns to a former intern video editor for the team.

Waste away in cleveland? You must be joking. They bent over backwards and signed those people to those contracts FOR LEBRON. What a foolish perspective. You don't even realize that. So WHEN it happens in MIAMI, expect the same scumbag to rear his head again. LeNero...it's all about HIM. You'll see. Even if they win now, it still will never satiate LeNero. Hell you can see the 'crazy' in his eyes at times. Oh also forgot, he did make it the Finals in that 'waste away' city and is still how young? He had plenty of 'time' to win.

So bringing in an aged, beat up Shaq, past his prime Jamison, and brick shooting Larry Hughes were great moves to bring in winners? This is all while not re-signing Carlos Boozer and making a more aggressive effort to get Amare. It's not a foolish perspective, but rather foolish to think that Dan Gilbert and co. were competent enough to bring players to Cleveland. James waited 7 years and carried a team on his own, yet it wasnt enough. All of the legends in the past: Magic, MJ, Shaq, Bird, etc, needed sidekicks. Anderson Varejeo was no Pippen or McHale and Mo Williams was vastly overrated. In short, it was Lebron and a bunch of role players. That's it.

Besides, he can have his money, it won't be worth squat soon, so we'll be equal on that note....ha ha ha. Glass-Steagall (like I've been saying for YEARS!!!!!)

Histrionics, much?
Rooting for a rival? Are the Suns involved? Didn't think so. I generally go for Western Conference usually (like pac-10, or even UofA [because of AZ]), and seeing how there is Terry, Marion, Kidd, and I've always liked dirk as a player, I'll root for him, instead of the great Nero where scumbagging is a way of life. I understand nuance, because life is NEVER black and white.

But you going way out of your way to root against the guy and wish failure upon him makes you look like the scumbag and megalomaniac.

So, because he is in the spotlight, he gets more cover? Sorry, I make the right decisions when the camera ISN'T on, but somehow LeNero can't make the right decisions, even WHEN the cameras ARE? But somehow we can apologize and give leeway to him, just like every other thing wrong in this country, because the camera somehow makes it harder to make the right decision? It makes it easier fwiw, he just didn't care....NERO. I could do a thesis about that one (wrong with country), but it would get too P and R for this discussion.

How do you know he didnt care? Or is that what you want to believe? See the consistency in my response? You are trying so hard to make one look like a megalomaniac, but in the process, you are acting like a spoiled brat yourself, which is basically what you are trying to sell me on about LeBron's personality. Your argument is counter-intuitive at best.

LeBron didn't take a paycut, but since people love listening and believing bs, you can keep telling yourself. Remember, NO state income TAXES in MIAMI = more take home, for less. Plus bigger endorsement opportunities, new jersey sales, but regardless, until the hyperinflation/hyperdeflation hit, he is fine with ANY amount of money, and it's just more needless numbers in his account, which again is a sign of NERO....because they 'mean' so much to him. It's about prestige, more than 'feeding his family'. I love people that use bunk metrics akin to the BLS.

So, MJ should have never signed the largest one-year contract in the history of professional sports because that would be a sign of being a "Nero?" Wow, dude. You just summed up all professional athletes in one post.

Michael Jordan's personality is NOTHING like LeNero's. You say LeNero is like this or that, but again what LeNERO did set a horrible precedent, that NONE of these guys would ever do, and quite frankly many came out and bashed him for doing it. If he WAS such a competitor, he wouldn't of gone to Miami. It's also why even if he is on the best teams rigged style in Miami, another city after this contract, so on and so forth, this idiot will NEVER match jordan, because he doesn't have the heart and will in his whole body that Jordan had in his nut hair.

So do you think that after getting pummeled for years by the Pistons and Celtics, MJ would have stayed without Pippen, Horace and Phil Jackson coming to town? Honest question.

But it's all about rings, right? So much so that he did what he did....NERO anyone? Sure in a vacuum, you want to win, but so much so to his ego that he needed to screw everyone else like he did in the fashion he did? Your arguments are completely apologetic to someone who doesn't deserve it. Because his goal is to be able to talk with the 'greats' and out do them, yet he's never won one yet? What makes him think he'll ever be in that circle...given that he's never won one yet. NERO.

How is my opinion apologetic? It's a simple emotionless assessment of the guy. I dont particularly care if he fails or succeeds. It doesn't dictate how my day goes. But the real issue is your obsession for him failing. It's kind of sickening.

I wish against him, because I'm sick and tired of losers with loser mindsets rigging the game and screwing everything up. Like LeNero, like wall street, like our fraudulent debt based imperial monetary system...and everything involved with it....which happens to be everything...even leading to both the NBA and NFL labor troubles. LeNero is a microcosm of what's wrong in this world. So yeah, when I see people who actually deserve to win, let alone going against this idiot, which compared to LeNero is everybody else...not to mention Bosh is a 'follower' as well, I will root against such losers....and do so proudly and emphatically.

Hmm.....so we've come all this way calling LeBron a "Nero" and I find this "Nero-type" statement. I would start going back and deleting your posts, because you have just made a hypocrite out of yourself.

To summarize, you hate him for something you have little to no vested interest in, think that the Glass-Steagal act is going to bring him to your level, and will cheer against him so loud and proud for the rest of his career.

I think we found our true Nero, "NeroFans88" ;)
 

Arizona's Finest

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Good with the bad brother.

You should recognize it also.

Which out weighs the other?

Human being or BB player?

Personally, I'll go with human being. The rest will follow.

This is a much deeper conversation but I'll give you the cliff notes.

A) I don't think Lebron is a bad guy at all. Kobe is a prick. MJ was a prick. AI was a thug. Tmac was a lazy POS. I don't see Lebron in any of those categories. He has been a good dude his whole career, always a team guy, and always said the right thing. He made some mistakes last offseason and even apologized for it. So I don't agree with the premise.

B) But even more importantly..... I don't pretend I know these guys and base my opinion on them based on what I percive them to be. Like at all. All what you are getting from the media that is shaping your perceptions of who these players "are" is manufactured by PR teams and on camera faces. I thought Kobe was a "good guy" prior to the rape allegations and the Shaq fiasco. Then all this bad stuff started pouring in on the guy. MJ was thought to be a great guy but if you dig deeper he was a complete cornholio whom everyone close to him had bad feelings towards (i.e. Pippen, his other teammates, his wife) Tiger Woods was supposedly a good guy. I don't know that Kurt Warner is as great as he seems to be, nor Luis Gonzalez or Steve Nash. Everything seems like that but I don't know these people personally. So I have taken my perception of them as people out of the picture completely. Its why I don't get upset when I hear about all these athletes transgression and only look at the transgressions through the spectrum of how they effect the team as a whole. I watch sports for entertainment, not because im looking for someone to baby sit my baby girl or be a moral role model for me. I know I am in the minority on that, but thats just me.

C) So all I judge is what I see. I don't like Lebron any more as avplayer because I think he seems to be a "good guy". I just think the reasons most people think he is a "bad guy" are baseless and not found in reality. Its all emotion for the most part. So I am going to say something, when someone brings it up.
 
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Gee!

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Good with the bad brother.

You should recognize it also.

Which out weighs the other?

Human being or BB player?

Personally, I'll go with human being. The rest will follow.

Oh come on.. You act like the guy raped someone..

You must be registered for see images attach


;)
 

TJ

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Exactly. A much better argument is Wade v. James. Yet, Wade is never compared to Jordan, but James is. LBJ is so overrated, it's not even funny.

I disagree. James v. Wade is won almost every single time by LeBron. He is much more versatile and better in almost every facet in the game.

If you are comparing LeBron to MJ at the moment, then yes he's overrated.

But the man, even with the talent surrounding him, put up MVP numbers. As a matter of fact, Wade does not lead the Heat in any major offensive or defensive statistical category for the regular season. LeBron leads in points, assists, and steals per game.
 

O

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This is a much deeper conversation but I'll give you the cliff notes.

A) I don't think Lebron is a bad guy at all. Kobe is a prick. MJ was a prick. AI was a thug. Tmac was a lazy POS. I don't see Lebron in any of those categories. He has been a good dude his whole career, always a team guy, and always said the right thing. He made some mistakes last offseason and even apologized for it. So I don't agree with the premise.

B) But even more importantly..... I don't pretend I know these guys and base my opinion on them based on what I percive them to be. Like at all. All what you are getting from the media that is shaping your perceptions of who these players "are" is manufactured by PR teams and on camera faces. I thought Kobe was a "good guy" prior to the rape allegations and the Shaq fiasco. Then all this bad stuff started pouring in on the guy. MJ was thought to be a great guy but if you dig deeper he was a complete cornholio whom everyone close to him had bad feelings towards (i.e. Pippen, his other teammates, his wife) Tiger Woods was supposedly a good guy. I don't know that Kurt Warner is as great as he seems to be, nor Luis Gonzalez or Steve Nash. Everything seems like that but I don't know these people personally. So I have taken my perception of them as people out of the picture completely. Its why I don't get upset when I hear about all these athletes transgression and only look at the transgressions through the spectrum of how they effect the team as a whole. I watch sports for entertainment, not because im looking for someone to baby sit my baby girl or be a moral role model for me. I know I am in the minority on that, but thats just me.

C) So all I judge is what I see. I don't like Lebron any more as avplayer because I think he seems to be a "good guy". I just think the reasons most people think he is a "bad guy" are baseless and not found in reality. Its all emotion for the most part. So I am going to say something, when someone brings it up.



Root for the player, it's easy right?
Good for you.

Yeah, all the bad things from players in the past make you feel comfortable about your latest worship?

There is more to a man then a championship.


Bow down to your king.
 

TJ

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Good with the bad brother.

You should recognize it also.

Which out weighs the other?

Human being or BB player?

Personally, I'll go with human being. The rest will follow.

As a human, I don't think he's all that bad. He is very charitable and loved by all of his teammates (even in his return to Cleveland, the Cavs players were trying so hard not to socialize with him to the point where Byron Scott had to scold the team). Even in the misguided "The Decision" show, he gave all proceeds to the Boys and Girls club of Akron.

Being a bad human being (or in this case, team member) to me is committing felonious acts, throwing teammates under the bus and bad mouthing the public. None of which I've seen him do.

Calling him a poor human being goes with the long list of questionable hatred comments. If the worst thing the guy ever does is go on television to announce where he is signing, then he isn't so bad after all.
 

Cheesebeef

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As a human, I don't think he's all that bad. He is very charitable and loved by all of his teammates (even in his return to Cleveland, the Cavs players were trying so hard not to socialize with him to the point where Byron Scott had to scold the team). Even in the misguided "The Decision" show, he gave all proceeds to the Boys and Girls club of Akron.

Being a bad human being (or in this case, team member) to me is committing felonious acts, throwing teammates under the bus and bad mouthing the public. None of which I've seen him do.

Calling him a poor human being goes with the long list of questionable hatred comments. If the worst thing the guy ever does is go on television to announce where he is signing, then he isn't so bad after all.

agreed. I think LBJ is a moron, but he's not a bad person.
 

Arizona's Finest

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As a human, I don't think he's all that bad. He is very charitable and loved by all of his teammates (even in his return to Cleveland, the Cavs players were trying so hard not to socialize with him to the point where Byron Scott had to scold the team). Even in the misguided "The Decision" show, he gave all proceeds to the Boys and Girls club of Akron.

Being a bad human being (or in this case, team member) to me is committing felonious acts, throwing teammates under the bus and bad mouthing the public. None of which I've seen him do.

Calling him a poor human being goes with the long list of questionable hatred comments. If the worst thing the guy ever does is go on television to announce where he is signing, then he isn't so bad after all.

:thumbup:
 

Arizona's Finest

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Root for the player, it's easy right?
Good for you.

Yeah, all the bad things from players in the past make you feel comfortable about your latest worship?

There is more to a man then a championship.


Bow down to your king.

You been drinking my man? This is a THE SMEL type post if I ever saw one.

All thats missing is "THE lebreen is rated 85 on a scale of 86 based on his passing smartness and jumper."

Not even sure what point your trying to make but I don't worship Lebron, I just thinks hes pretty damn good.
 

ajcardfan

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Its okay to have a dissenting opinion. Its not okay to back it up on the basis of 1 or 2 games and make all encompassing comments that as i just broke down, make no sense at all.

Damn - I don't even like Lebron THAT much - but the ignorance of this thread is just to over the top for me not to go to bat for him.

I've watched the NBA probably for as long as you have. (Since 1976.) I know LBJ probably has as much physical talent as anyone, ever. But, he's not as mentally tough IMHO as a lot of the greatest of great NBA players such as JORDAN. And, as I often thought during the regular season, when the game was on the line, I personally, would put the ball in Wade's hands. They kept giving it to James and we all know how they struggled in those close games during the season. When that is the case, you are not the best player on the team. IMHO.

It wasn't I, but Scottie Pippen and others, who had the audacity to compare James and Jordan just recently.

FWIW, I do think James is going to go down as one of the all time greats. I think more reasonable comparisons to the top 50 players AT THIS POINT in his career, would be Clyde Drexler or Dr. J. Both great players, two of my all time favorites, but not nearly in the realm of Jordan, just like James isn't.
 

Arizona's Finest

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Actually, it's not funny.

You are right its not.

Using a term like "raped" with its imagery, connotations, and what it really means to many many people actually affected by this sadistic crime is probably not a good idea when referring to a sport and some dude deciding he wanted to play elsewhere.

I stand corrected.
 

Arizona's Finest

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I've watched the NBA probably for as long as you have. (Since 1976.) I know LBJ probably has as much physical talent as anyone, ever. But, he's not as mentally tough IMHO as a lot of the greatest of great NBA players such as JORDAN. And, as I often thought during the regular season, when the game was on the line, I personally, would put the ball in Wade's hands. They kept giving it to James and we all know how they struggled in those close games during the season. When that is the case, you are not the best player on the team. IMHO.

Man the Lebron not being clutch thing is a total myth. In Cleveland he hit a gross 3 to win a playoff game 2 years back that was epic (im forgetting the team cuz its late) and he also scored the last 22 points of a playoff game against the Pistons not long ago either.

Just this playoffs he closed out the Bulls and celtics with 10 point dtreaks to end the game, as well as clutch shooting in every other game. Prior to this last game where he admitedlly had a poor game he was dominating every clutch situation.

I talked about this in another thread but the late game issues this regular season were being suffered by Wade too and was more because they were learning how to handle end of game situations as a team, when Bosh, LBJ, and Wade had all be the go to guy previously.

But the figured it out in the playoffs. Let Lebron take over. Wade is playing great in the Finals so far and yes better then Lebron, but I am guessing the reason for that is the focus of the Dallas game plan is Lebron with their best defender (Marion) being assigned to him.

FWIW, I do think James is going to go down as one of the all time greats. I think more reasonable comparisons to the top 50 players AT THIS POINT in his career, would be Clyde Drexler or Dr. J. Both great players, two of my all time favorites, but not nearly in the realm of Jordan, just like James isn't.

This I agree with. I don't think we should compare anyone to MJ until their careers are finished. I don't think you will find anyone who thinks Lebron in 2011 is better then MJ throughout the course of his career.

And he likely won't be by the end of his career either. But if I am betting, I think its safe to say he AT LEAST is projected to be a top 10 player with a chance to be Top 3 and if things break really right, maybe even better then MJ.

I know thats sacreligious to say but its a possibility. Just like it is for Kobe.

But lets allow him get one ring first before even starting that discussion :)
 
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Covert Rain

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Great game. Wade is the bigger superstar on this team IMO...so far. There is no doubt whose team this is IMO. Wade to me just has that something that LeBron is missing.
 
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elindholm

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The best comparison for James, so far, is Shaquille O'Neal. Both have (or had) physical gifts that put them in a completely different category from the rest of the elite athletes in the NBA. Both have gregarious personalities, but also deep insecurities that rear their heads at inopportune times. Both were sensations upon entering the league, and each had a forgettable Finals appearance early in his career before leaving his original team for brighter lights. Both are questionable with the game on the line: James because he has a tendency to settle for long jumpers and then brick them, and O'Neal because there was always the danger that the other team would make him shoot free throws.

O'Neal wound up with four titles. Each time, he needed to be paired with a quieter, yet more serious superstar teammate (Bryant, Wade) who could do the real work while O'Neal lapped up the media attention. As we know, O'Neal never did the little things to develop his overall game to the point of being commensurate with his physical gifts, but his talent alone was enough to make him a dominant player. He eventually wore out the welcome of the most serious fans of every team he graced with his presence, because while there was no denying his production and results, one could also tell that something was missing. And yet, no one would deny O'Neal his place in the discussion of the "top (small number) players of all time."

And so it is with James. As long as he has someone like Wade to steer the ship for him, he can contribute the highlights and the big numbers and strut around like everything begins and ends with him. And he'll be great, and we'll acknowledge it -- and yet only a few will truly admire what he accomplished in his career, because the rest of us won't be able to shake the thought of how much more he could have done.
 
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